BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Wait... what exactly are we debating here? You mean, people on a Ford forum don't like a Camaro? This is shocking? I thought you hated performance cars? Here, let me translate that for the rest of you. The above post should read "I got my little price comparison point proven wrong so now I have to try and change the topic and / or insult blackhorse." lol Maybe you didn't notice but this hole part of the forum is called "The Competition" and yes that means they talk about cars made by other companies here. If you don't like those cars, stay over in the Ford News forum. If you just wanna come here and bash on a GM because your a blind flag waiver, expect to get your talking points challenged when they are wrong. I would expect no less over the ford news forum. And no I don't hate performance cars. I just don't like little :cheerleader: who think the bestest and onliest performance car ever was the Mustang and all others are shit. It's a pretty narrow minded and naieve point of view to me. I don't think guys that do that are car guys, just big children. I just spent my entire Saturday watching Mustangs and Porsches race around a road course. Not really the way a guy who hates performance cars would spend his Saturday. The Mustangs by the way did quite well, finishing in the top three spots. Those Porsches just couldn't keep up on the straights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Maybe you didn't notice but this hole part of the forum is called "The Competition" and yes that means they talk about cars made by other companies here. Really, the hole thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wescoent Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Here, let me translate that for the rest of you. The above post should read "I got my little price comparison point proven wrong so now I have to try and change the topic and / or insult blackhorse." lol Maybe you didn't notice but this hole part of the forum is called "The Competition" and yes that means they talk about cars made by other companies here. If you don't like those cars, stay over in the Ford News forum. If you just wanna come here and bash on a GM because your a blind flag waiver, expect to get your talking points challenged when they are wrong. I would expect no less over the ford news forum. And no I don't hate performance cars. I just don't like little :cheerleader: who think the bestest and onliest performance car ever was the Mustang and all others are shit. It's a pretty narrow minded and naieve point of view to me. I don't think guys that do that are car guys, just big children. I just spent my entire Saturday watching Mustangs and Porsches race around a road course. Not really the way a guy who hates performance cars would spend his Saturday. The Mustangs by the way did quite well, finishing in the top three spots. Those Porsches just couldn't keep up on the straights. First of all... I think you low-balled your price estimates a little bit. I'd expect a V6 Camaro to come in at LEAST $24,000 to start. But we'll leave that to another day. Secondly... are you seriously trying to rationalize people's likes and dislikes of cars? Chevy fans love Camaros and hate Mustangs, and Ford fans love Mustangs and hate Camaros. There's no difference between the two except for some minor mechanical bits and slightly different looks. So why is there such insane love and hatred of two virtually identical cars? I think the Camaro looks like a cartoon, but I think the Mustang looks like a melted brick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I got my little price comparison point proven wrong so now I have to try and change the topic and / or insult blackhorse. Spoken like a true :cheerleader: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Really, the hole thing? What does a hole have to do with anything? Main Entry:1hole Pronunciation: \ˈhōl\ Function:noun Etymology:Middle English, from Old English hol (from neuter of hol, adjective, hollow) & holh; akin to Old High German hol, adjective, hollow and perhaps to Old English helan to conceal — more at hellDate:before 12th century 1 a: an opening through something : perforation <have a hole in my coat> b: an area where something is missing : gap: as (1): a serious discrepancy : flaw, weakness <some holes in your logic> (2): an opening in a defensive formation; especially : the area of a baseball field between the positions of shortstop and third baseman (3): a defect in a crystal (as of a semiconductor) that is due to an electron's having left its normal position in one of the crystal bonds and that is equivalent in many respects to a positively charged particle2: a hollowed-out place: as a: a cave, pit, or well in the ground b: burrow c: an unusually deep place in a body of water (as a river) 3 a: a wretched or dreary place b: a prison cell especially for solitary confinement4 a: a shallow cylindrical hole in the putting green of a golf course into which the ball is played b: a part of the golf course from tee to putting green <just beginning play on the third hole>; also : the play on such a hole as a unit of scoring <won the hole by two strokes>5 a: an awkward position or circumstance : fix <got the rebels out of a hole at the battle — Kenneth Roberts> b: a position of owing or losing money <$10 million in the hole> <raising money to get out of the hole> — in the hole 1: having a score below zero2: at a disadvantage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 What does a hole have to do with anything? I don't know, that's why I was asking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford-150 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 What does a hole have to do with anything? did you actually waste your time to post that? ok im liking what the Camaro has on paper(except its fat)...the exterior is way too cartoonish for me and i have already stated my opinion about the interior the V6 Camaro is definitely not going to be anywhere as fast as the Mustang GT, but it is still nice that it will be as fast as lets say a GTi the V8 Camaro is heavy but has a lot of power to move it im not going to compare the Camaro to the Mustang until they are both within 2 years of each other, which will probably be next year i will be extremely pissed if the '10 Mustang GT does not have the 5L and i would also hope a IRS could find its way but that is unlikely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevys Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 i will be extremely pissed if the '10 Mustang GT does not have the 5L and i would also hope a IRS could find its way but that is unlikely Get ready to be pissed then. The 5.0 wont make the show until 2011 and even then I want a DI version which wont likely be ready for a few more years. I have had time to think this over and Im not crazy about the camaro. I love the ls3 and the exterior looks ok but the interior is hideous. Im sure it will be a great performer but its too heavy and likely to be too expensive. I hope the mustang takes the approach of downsizing and shaving weight and keeping cost under control. If the 5.0 is everything I have heard it is that will be a fun car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 And I bet that after 38K, I could get the spark plugs out and the passenger side airbag would work correctly. Then why on Earth would you not buy this superior vehicle and revel in its fantastic interior and superior intake manifold and spark plugs? You can place an order now, you know. Be the first on your block! Lastly extreme, there's more to the equations between two cars than just weight, hp, and torque. You should factor in gearing and suspension packages. If I'm not mistaken the Camaro will be equipped with an IRS and if the two match up on twisty stretch of road somewhere that "could" be an advantage to the Camaro. I'm sure the IRS will coddle the Camaro's fat ass in comfort, but anybody who doesn't just get automotive info from internet forum posts knows that production IRS suspensions are biased toward ride rather than handling, and that the live-axle S197 Mustang GT outhandled the IRS-equipped GTO. I don't know, but you keep on posting anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Really, the hole thing? LOL, which only further prooves my point. When you can't deny or discount the message, then you focus on the fact that I left a "w" of of the word "w"hole. Try to focus on the steak and not the peas ok boys? SUV I know you've typed posts around here with typo's in them so get off it. Stay on topic on stay out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 LOL, which only further prooves my point. When you can't deny or discount the message, then you focus on the fact that I left a "w" of of the word "w"hole. Try to focus on the steak and not the peas ok boys? SUV I know you've typed posts around here with typo's in them so get off it. Stay on topic on stay out of it. I'm sorry. This is a public notice that all humour is banned from this forum. I repeat, all humour is banned from this form. That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 i will be extremely pissed if the '10 Mustang GT does not have the 5L and i would also hope a IRS could find its way but that is unlikely The 5 liter would be great. Personally I always thought the 5.0 was a great engine, it could just be because I came up during that era. However an IRS? Now see if Ford starts adding and IRS and bigger engines with bigger hp then essentially they are admitting that the Camaro is a better car. If it is or not remains to be seen. But with all of those things added the price of a Mustang will go up and at that point aren't you really just making a Ford Camaro? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I'm sorry. This is a public notice that all humour is banned from this forum. I repeat, all humour is banned from this form. That is all. If you're joking around bro try throwing an LOL or a :lol: after the post. Otherwise it just looks like you're trying to be a confrontational dick or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 If you're joking around bro try throwing an LOL or a :lol: after the post. Otherwise it just looks like you're trying to be a confrontational dick or something. I honestly was joking. Our discussions have been a little heated lately and I was trying to lighten the mood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 (edited) I'm sure the IRS will coddle the Camaro's fat ass in comfort, but anybody who doesn't just get automotive info from internet forum posts knows that production IRS suspensions are biased toward ride rather than handling, and that the live-axle S197 Mustang GT outhandled the IRS-equipped GTO. Really, so the IRS under this car was just all about ride comfort and not improving it over the stock suspension? No obviously it was about handling. As no one has road tested the V6 Camaro yet we can not say want manner of IRS is under there. That's why I said it "could" give the Camaro an advantage. Edited July 22, 2008 by BlackHorse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I honestly was joking. Our discussions have been a little heated lately and I was trying to lighten the mood. No hard feelings then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Really, so the IRS under this car was just all about ride comfort and not improving it over the stock suspension? No obviously it was about handling. As no one has road tested the V6 Camaro yet we can not say want manner of IRS is under there. That's why I said it "could" give the Camaro an advantage. I believe I recall reading something about the desire for IRS in the Cobra being because the average SVT buyer was older and wanted a more comfortable ride. Yes, it addressed some handling issues (well...sort of....my Cobra with its current SRA suspension would likely rape most IRS Cobras on a road course) but I remember hearing some mention of ride quality as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I believe I recall reading something about the desire for IRS in the Cobra being because the average SVT buyer was older and wanted a more comfortable ride. Yes, it addressed some handling issues (well...sort of....my Cobra with its current SRA suspension would likely rape most IRS Cobras on a road course) but I remember hearing some mention of ride quality as well. Some guys who drag raced them took the IRS out and put the live axle back in because it hooked up better but then drag racers don't do corners do they. It all depends on what you're wanting to do. I never heard the story about putting an IRS in the cobra to appease older buyers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Some guys who drag raced them took the IRS out and put the live axle back in because it hooked up better but then drag racers don't do corners do they. It all depends on what you're wanting to do. I never heard the story about putting an IRS in the cobra to appease older buyers. I'd like to think my SRA can do both pretty well. With the adjustable shocks and control arms, it's pretty simple to change its entire personality. I don't recall where I heard the IRS story....after all, it was almost 10 years ago now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I believe I recall reading something about the desire for IRS in the Cobra being because the average SVT buyer was older and wanted a more comfortable ride. Yes, it addressed some handling issues (well...sort of....my Cobra with its current SRA suspension would likely rape most IRS Cobras on a road course) but I remember hearing some mention of ride quality as well. Correct. Tom Scarpello wanted a "sophisticated" M3 fighter. The suspension was biased toward a better ride, and the '99 cars had problems with axle hop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackHorse Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Oh, one last thing on the whole "Impractical" jeeps and mustangs for silvrsvt. The Wrangler and the Mustang are both on the top ten highest resale value list. Wrangler # 2, Mustang # 4. ha ha. But take heart. We both beat out the #6 placed civic and the Accord didn't even make the list. Not so impractical now are we? http://comcast.vehix.com/tv/topTenLists.as...older1_comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Oh, one last thing on the whole "Impractical" jeeps and mustangs for silvrsvt. The Wrangler and the Mustang are both on the top ten highest resale value list. Wrangler # 2, Mustang # 4. ha ha. But take heart. We both beat out the #6 placed civic and the Accord didn't even make the list. Not so impractical now are we? http://comcast.vehix.com/tv/topTenLists.as...older1_comments Would be interesting to see when those numbers were compiled. If it was earlier in the year, the Wrangler and Mustang have both probably dropped since then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 still dislike the camaros styling....screams Hot-Wheels to me...hell it could weigh 2500lbs but the styling alone is clunky and heavy looking..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM2 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 (edited) Interestingly enough, as much as Edmunds made mention of the Mustangs small V8 pumping out just 300HP, other publications have tested it at 0-60Sec, in 4.9-5.1secs. The 422+HP Chevy Camaro SS with the 6.2L does it in about 4.9secs as well. ...and the weaker 400hp SS automatic has a quicker 0-60mph time of 4.6 sec?(!) Thats GT500 territory. Oppenheiser also claims that the automatic-equipped SS Camaro, which is rated at 400 hp, runs from zero to 60 mph in just 4.6 seconds and through the quarter-mile in 13.3 seconds. "We optimized the shift points," he said -edmunds Edited July 22, 2008 by AM2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 400 horsepower and 13.3 second 1/4 miles. Ugh. What is wrong here? I've seen cars (including my own) do better than that with 100 fewer horses. Something really needs to be done about the weight in some of these new cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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