New Truck Project?

[KTPgal89]

I did a post on the employee forum theother day asking if anyone at KTP saw signs of any line modification that would indicate 650/750 (850??!!) was coming back to Louisville. Igot one respose in which the basically saidthey didn't knowwhat shift they would beworking never mind if big jobs were coming back.

 

I had an e-mail from someone in Commercial truckat Ford who said 650/750/LCF were very much in their plans for the future-we shall see.

 

And goinbroke2, you are correct- we all see the old Fords everyday still on the job. Ford owned the vocational truck market and they pissed it away. sad part is the 750 has the specs to do a lot of those jobs today (home oil delivery) but they don't aggresively go after anything- brain dead marketers IMO

 

I work at KTP and the only way we could accommadate the big trucks is if the company retools the old Excursion paint/body shop. Maybe the final assembly lines could be modified for the bigger trucks, but I don't work on that side. We do have capacity for another product since they pulled the plug on Excursion, but we've been hearing it was going to possibly be the 150 deisel.

[7Mary3]

I did a post on the employee forum theother day asking if anyone at KTP saw signs of any line modification that would indicate 650/750 (850??!!) was coming back to Louisville. Igot one respose in which the basically saidthey didn't knowwhat shift they would beworking never mind if big jobs were coming back.

 

I had an e-mail from someone in Commercial truckat Ford who said 650/750/LCF were very much in their plans for the future-we shall see.

 

And goinbroke2, you are correct- we all see the old Fords everyday still on the job. Ford owned the vocational truck market and they pissed it away. sad part is the 750 has the specs to do a lot of those jobs today (home oil delivery) but they don't aggresively go after anything- brain dead marketers IMO

 

I certainly hope Ford continues with the 650 and 750, but if they were planning on dropping these models, I doubt we would hear about it until it actually happens. If you talked to them now, would you expect Ford to basically say don't buy an F-650, we are dropping the line at the end of 2008?

[jonas1022]

I did a post on the employee forum theother day asking if anyone at KTP saw signs of any line modification that would indicate 650/750 (850??!!) was coming back to Louisville. Igot one respose in which the basically saidthey didn't knowwhat shift they would beworking never mind if big jobs were coming back.

 

I had an e-mail from someone in Commercial truckat Ford who said 650/750/LCF were very much in their plans for the future-we shall see.

 

And goinbroke2, you are correct- we all see the old Fords everyday still on the job. Ford owned the vocational truck market and they pissed it away. sad part is the 750 has the specs to do a lot of those jobs today (home oil delivery) but they don't aggresively go after anything- brain dead marketers IMO

IF the Ford execs that work the mid-heavy trucks range can make a good business case they will make the LCF into the future. And IF they can make another case for L-type trucks in the future Ford will go back to that market. Right now, the sale terms of the Lousiville line to Diamler dictated a no compete clause for ten years. Do the subtraction from when Ford handed over the keys to Diamler/Frieghtliner. Shortly afterwards we will know if Ford can figure out a business case and take it market like they did with the old L series. BTW, wasn't the L-series sold about the same time as Jag and Aston Martin was purchased by the pre-Bill show in Dearborn? That's where the $$$ proceeds went from the sale to Diamler wasn't it?

Edited October 22, 2007 by jonas1022

[jonas1022]

It makes sense that GM & International will get together. Workhorse was purchased by Navistar. Workhorse builds motorhome & bus chassis and use were already using GM engines & Allison trannys. Now you can get a MaxxForce™ 7 (International's version of the Ford 6.4 PowerStroke) in the Workhorse UFO chassis. If you connect the dots, you can see GM & Navistar are already getting together. I wouldn't be surprised to see the next "MaxxForce/PowerStroke" become the next GM "Duramax".

That is all too possible, as GM can't give away the Izuzu based trucks that they have been marketing for the past ten years. And as good as the DuraMax is, it isn't as good as the Powerstroke as bad as it is. Go figure. Another business case. Subcontract everything. That and Navistar has a better contract with the UAW to make more for less than the "big three". All that is IMHO. And based on the bankruptcy that International trucks went through a couple decades ago when their contract was regulated to death by the courts...

[7Mary3]

That is all too possible, as GM can't give away the Izuzu based trucks that they have been marketing for the past ten years. And as good as the DuraMax is, it isn't as good as the Powerstroke as bad as it is. Go figure. Another business case. Subcontract everything. That and Navistar has a better contract with the UAW to make more for less than the "big three". All that is IMHO. And based on the bankruptcy that International trucks went through a couple decades ago when their contract was regulated to death by the courts...

 

In my area, both the Isuzu Truck dealers and the Chevy/GMC dealers sell lots of the smaller LCF's, and a few of the larger tilt cabs. Neither of those trucks really has a Duramax in it, the small truck uses an Isuzu 4 cyliner diesel, the larger versions use the 7.8L Isuzu 6 cylinder (which is probably the best mid-range diesel out right now). The 'real' Duramax V-8 is in the Topkick/Kodiak 4500/5500, and if I had to pick between a Duramax and a 6.0L Powerstroke, well......

[7Mary3]

IF the Ford execs that work the mid-heavy trucks range can make a good business case they will make the LCF into the future. And IF they can make another case for L-type trucks in the future Ford will go back to that market. Right now, the sale terms of the Lousiville line to Diamler dictated a no compete clause for ten years. Do the subtraction from when Ford handed over the keys to Diamler/Frieghtliner. Shortly afterwards we will know if Ford can figure out a business case and take it market like they did with the old L series. BTW, wasn't the L-series sold about the same time as Jag and Aston Martin was purchased by the pre-Bill show in Dearborn? That's where the $$$ proceeds went from the sale to Diamler wasn't it?

 

Ford sold their heavy truck operation including the then new HM-80 models to Freightliner for next to nothing. Something like 300 million. Nowhere near what they spent to Jaguar.

[joe8737]

That is all too possible, as GM can't give away the Izuzu based trucks that they have been marketing for the past ten years. And as good as the DuraMax is, it isn't as good as the Powerstroke as bad as it is. Go figure. Another business case. Subcontract everything. That and Navistar has a better contract with the UAW to make more for less than the "big three". All that is IMHO. And based on the bankruptcy that International trucks went through a couple decades ago when their contract was regulated to death by the courts...

 

 

In my area, the Isuzu / GM cabovers sell like hotcakes. You've got to be kidding about the "Duramax isn't as good as the powerstroke" comment.???

[jonas1022]

In my area, the Isuzu / GM cabovers sell like hotcakes. You've got to be kidding about the "Duramax isn't as good as the powerstroke" comment.???

NOT JOKING!

 

If the Duramax were a truely good engine line, then Izuzu would be marketing the heck out of it world wide. They aren't. As bad as the Powerstroke is, and I won't be buying one, it's is marketed worldwide. Also, IMHO the Duramax is just another one of GMs' suck it dry pholosphy. They did the same with Detroit Diesel as they are doing with the Duramax now. Make it good for a few years, then suck any good marketing will you have built up out of it. They (GM) are working to sell off the Mid-size trucks and the Duramax name to International. That may not happen, but it's a sign to the rest of us that they have milked that cow dry. Time to sell. And a sure thing to stay away from.

 

BTW, I have a buddy with a 1 ton that has the Duramax. His first pickup. Said he loves his truck, engine and all. Things couldn 't be better. Since last month when he took it back to the dealer, and nothing of what was serviced was warranty work he has been real quiet.

[7Mary3]

NOT JOKING!

 

If the Duramax were a truely good engine line, then Izuzu would be marketing the heck out of it world wide. They aren't. As bad as the Powerstroke is, and I won't be buying one, it's is marketed worldwide. Also, IMHO the Duramax is just another one of GMs' suck it dry pholosphy. They did the same with Detroit Diesel as they are doing with the Duramax now. Make it good for a few years, then suck any good marketing will you have built up out of it. They (GM) are working to sell off the Mid-size trucks and the Duramax name to International. That may not happen, but it's a sign to the rest of us that they have milked that cow dry. Time to sell. And a sure thing to stay away from.

 

BTW, I have a buddy with a 1 ton that has the Duramax. His first pickup. Said he loves his truck, engine and all. Things couldn 't be better. Since last month when he took it back to the dealer, and nothing of what was serviced was warranty work he has been real quiet.

 

Since when is the 6L or 6.4L Powerstroke 'marketed worldwide'? I have news for you, they are not. Ford uses the Powerstroke name on some South American diesels, but they are in no way related to what is sold here. Neither the Duramax or the domestic Powerstrokes are sold abroad, they are far too large for the rest of the world. Also, the 6.6L Duramax was designed by Isuzu, but all the rights to it and the plant it is manufactured in belong solely to GM. The engine isn't Isuzu's to sell or use.

[fordktpworker]

We do have capacity for another product since they pulled the plug on Excursion, but we've been hearing it was going to possibly be the 150 deisel.

 

F-150 diesel will be built at DTP! :happy feet:

[DearbornDerek]

F-150 diesel will be built at DTP! :happy feet:

 

 

....And KCAP

[fordktpworker]

....And KCAP

and NAP

[toyboxrv]

As long as they build it somewhere, I'm OK.

[Deckedoutf150]

I think Ford and International will not divorce. To much for both parties.

 

 

i have already heard rumors about ford working on their own diesel for the super duty already. its supposed to be a 6.7L with something like 700 flbs of torque. it would be a blessing for them to get away from navistar. i believe the name of it is scorpion and its rumored to be out in the trucks in 2010 or 2011.

[Manx]

i have already heard rumors about ford working on their own diesel for the super duty already. its supposed to be a 6.7L with something like 700 flbs of torque. it would be a blessing for them to get away from navistar. i believe the name of it is scorpion and its rumored to be out in the trucks in 2010 or 2011.

 

You know that's good but

The whole reason the Navistar engine had so many problems was becuse Ford had to have control over the fuel system.

It was screwed up on the 6.0 and I'm not up to date on the 6.4 but I've heard there are problems with that one as well.

 

There's a old saying

"Those who do not remember the past will relive it."

 

The main reason there's a V-8 diesel would be

Americas love with the V-8 and the need of a higher revving diesel engine.

Back in the 80's when they started putting diesels in pickup trucks the 3 speed auto was the norm.

You needed an engine with a wider power band. And V-8's could do this and we all loved the V-8

 

But if look at the larger trucks with diesels

They all went thru the V-8 phase

Now days I know of no V-8 diesels used on the road

They have all gone back to inline 6's

 

If there coming out with a new Ford diesel

1) They need to fire the guy in charge of the fuel delivery

2) They need to make the new diesel a inline 6 and back it with a 6 or better yet 7 speed automatic.

 

And if they what to stay in business

They should have 2 new diesels

Both inline 6's one should get good mileage and another bored out or stroked eng. that would cover bragging rights for HP and torque.

And both need to have a perfect launch, and it needs to happen damn quick!!!!!!!!!!!

 

There losing market share

Edited December 31, 2007 by Manx

[Unrealford]

Well, from a very good source, What I can tell you is that Ford is replacing the Ranger with a F-100 pickup. Any questions just ask? I will tell as much as I can say without getting into trouble..

[Manx]

Sounds great

They could sure use an updated Ranger.

 

Am I excited?

No, Ford will be bankrupt or I'll be dead before that truck rolls off an ass'y line.

[rmc523]

Well, from a very good source, What I can tell you is that Ford is replacing the Ranger with a F-100 pickup. Any questions just ask? I will tell as much as I can say without getting into trouble..

 

Is it on a shortened F-150 frame as rumored?

[7Mary3]

I was told it is more like the Honda Ridgeline. Front wheel drive, unit-body.

[Blueblood]

I was told it is more like the Honda Ridgeline. Front wheel drive, unit-body.

 

God I hope you're joking, a Taurus X is not a truck, nor a Ranger..

[7Mary3]

You need to realize just what the Energy Bill will require. Not only will truck based SUV's and traditional pickup trucks below 8,500 GVW be pretty much gone from the automotive scene, you can count out RWD cars as well. I don't like the Ridgeline either, but it represents what direction the market will probably go. And, even if the Energy Bill wasn't a factor, $150/barrel oil will be. Think of how many dolled up Super Duty and F-150's are sold to kids who can barely afford to make the payments (a situation often made worse with loads of negative equity from their last vehicle purchase tagged on). Those guys ain't gonna be a buyin' if they can't afford to fuel the thing. Those of us with a few years under our belts probably remember the muscle car thing back in the late 60's. Many of the guys snapping up all the 428 Cobra-Jet Mustangs were later forced into 200 cube 6 cylinder Grabber Mavereks. So, what does this all have to do with 650 and 750 Super Duties? Well, if demand for those King Ranch and Amarillo Super Duties dries up, they will need something to build there, won't they?

[theoldwizard]

I was told it is more like the Honda Ridgeline. Front wheel drive, unit-body.

Gawd I hope you are wrong !

 

Unibody trucks, especially front wheel drive, are just plain wrong ! VW tried it and it was an an incredible failure !

 

All of the rumors say that the Global Ranger (current in production in SE Asia) will replace the US Raner, probably not until 2012 or later.

 

The F100 project died when the next gen Explorer was changed over to unibody.

[rmc523]

Gawd I hope you are wrong !

 

Unibody trucks, especially front wheel drive, are just plain wrong ! VW tried it and it was an an incredible failure !

 

All of the rumors say that the Global Ranger (current in production in SE Asia) will replace the US Raner, probably not until 2012 or later.

 

The F100 project died when the next gen Explorer was changed over to unibody.

 

So now we have several conflicting statements. I suppose we've had this type of thing before about the same vehicle though, I guess we'll just have to wait until Ford announces something officially.

[Blueblood]

You need to realize just what the Energy Bill will require. Not only will truck based SUV's and traditional pickup trucks below 8,500 GVW be pretty much gone from the automotive scene, you can count out RWD cars as well. I don't like the Ridgeline either, but it represents what direction the market will probably go. And, even if the Energy Bill wasn't a factor, $150/barrel oil will be. Think of how many dolled up Super Duty and F-150's are sold to kids who can barely afford to make the payments (a situation often made worse with loads of negative equity from their last vehicle purchase tagged on). Those guys ain't gonna be a buyin' if they can't afford to fuel the thing. Those of us with a few years under our belts probably remember the muscle car thing back in the late 60's. Many of the guys snapping up all the 428 Cobra-Jet Mustangs were later forced into 200 cube 6 cylinder Grabber Mavereks. So, what does this all have to do with 650 and 750 Super Duties? Well, if demand for those King Ranch and Amarillo Super Duties dries up, they will need something to build there, won't they?

 

You're assuming there isn't any other way to make fuel economy gains, or that there won't be things like hybrids, plug-in hybrids, diesels, and diesel-electric hybrids by then.

 

Ford can still make 14mpg trucks, and 20mpg RWD performance cars as long as they have a few plug-in hybrids/hybrids/diesels, etc..

 

Not even current FWD unibody ANYTHING gets over 35 mpg unless it's a B-car so that notion is ridiculous that Ford will have to copy the pos Ridgeline..

[Unrealford]

Well, from what I am hearing, it will have a truckbox,much like the statement above. A lightened F-150,