ds91776 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Well, we all know that for the 2009 model year the Fusion will get a 500/Taurus style mid-cycle update. Word is it will recieve a new front end (possibly not sheetmetal but at least new bumers), a new dash (possibly with different radio and temp cotrols) and a new engine line-up. 1. Personally I hope they keep a version of the vertical headlamps on the Fusion. It is the only car in its class that has vertical headlamps, giving it a distinctive look that really stands out from the crowd. It will also give it a different character from the 08 Taurus and the 2010 Taurus. 2. The interior is already pretty strong, especially on the SEL. They need to raise the central airvents so they can raise the radio, clock, and air/temp controls to be slightly better ergonomically. While the dash materials are good (identical to the great materials inside my Mom's 06 Mazda 6) the center console's materials need improvement, I imagine the update will fix this. Also, i think their should be another accent finish material available on the SE and for the SEL with the tan interior. I love the tan but the fake wood doesn't look as good on it as it does on the 500/Taurus. The best thing would be to include better rear headrests (adjustable) in the rear seat, at least for the SEL. I would also like to see rear airvents, not neccessary since it is a small enough car, but it would be nice. 3. Std ABS at least on the SEL model. 4. As for engines, this is the big news. There should be a new 2.5 I4 debuting in the 08 Mazda 6. I imagine the engine will be good for 170-180 hp. There is also a rumor of a new version of the D30 V6 making somewhere between 230-250 hp (this engine should find its way into the Escape soon. This would also be a good time to introduce a ST or SVT model mated with a DI version of the D35 V6 making 280-310 hp. Of course there will the 2nd generation I4 hybrid drivetrain that I would guess make somewhere between 180-200 hp. 5. As for the Milan I would expect a similar update, perhaps will more unigue sheetmetal ala 08Taurus 08 Sable as compared to the 500 and Montego. I also wouldn't be surprised if the Milan had a unique dash (but same doors) in the interior than the Fusion. 6. The MKZ should get a new nose with the new MKR style grille and new tail lamps echoing the MKR or MKX. I also wonder if the new 3.7 V6 making somewhere between 300-320 hp will be optional or standard at this time. Anyway, anybody have any other information or thoughts on the 09 Fusion/Milan/MKZ updates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 The Fusion is getting a new GTDI 2L I4...the 3L PIP good for 240HP is also coming, but the 3.5L is a big question mark.. I'd expect the styling to be similar to what the Interceptor concept had...a better defined Tribar grill that doesnt look tacked on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Coupes!!! what happened to the COUPES!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 "at least new bumers (sic)" WTF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 OK .. the engines: - there is a big chance of 2.5l I4 replacing the2.3l - Blue II confirmed the 2.0l GTDI engine and 240hp version of the D30 - we also know there will be a full hybrid - we should expect refined interior - I have no idea to what extent - but at least improved materials and the Taurus-style upgraded switchgear. However, there is a chance, Ford will go much further - we will not know until we see the mules, or we get a rat .. ehm insider .. from Ford. - the ST/SVT version is a possibility. - the Couples and Wagons have not been mentioned for a while and there are no mules, so it is possible those plans were dropped - however I do still hope for the coupe .. - exterior redesign is of questionable extent .. we will know once the mules are spotted or we get insider info. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave9991 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) I am not going to say anything about the MKZ for right now, but I will comment on the Fusion and Milan. The Fusion WILL be receiving a new version of the 3.0 that has been under development. They will be receiving new interiors with the "pop-through" corporate stereo that is seen on 08 Escape/Mariner. There will be some minor exterior modifications to the rear taillights, the grille will be changed slightly. Keep in mind that the idea right now is to place the 6 as the performance choice, the Milan as the premium choice, and Fusion as the volume choice. Edited March 13, 2007 by dave9991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Who cross shops the Mazda and the Fusion? Shove the 3.0 GTDI there, tweak the suspension, slap 'SVT' badge on it and sell it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Who cross shops the Mazda and the Fusion? Shove the 3.0 GTDI there, tweak the suspension, slap 'SVT' badge on it and sell it. cross shoppers base a lot on the $$$$$$$.....and affordability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Who cross shops the Mazda and the Fusion? Shove the 3.0 GTDI there, tweak the suspension, slap 'SVT' badge on it and sell it. no one said that is not the case of the SVT ... what was said above is all in regards to the mass model of the Fusion ... SVT is still supposedlyt coming. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) I am not going to say anything about the MKZ for right now, but I will comment on the Fusion and Milan. The Fusion WILL be receiving a new version of the 3.0 that has been under development. They will be receiving new interiors with the "pop-through" corporate stereo that is seen on 08 Escape/Mariner. There will be some minor exterior modifications to the rear taillights, the grille will be changed slightly. Keep in mind that the idea right now is to place the 6 as the performance choice, the Milan as the premium choice, and Fusion as the volume choice. It better be a LOT more than a new radio, bumper, taillights and a still class-trailing 240 HP 3.0. Ford. You really, really, really suck. Edited March 13, 2007 by NickF1011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Some people want a fun to drive Fusion. Fortunately, they have a choice. Zoom zoom. Yep. If the Fusion was offered with a manual on the V6, there's quite a good chance I would have waited for it instead of buying my Mazda6. Of course, the existence of the Mazda6 is simply no excuse for Ford to not offer certain things on the Fusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I couldn't agree with you more. I wish Ford's engineers could have adapted more of the 6 into the Fusion. Maybe in the next update..... on the money...although personally I think the Fusion is aging rather quickly, quicker than the mazda....I say narrow the headlights even more ( 427 concept ) flare a fender a bit more here and there...wider tires..on a performance model.....wishful I know...Ford NEEDS their performance model of each line aka BMW M series...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Yep. If the Fusion was offered with a manual on the V6, there's quite a good chance I would have waited for it instead of buying my Mazda6. Of course, the existence of the Mazda6 is simply no excuse for Ford to not offer certain things on the Fusion. why not? will you claim that the existence of Yukon does not excuse GM from offering the 400hp V8 in the Tahoe? Or that the existence of the Lexus does not excuse Toyota from offering the DI V6 in the Camry? Brand hierarchy exists for a reason - and this is one of them -Ford does not need to compromise the ride quality of the Fusion to provide the athleticity of the Mazda6.. and that is how it should be .. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 (edited) why not? will you claim that the existence of Yukon does not excuse GM from offering the 400hp V8 in the Tahoe? Or that the existence of the Lexus does not excuse Toyota from offering the DI V6 in the Camry? Brand hierarchy exists for a reason - and this is one of them -Ford does not need to compromise the ride quality of the Fusion to provide the athleticity of the Mazda6.. and that is how it should be .. Igor That would actually make sense if Ford owned 100% of Mazda, which they don't. That said, they are making less profit on every Mazda6 sold compared to a Fusion. 2/3 of all Mazda profits don't go in Ford's coffers. Additionally, FORD is the brand trying to recapture a share in the midsize sedan market. Mazda is a niche player and will likely remain that way. Taking content out of your bread and butter sedan to make a niche vehicle more competitive by comparison makes NO sense at all. Edited March 13, 2007 by NickF1011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 That would actually make sense if Ford owned 100% of Mazda, which they don't. That said, they are making less profit on every Mazda6 sold compared to a Fusion. 2/3 of all Mazda profits don't go in Ford's coffers. Additionally, FORD is the brand trying to recapture a share in the midsize sedan market. Mazda is a niche player and will likely remain that way. Taking content out of your bread and butter sedan to make a niche vehicle more competitive by comparison makes NO sense at all. I see your point .. but given that we have yet to see whether even the Mazda3 gets the D35 .. and if it does not the situations is completely different ... it is simply too early to say what will happen in 9 months ... Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 I see your point .. but given that we have yet to see whether even the Mazda3 gets the D35 .. and if it does not the situations is completely different ... it is simply too early to say what will happen in 9 months ... Igor I assume you mean Mazda6. I have heard rumors that the D35 will indeed go into the refreshed 6. Even despite the engine, things like a manual on the V6 and the much better center stack was more than enough to tip the scales in the 6's favor in my case. Ford needed/needs the Fusion to be at the TOP of its game. The most frustrating part is knowing that they already HAVE the tools to do it. Not using them is sinful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Well, at least Ford is consistent in this type of thinking. No MTX in the V6 Fusion, no 3V 4.6 engines across the board, no 6 speed auto in the CV/GM, or the F-150 for that matter. Sometimes it make no sense. Let's hope things change for the better. Well, I at least understand there are limiting factors such as the floorpans, hoods, etc in the other examples you gave. Such oversights on the Fusion were simply deliberate omissions for the sake of who-knows-what, kinda like going back to drum brakes on the Escape. It is definitely a pattern though, you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 2/3 of all Mazda profits don't go in Ford's coffers. The only money that Mazda earns that does not remain at Mazda is a ridiculously small $.05 annual dividend, of which 2/3rds end up in the hands of Mazda's other shareholders. The rest of that income stays at Mazda, under the control of FoMoCo. It is rather missing the point to allege that 2/3rds of the money Mazda makes does not end up in Ford coffers. Not all of Mazda's profits are paid out to its shareholders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris Kolman Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 (edited) I think it's a matter of semantics. Mazda money does remain in the Mazda's accounts... Money doesn't go from Mazda's accounts to Ford's. But since Ford owns controlling interest in Mazda they can direct Mazda to spend that money in the interest of Ford as a whole. For example spending money developing the Mazda2 B-car platform for use by Ford. So in one hand yes the moeny doesn't directly subsidize Ford... But Ford says how Mazda will spend the money they make. Edited March 14, 2007 by Kris Kolman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swenson88 Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 I really can't think of a valid reason why Ford would choose to put a 240hp 3.0L V6 in their midsize sedan instead of a 265hp 3.5L V6 unless they really F-d up and the 3.5L doesn't fit in the engine bay. By the time this upgraded 3.0L hits the market every other major competitor will have much more power and Ford will be even further behind the pack. The Accord is getting redesigned, the Malibu is getting redesigned, the Altima and Camry are already kicking Ford's ass in the V6 department. Why would Ford possibly think they can "get by" with less, when they already have less? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 Ford might pull a Honda/Toyota and publish 91 octane ratings for the Duratec 30. Alternatively, the thing might get better gas mileage. With the climate in Washington what it is, I don't think it looks good for the company with the worst CAFE to be throwing a barn burner in its midsize cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 I really can't think of a valid reason why Ford would choose to put a 240hp 3.0L V6 in their midsize sedan instead of a 265hp 3.5L V6 unless they really F-d up and the 3.5L doesn't fit in the engine bay. By the time this upgraded 3.0L hits the market every other major competitor will have much more power and Ford will be even further behind the pack. The Accord is getting redesigned, the Malibu is getting redesigned, the Altima and Camry are already kicking Ford's ass in the V6 department. Why would Ford possibly think they can "get by" with less, when they already have less? BlueII stated that it was a CAFE thing....the 3.5L fits in the MKZ...why wouldn't it fit into the Fusion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 Pretty much every automaker cept Ford and Honda, have moved on to 3.5L offerings... Sebring/Avenger 3.5L Camry 3.5L Galant 3.8L Altima 3.5L Malibu 3.6L Passat 3.6L Again...Ford is thinking of debuting a '09 model with a 3.0L ? Unless that sucker isn't Turbocharged with at least 280HP, dont bother. Again, releasing new vehicles with yesturyears engines... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ds91776 Posted March 14, 2007 Author Share Posted March 14, 2007 uh guys, dont want to burst your "240 isnt enough power thing" but the Avenger and Seabring have 235 hp as does the much better Sonata. The important thing is this. With 221 hp the Fusion does pretty well. With 19+ extra hp it will be more than "pretty good." Remember, the 500 with a 203 hp engine did just as well as a rwd 300 3.5 v6 with 250 hp. the Fusion is still pretty light for its class, so having 240 sounds just fine for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave9991 Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 I never said anything about the HP being 240. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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