Wanderinglost Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I'd kind of forgotten that I haven't found a Ford dealership that I could honestly say that it's been a pleasure doing business with, but this week I've taken calls from two different family members that called me to complain about the way they've been treated by their dealer. Now these complaints are mostly about the service departments, and personally I've moved on to my fourth dealership over the last few years looking for one that had decent sales and service, and I'm still looking...... I hear very few complaints about Mercury/Lincoln dealers, but it seems like a never ending parade of belly aching about the Ford dealers, WTF? Is it just me? I'm going to kick around and find a phone number or two and give someone an earfull at Ford, not that they will care I'm certain. If anyone has any ideas who/where I can stir up the most trouble about this, drop me a line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I'd kind of forgotten that I haven't found a Ford dealership that I could honestly say that it's been a pleasure doing business with, but this week I've taken calls from two different family members that called me to complain about the way they've been treated by their dealer. Now these complaints are mostly about the service departments, and personally I've moved on to my fourth dealership over the last few years looking for one that had decent sales and service, and I'm still looking...... I hear very few complaints about Mercury/Lincoln dealers, but it seems like a never ending parade of belly aching about the Ford dealers, WTF? Is it just me? I'm going to kick around and find a phone number or two and give someone an earfull at Ford, not that they will care I'm certain. If anyone has any ideas who/where I can stir up the most trouble about this, drop me a line. Well thats kind of an obvious answer. OF course their not all bad, but some people can always find something wrong if their looking. Some people were mad at our dealership the other day when they did't cover a problem when it was off warranty at 122000 kms. I really like the dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Ford dealers are more than 60 percent of Ford's problem imo. The first thing that comes to mind is the 15K "market adjustment" for the GT500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwg Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I am very happy with my Ford dealer. It is why I have just bought my 4th car from them. I just had my new Escape in the service department for a loud creak in the rear. It took them a week and a half of working on the car on and off to find the creak. They gave me a loaner and did not give me the car back until they found it. I made sure that I told them several times how much I appreciate the time they spent trying to locate the creak which turned out to be in the control arm. I believe the dealer makes all the difference in the world. It doesn't matter if you have the best car in the world, if the dealer does not provide good service then you won't buy that car again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Selby Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I have been buying new Fords since 1984 and up until 7 years ago I had no problems with Ford service departments. Now I can't find one I'd trust to check the air in my tires. I can count on excuses as to why they can't fix or find a problem and also count on getting the car back with some kind of damage. Dropping my car off with the local dealer feels like dropping my son off with Michael Jackson. The Ford Customer care line only adds insult to injury. They only tell you in a Pakistani accent " Sorry, we can do nothing, the dealer has the final say" I know quite a few people that will no longer buy Fords due to shit dealer service. My wife got rid of her 2000 Explorer due to non stop BS from the dealer. She traded it on a Toyota 4Runner. The 4Runner has been far from perfect but the dealer finds and fixes the problem right the first time without the"We couldn't find anything" or "They all do that". Sorry for the rant but IMHO the service departments are the biggest thing killing Ford right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Ford dealers are more than 60 percent of Ford's problem imo. The first thing that comes to mind is the 15K "market adjustment" for the GT500. :beatdeadhorse: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 :beatdeadhorse: The truth is, that many people hate when they don't get their way. The dealer cannot always give them what they want, so they get mad. Some dealers may really be bad, but often, the customer is simply being unreasonable. This is true for things like the service industry as well. You never usually realize the position of the other party until you stand in their shoes. It would do a lot of people a great deal of good to try it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 The truth is, that many people hate when they don't get their way. The dealer cannot always give them what they want, so they get mad. Some dealers may really be bad, but often, the customer is simply being unreasonable. This is true for things like the service industry as well. You never usually realize the position of the other party until you stand in their shoes. It would do a lot of people a great deal of good to try it. I have been on both sides....not really that difficult if one is in touch with reality! and I wholeheartedly agree with you.....people scream like babies when they sometimes cannot get their own way...bottom line is if a deal makes sense to a DEALER they will be signing paperwork....can be a piece of cake or something to start a whiney thread on........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Greene Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Our Linciln Mercury dealership gives terrific service. Maybe you should try them. I even take my Fords there. I do think they charge about 10% more for service, maybe that is what allows them to do more, hire better people, have nicer waiting rooms, etc. It sure keeps my wife going back for more and more hi depreciating vehicles, when if up to me I probably would look eslewhere for vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 :beatdeadhorse: and this is relevent how? Shutting your eyes and closing your ears while shouting doesn't change anything. The dealer you work with might be a good one, but do you really think that every Ford dealer is good? No it isn't, because if they were good Ford wouldn't have lost as much marketshare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I have been on both sides....not really that difficult if one is in touch with reality! and I wholeheartedly agree with you.....people scream like babies when they sometimes cannot get their own way...bottom line is if a deal makes sense to a DEALER they will be signing paperwork....can be a piece of cake or something to start a whiney thread on........ An example of this I saw recently was a person with a 2002 Ford Taurus. It was 22000 kms over warranty and they expected a broken radius arm to be taken care of by the dealer. The dealer didn't and the people became upset. I agree completely with the dealer in this situation, but some people believe that the dealer owes them everything after they purchase a car from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 (edited) and this is relevent how? Shutting your eyes and closing your ears while shouting doesn't change anything. The dealer you work with might be a good one, but do you really think that every Ford dealer is good? No it isn't, because if they were good Ford wouldn't have lost as much marketshare. bollocks...........1st things first........product and styling....actual dealers don't bring people in........we need a shot in the arm, right now NOTHING is bringing customers in excited....barring GT500 dreamers, hybrids and 0% for 72 months...the lineup is stagnant...things look like they are going to get better...it has to or sales will continue to fall , that said ALL manufacturers are feeling the squeeze due to the "Doom" being shoved down our throats on CNN...people right now seem to be scared to spend....side bar the deadhorse was aimed at the ENDLESS addendum griping....this subject has been adressed Barbaro style countless times , and people STILL don't get it............ Edited September 3, 2007 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 (edited) An example of this I saw recently was a person with a 2002 Ford Taurus. It was 22000 kms over warranty and they expected a broken radius arm to be taken care of by the dealer. The dealer didn't and the people became upset. I agree completely with the dealer in this situation, but some people believe that the dealer owes them everything after they purchase a car from them. next up they are on BON BITCHING about it......I see it all the time....we also do a lot of AWA work ( After Warranty Adjustment ) where participation in expenses are given to customers with warrated gripes...ie, something goes POOF just after warranty expiration........funny...you don't read too much of the positive stuff about dealers do you? Human nature i guess............some people aren't happy unless they have something to bitch about...PC, Ovaltine, Tommy ...you out there? Edited September 3, 2007 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el norte Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 next up they are on BON BITCHING about it......I see it all the time....we also do a lot of AWA work ( After Warranty Adjustment ) where participation in expenses are given to customers with warrated gripes...ie, something goes POOF just after warranty expiration........funny...you don't read too much of the positive stuff about dealers do you? Human nature i guess............some people aren't happy unless they have something to bitch about... maybe so, but are you making the payments on these vehicles? my tranny goes out on my brand new 40k explorer, i dont think i need problems from the dealer, or when my control arm is ready to fall off my new 31k mustang, i expect the dealership to actually look at the car, instead of telling me there's nothing wrong with it. so, i dont want to hear about customers bitching, there the ones paying for it. i think dealership experience is very important to the customer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 maybe so, but are you making the payments on these vehicles? my tranny goes out on my brand new 40k explorer, i dont think i need problems from the dealer, or when my control arm is ready to fall off my new 31k mustang, i expect the dealership to actually look at the car, instead of telling me there's nothing wrong with it. so, i dont want to hear about customers bitching, there the ones paying for it. i think dealership experience is very important to the customer! I wholeheartedly agree...but lines do get crossed...from BOTH sides....tranny goes out @ 40k....then we find out to save a buck NO maintenence was performed by the customer at all, brakes constantly warping on tye 350 dually...cant have anything to do with the trailer that weighs 7000 pounds over what Ford recommends.....brakes non functional...hmmm....clutch fluid in the brake resevoir...Jiffy Lube performed the sevices.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el norte Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I wholeheartedly agree...but lines do get crossed...from BOTH sides....tranny goes out @ 40k....then we find out to save a buck NO maintenence was performed by the customer at all, brakes constantly warping on tye 350 dually...cant have anything to do with the trailer that weighs 7000 pounds over what Ford recommends.....brakes non functional...hmmm....clutch fluid in the brake resevoir...Jiffy Lube performed the sevices.... i do agree that lines probably do get crossed, but when it comes to safety there are no short cuts, especially if you transport children! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 i do agree that lines probably do get crossed, but when it comes to safety there are no short cuts, especially if you transport children! warrantys on safety items are usually above and beyound 3/36000..........I didn't know we were talking about safety items... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 An example of this I saw recently was a person with a 2002 Ford Taurus. It was 22000 kms over warranty and they expected a broken radius arm to be taken care of by the dealer. The dealer didn't and the people became upset. I agree completely with the dealer in this situation, but some people believe that the dealer owes them everything after they purchase a car from them. Yep, once the warranty is over, it's over and dealer will not be paid for any work. I always hope vehicle if it has any problems will manifest itself before warranty is up. I lucked out on my 2002 Taurus. It has been a great car, but at about 2.5 year mark fan motor started to get loud like it did on previous Taurus I had and knew it was problem. Lucky for me soon after fan motor quit and had no use of HVAC controls. So I took it in and dealer told me drains plugged up with leaves and water leaked into blower motor and poof. So dealer installed new blower motor, cleaned out drains, and sealed housing around motor so that even if drains plug up water cannot get in and kill electric motor this time. Dealer told me there was service bulletin on problem, but as of yet no recall notice. So I was lucky motor went before warranty was up and fixed for no cost to me. If after warranty was up, I would be responsible even with service bulletin. As for dealers, Bill Brown Ford in Livonia, MI is excellent dealer as is Blackwell Ford in Plymouth, MI. They are honest, don't play games with you, and provide excellent service. Never a bad experience with these two dealerships and get my business. They are not yuppified dealers with gourmet coffee, sushi, and childcare facilities, but they are good dealerlships. One feature I like about Bill Brown is that they are so big that they turned half of garage hooked onto showroom floor into new display center. All the new stuff is inside garage out door and also can bring up new, prepped vehicle right up to customer in inside environment during inclement days. Also back there you will find Rousch Mustangs, Rousch F-150, various Ford vehicles with aftermarket parts available and installed, and maybe even a Ford GT up to a year ago. Bill Brown is a Rousch dealer also. They have a great inventory of Ford product and you can usually find vehicle you like on lot. So I buy my new Fords at Bill Brown and have them serviced at Blackwell. The reason I choose Blackwell for service is because it's smaller dealership, and I get more personable service there because of it. The service personnel there are very friendly and personable. Now if they could only find more personable people at cashier office that take your money. They look and act like they find it bothersome to take your money and help you. Not sure what that is about....I suppose people who don't like their job and express it through body language and attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 next up they are on BON BITCHING about it......I see it all the time....we also do a lot of AWA work ( After Warranty Adjustment ) where participation in expenses are given to customers with warrated gripes...ie, something goes POOF just after warranty expiration........funny...you don't read too much of the positive stuff about dealers do you? Human nature i guess............some people aren't happy unless they have something to bitch about...PC, Ovaltine, Tommy ...you out there? Products aren't your fault, however customer service is. I was actually willing to buy a Peugeot instead of my Focus, but my father's experience with the Ford dealer was pretty good and helped me make my decision. I have heard a lot of stories about Ford dealers telling the customer to **** off or pay for the problem while the car is still under warranty or there's no problem and it's definitely there dammit. Customer service is really important, I would gladly buy a car (without thinking twice) that's half-decent quality wise if the dealer was good at service and maintenance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Products aren't your fault, however customer service is. I was actually willing to buy a Peugeot instead of my Focus, but my father's experience with the Ford dealer was pretty good and helped me make my decision. I have heard a lot of stories about Ford dealers telling the customer to **** off or pay for the problem while the car is still under warranty or there's no problem and it's definitely there dammit. Customer service is really important, I would gladly buy a car (without thinking twice) that's half-decent quality wise if the dealer was good at service and maintenance. I totally concur...HOWEVER....if a dealer turns a customer AWAY for a problem whilst the vehicle is STILL under warranty there MUST be a reason as they get PAID to fix said problem.....NO dealer in their right mind would pull a stunt like that UNLESS there was a nother side to the story.....can we say aftermarket chips on a 6.0 engine?.........and sometimes people will come in with a problem that cannot be duplicated by the dealership......hard to fix something you cannot find.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I am not going to blame the dealer for that, if the customer broke the warranty then it's his fault and he should take %100 responsibility for what he did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I am not going to blame the dealer for that, if the customer broke the warranty then it's his fault and he should take %100 responsibility for what he did. unfortunately the offending customers do not see it that way all the time.......trust me...a dealer will NOT walk away from money unless there is a nother side to the story....if the customer needs a dose of people skills is another reason...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boegey Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I'd kind of forgotten that I haven't found a Ford dealership that I could honestly say that it's been a pleasure doing business with, but this week I've taken calls from two different family members that called me to complain about the way they've been treated by their dealer. Now these complaints are mostly about the service departments, and personally I've moved on to my fourth dealership over the last few years looking for one that had decent sales and service, and I'm still looking...... I hear very few complaints about Mercury/Lincoln dealers, but it seems like a never ending parade of belly aching about the Ford dealers, WTF? Is it just me? I'm going to kick around and find a phone number or two and give someone an earfull at Ford, not that they will care I'm certain. If anyone has any ideas who/where I can stir up the most trouble about this, drop me a line. I've been buying new Ford products since my '85 Cougar. I've learned and now recommend to friends to find a dealer with a good service department and forget how well or badly the sales staff treats you. For one transaction with a salesperson, good or bad, you'll have multiple trips to the service department, if for no other reason than regular maintenance. I have been to extremely good and extremely bad service departments. While living in Charleston, SC, I was deployed and my wife took our '87 Mustang GT Conv. in because in between shifts the rpm would go to 2000 rpm and stay there. Three times they told her there was nothing wrong. In fact, one mechanic told her it was normal for a high performance car to 'anticipate' the next shift! When I returned from sea, I took it in and they 'discovered' the fuel pressure regulator was too high and adjusted it. (By the way, the only reason the incompetent fools found this was because the service manager had a 5.0 LX with the same problem.) The sales people were great when we bought the car but service sucked. We never went back. While living in Temperence, MI (I cannot recall name of Ford dealer), my '91 Explorer was about 4000 miles out of warranty (back in the days of the 12/12000 warranty). The driver's side lift gate hinge welds broke loose (actually, of the 4 spot welds it appears only one was holding since the sheet metal tore at this one spot weld). The dealership contacted Ford's area rep. and the repair was covered in full. The dealership didn't need to go the extra mile but neither did the area service rep. I now live in MN and send all of my A-Plan and X-Plan buyers to Wolf Motors in Jordan. They supply a free loaner vehicle (the policy says they give a loaner if you bought your car from them, but to my knowledge they give a free loaner to anyone.) Normally, my car is repaired correctly the first time and when promised. Have I had one or two of those "Sorry, we could not replicate the problem." experiences? Sure. They cannot fix what they cannot get to malfunction. I think customers need to be realistic with their expectations. Many of us who have mechanical backgrounds or common sense get this, but lots and lots of people do not. Just my two cents. Boegey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I totally concur...HOWEVER....if a dealer turns a customer AWAY for a problem whilst the vehicle is STILL under warranty there MUST be a reason as they get PAID to fix said problem.....NO dealer in their right mind would pull a stunt like that UNLESS there was a nother side to the story.....can we say aftermarket chips on a 6.0 engine?.........and sometimes people will come in with a problem that cannot be duplicated by the dealership......hard to fix something you cannot find.... Yep, service shops make money by fixing vehicles, and if they are paid for warranty work, it's still money. I know that sometimes Ford will tell dealer that they will only pay for labor what they feel it takes to fix problem, and somtimes they can't get reimburesed if they bill for more hours that Ford feels is excessive. But the average customer should not even be aware of that issue. I imagine Ford dealers makes more money fixing out of warranty repairs, but they still get paid for warranty work also and I'm sure it makes up an important part of their business. I get annoyed reading posts claiming dealer refused to work on vehicle that is under warranty. Sometimes I don't think we get full story. I once power shifted a 5 liter Mustang I owned and scattered my clutch all over the road. I missed the shift and lost my clutch. Anyway, I took it to dealer where I bought it as it was under warranty, and they were suspicious about how I scattered it. They were not happy about fixing it under warranty, but they fixed it, and parked it close to anothe car, and someone slammed door into side of my car and left very large ding in it. Being all black car with red pinstriping, it showed up very well. I wasn't surprised car got bruised "accidently" as I know they thought I was screwing them. So we were even and I paid money to get ding fixed later. Hell, it was more dent then ding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Yep, service shops make money by fixing vehicles, and if they are paid for warranty work, it's still money. I know that sometimes Ford will tell dealer that they will only pay for labor what they feel it takes to fix problem, and somtimes they can't get reimburesed if they bill for more hours that Ford feels is excessive. But the average customer should not even be aware of that issue. I imagine Ford dealers makes more money fixing out of warranty repairs, but they still get paid for warranty work also and I'm sure it makes up an important part of their business. I get annoyed reading posts claiming dealer refused to work on vehicle that is under warranty. Sometimes I don't think we get full story. I once power shifted a 5 liter Mustang I owned and scattered my clutch all over the road. I missed the shift and lost my clutch. Anyway, I took it to dealer where I bought it as it was under warranty, and they were suspicious about how I scattered it. They were not happy about fixing it under warranty, but they fixed it, and parked it close to anothe car, and someone slammed door into side of my car and left very large ding in it. Being all black car with red pinstriping, it showed up very well. I wasn't surprised car got bruised "accidently" as I know they thought I was screwing them. So we were even and I paid money to get ding fixed later. Hell, it was more dent then ding. did you tell them what caused your clutch to shatter...or did you plead the fifth?????? and I truley doubt the ding was on purpose...Ford pays them ....not you....like I have stated....customers say NOTHING if it to their own benefit....but DEALERS seem to get the bum wrap...thanks for inadvertantly backing up my argument.........surprized they fixed a "wear" item..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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