Noah Harbinger Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I agree with you that anyone who drives an Edge will be safer than in a large majority of other vehicles in a crash. But the question is, are you more likely to be in a crash? All other things equal, are there situations where you might have a minor fender-bender instead of a near miss? Again assuming that energy is dissipated linearly by the brakes, you'll be going 22.2MPH when you have 20 feet left, the difference in braking distance between an Edge and an Explorer or Murano. Any competitive disadvantage should be addressed to whatever degree is reasonable. Ford stands a much better chance of staging a recovery if they quickly fix any obvious details where they lag competitors. Right now, the Edge has a lot going for it. I certainly won't say this greatly undermines the value of the vehicle. The issue is not worth arguing about, though, since Ford has committed to fixing in a few months -- which is part of what gives me confidence for the future of the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Stop chugging the Ford Kool-Ade and you might be able to admit that. I think I need to institute a policy of adding to my Ignore list anyone who mentions "Cheerleaders" or "drinking the kool-ade"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Again assuming that energy is dissipated linearly by the brakes, you'll be going 22.2MPH when you have 20 feet left, the difference in braking distance between an Edge and an Explorer or Murano. If you assume the braking is linear, at 125 feet the Edge is 86% stopped (using 145 feet). 14% of 60 mph is 8.4 mph not 22.2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 If you assume the braking is linear, at 125 feet the Edge is 86% stopped (using 145 feet). 14% of 60 mph is 8.4 mph not 22.2. Linear dissipation of kinetic energy, not of speed. Kinetic energy varies with the square of speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Linear dissipation of kinetic energy, not of speed. Kinetic energy varies with the square of speed. So that means it takes 125 ft to go from 60 to 22.2 and only 20 feet to go from 22.2 to 0? Just doesn't sound right. I'm sure it's not totally linear based on speed either but I bet it's close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 So that means it takes 125 ft to go from 60 to 22.2 and only 20 feet to go from 22.2 to 0? Just doesn't sound right. I'm sure it's not totally linear based on speed either but I bet it's close. Well for another example, scroll up and see what people posted for the Murano: 60-0: 124 feet 70-0: 166 feet So, by going 10 miles per hour faster (16% faster), you take 33% longer to brake. This, boys and girls, is why speeding kills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sim Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 If we are going to get all scientific about it, lets talk environmental conditions: Are we going up or down slope, on flat ground, or around bends? Are we on asphaltic concrete, bituminous concrete or some other material? What is the weather and road condition, hot, cold, dry, or wet? Is there oil on the road? Which way is the wind blowing? How many times have we done an emergency stop in a series? Are we getting fade? How much warning or how much attention are we paying when we first notice something to brake for? I could probably go on, to tell the truth there are so many variables in the mix and that are around during each time that you might want to brake on any given day of driving that these numbers are just like a pissing contest. On the day any of these cars could take longer or shorter to stop than the "official numbers" from the rags. Its like the EPA numbers, its a guideline to what you might expect, however i dont know how scientific the actual tests are when comparing different cars on different occasions throughout the year in uncontrolled circumstances, it certainly wouldnt face the rigour of a real scientific test. Personally i am very happy and confident in my Edge's brakes, my wife even complains they are a bit too aggressive when i stamp down some, however i have yet to do an emergency stop for real in the car as i havent needed to, i did on the test drive, but that was on my own time not a reactionary stop. Maybe some people think its a problem, maybe some rags measured some pseudo-scientific numbers to base their conclusions on, but even under the best of braking ability in a car, its not going to stop you hitting things in every situation, particularly in these scenarios where you have less than 100ft to stop before hitting something that jumps out when you are doing 60mph - it just isnt going to happen! 100ft is just over 1 second of travel at 60 mph, first you have to spot it, then react, then decide on action and follow through - oh look i hit that thing at 30-40mph as that is all i could stop to in practically any car/truck given those conditions - what a flawed arguement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Well for another example, scroll up and see what people posted for the Murano: 60-0: 124 feet 70-0: 166 feet So, by going 10 miles per hour faster (16% faster), you take 33% longer to brake. This, boys and girls, is why speeding kills. But the extra time (and therefore length) could be at the beginning of the brake cycle, not the end. I imagine it takes a lot longer to get the brakes to the point of lockup from 70 than 60. But I'm no physics expert so I won't debate it. The brakes should be improved but it's not a deal breaker for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcall Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 If we are going to get all scientific about it, lets talk environmental conditions:Are we going up or down slope, on flat ground, or around bends? Are we on asphaltic concrete, bituminous concrete or some other material? What is the weather and road condition, hot, cold, dry, or wet? Is there oil on the road? Which way is the wind blowing? How many times have we done an emergency stop in a series? Are we getting fade? How much warning or how much attention are we paying when we first notice something to brake for? I could probably go on, to tell the truth there are so many variables in the mix and that are around during each time that you might want to brake on any given day of driving that these numbers are just like a pissing contest. On the day any of these cars could take longer or shorter to stop than the "official numbers" from the rags. Its like the EPA numbers, its a guideline to what you might expect, however i dont know how scientific the actual tests are when comparing different cars on different occasions throughout the year in uncontrolled circumstances, it certainly wouldnt face the rigour of a real scientific test. Personally i am very happy and confident in my Edge's brakes, my wife even complains they are a bit too aggressive when i stamp down some, however i have yet to do an emergency stop for real in the car as i havent needed to, i did on the test drive, but that was on my own time not a reactionary stop. Maybe some people think its a problem, maybe some rags measured some pseudo-scientific numbers to base their conclusions on, but even under the best of braking ability in a car, its not going to stop you hitting things in every situation, particularly in these scenarios where you have less than 100ft to stop before hitting something that jumps out when you are doing 60mph - it just isnt going to happen! 100ft is just over 1 second of travel at 60 mph, first you have to spot it, then react, then decide on action and follow through - oh look i hit that thing at 30-40mph as that is all i could stop to in practically any car/truck given those conditions - what a flawed arguement. Amen Sim Well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgy Girl Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Alleluia !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Amen Sim Well said. Another factor is did the test vehicle Edmunds used have glaze on the brake pads. I say this because some reviewers had nothing negative to say about brakes and others did. There didn't seem to be any consistency. My company car is a 2004 Taurus and when I got it the previous driver abused it and brakes gave me no confidence. So first thing I did was take it in to Belle Tire and they told me brakes were fine except for glaze on brake pads. The vehicle stopped OK, but there was no confidence in brakes as sometimes it felt like braking distance was excessive. So I got my company to pay for new brake pads and shoes and now vehicle brakes great. The reviewers use test vehicles that may have glazed brakes from severe testing and I doubt if they check to find out if distance seems excessive. Anyway, in future if any company car I drive seems to have excessive braking distance, it will be first thing I check for. It's a rather stressful feeling you have as you just don't think the vehicle will stop in acceptable distance and you find yourself practically doing threshold braking to bring the vehicle to halt. No confidence whatsover even though pedal feel is strong and car does stop. It's also not hard to glaze the pads through excessively hard braking where pad really gets heated up repeatedly causing the glazing. I'm a smooth braker and always of course leave proper space cushion and get years and many miles out of brake pads. My personal car a 2002 Taurus SES Sport after five years still has 80% of its pad life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 (edited) The brakes should be improved but it's not a deal breaker for me. That's the only thing I'd want to hear anyone say. If my car dies (which I hope for every day), the Edge will be right up at the top of my list. Edited June 12, 2007 by Noah Harbinger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcall Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Did my own Brake Test!!! See my Finding Woodburn drag strip. (Asphalt track C mix ) Air Temp 66 Humility 78% Track temp 64.3 No Wind 1st run---60 to 0 = 138ft 2nd run--- 60 to 0 = 135ft 3rd run--- 60 to 0 = 135ft All runs conducted with 15mins of each other. This was on our 07 built in April mid month. I was very happy with the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgy Girl Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Interesting - mine was also an April mid month build - actually April 21 to be exact... and I have always contended my brakes are fine... im sure you will be asked for audited results.. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fomocona Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 The Edge braking performance meets all government, all FMVSS 135 braking requirements by significant margins, and all Ford Motor Company corporate brake requirements. Unfortunately, some magazines have reported that some other vehicles in the market have shorter stopping distances. To be upfront, Ford has not stated that the Edge is the best in class in stopping distance, however, it is competitive. The magazine data puts our stopping distances in the range of 143–167 feet depending on the publication. As noted by others on this thread, brake stopping distance is heavily affected by tire type, tire burnish, vehicle loading, brake lining burnish and temperature, and roadway friction. It is likely that the range of stopping distances has to do with the varying test parameters. Recent Ford internal studies with known test parameters put the Edge at a 143 ft stopping distance. When comparing apples to apples we are very similar to other nameplates. With that said, Ford is continually looking for vehicle feedback. A convenient way to give yours is to go to customersaskford.com and type in "Product Feedback". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RODO Posted July 12, 2007 Share Posted July 12, 2007 In all honesty, I feel the brakes on the edge work very well. I was very satisfied with its ability to stop. I have driven a ton of them and don't have any complaints as of yet. :shades: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al303 Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 In the first place if you pay attention to your driving and not follow so close you won't need to stop that fast... Would you please e-mail the deer in my nieborhood and ask them to give me at least 126ft before jumping in front of my car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 :lastyear: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g48150 Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 I just had this go-around with Hines Park Lincoln Mercury! My stopping distance was like 40 feet!!! Just when it got cold, it wasn't ice or snow or anything, the pads were fine, and so were the rotors. So they charged me $21.43 for a "brake inspection". $10 bucks says that they reprogrammed something or put some "shims" in somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Fear Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 You're making my point for me. No matter how careful and law-abiding you are behind the wheel, there are far too many others who are a great danger. When some horse's ass with no brake lights slams on his brakes on the highway because he missed his exit I want my wife to have every advantage she needs to avoid an accident. Same for the guy who decides to turn left in front of her with no signal on. Just last week a woman hit a 500lb Moose on the Merrritt Parkway in CT and is badly injured. Not sure 20' shorter stopping distance would have changed anything, but it sure wouldn't have hurt. Who knows, she might have been able to walk away. Due to all the unpredictable dangers on the road, it makes sense to minimize the risks. Better brakes do just that. I can't control what or how other people drive, only what I do. I buckle up because of the other drivers, not because of myself. How did you check out the all-new Murano or Highlander? Were they at an auto show or something? I was not aware that they were available to the public yet. Or are you talking about the current, lame-duck models? If so, I would certainly hope the Edge is better. Both the Nissan and Toyota have been around for years. Oddly enough, both stop better than the Edge. I own an Edge and have had no problems with the brakes or anything else. I can honestly say I have nothing to complain about. It has been trouble free. I have never had that first problem getting it stopped. It is without a doubt the best Ford vehicle I have ever owned and I would probably buy another one. Perhaps you should consider buying an M1/A1 Abrams tank for your wife. I hear they're safe and offer lots of protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastime Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Did my own Brake Test!!! See my Finding Woodburn drag strip. (Asphalt track C mix ) Air Temp 66 Humility 78% Track temp 64.3 No Wind 1st run---60 to 0 = 138ft 2nd run--- 60 to 0 = 135ft 3rd run--- 60 to 0 = 135ft All runs conducted with 15mins of each other. This was on our 07 built in April mid month. I was very happy with the results. GLUE does wonders for stopping distances... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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