Fiesta sales are out of control in Europe -

[Ford Jellymoulds]

As most of Europe's car sales charts headed south in a -12% drop towards the floorboards on average, the Fiesta's sales chart looks more like a Apollo 11 departure on 16th July 1969 with sales up +26.9%.

 

Fiesta's are nearly all sold to private buyers in Europe so it's going be a nice little earner this month, so Big Al will be able to have some caviar & champagne at the board meetings this month (Mind you after watching Al on the building of the tripple seven on the Discovery Channel it looked like he would not have a lot of time for such things) . Whilst it will be will be Walmarts packed lunch sandwiches from their nearly out of date gone off special offers shelf washed down with some grotty canteen vending machine coffee for Fritz & Bob as they stare at bankruptcy.

 

Europes top ten best selling cars April 2009

LINK

Edited May 15, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[jpd80]

Could it be Fiesta increased its sales by 7,000 sales at the expense of the Focus?

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Could it be Fiesta increased its sales by 7,000 sales at the expense of the Focus?

 

You could be right JPD the Focus is Europe's No 1 best selling Fleet/Rentalls car, but it could be mainly the Focus private buyers that are downsizing into the Fiesta that is very roomy inside for a small car and offers better fuel consumption, cheaper to buy with lower running costs in a economic downturn who know though as everybody elses small car sales apart from Fiat's sales are in a nosedive in Europe?

[jpd80]

You could be right JPD the Focus is Europe's No 1 best selling Fleet/Rentalls car, but it could be mainly the Focus private buyers that are downsizing into the Fiesta that is very roomy inside for a small car and offers better fuel consumption, cheaper to buy with lower running costs in a economic downturn who know though as everybody elses small car sales apart from Fiat's sales are in a nosedive in Europe?

Which supports my theory that all of Ford's vehicles are growing in size.

I think Ford Europe should have a Focus and a Focus based mid sizer - give the big Mondeo to the USA.

That way, the Mid Sizer would achieve much better and lower CO2 levels.

Edited May 15, 2009 by jpd80

[mettech]

The Fusion and the Fiesta are not platforms that should be celebrated.

 

Many believe that they are the light at the end of the tunnel for Ford. True, they will bring in more sales and higher profits.

 

However, in reality, they are nothing more than a train light at the end of the tunnel for the USA auto worker.

 

Those two platforms along with GM plan to import China cars will cause more harm to the USA auto workers than Toyota and Honda have with its imports.. (not transplants...., imports)

Edited May 15, 2009 by mettech

[jpd80]

The Fusion and the Fiesta are not platforms that should be celebrated.

 

Many believe that they are the light at the end of the tunnel for Ford. True, they will bring in more sales and higher profits.

 

However, in reality, they are nothing more than a train light at the end of the tunnel for the USA auto worker.

 

Those two platforms along with GM plan to import China cars will cause more harm to USA the auto workers than Toyota and Honda have with its imports.. (not transplants...., imports)

You cannot prove that last statement, the harm was done years ago.

The UAW is just paying the price for Ford/GM/Chrysler's decades of incompetence.

Building cars in Mexico and Canada is necessary because of the super low cost base of competitors.

Edited May 15, 2009 by jpd80

[mettech]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

Thank you for your Internet inquiry on the 2009 Honda Civic Sedan. Below is the quote you requested along with additional information about our company, policies, and products.

 

 

2009 CIVIC SEDAN MSRP INTERNET

DX MANUAL $16,175.00 $14,516.19

DX AUTO $16,975.00 $15,249.95

VP MANUAL $16,925.00 $15,204.09

VP AUTO $17,725.00 $15,937.85

LX MANUAL $18,125.00 $16,304.73

LX AUTO $18,925.00 $17,038.49

LX-S MANUAL $18,725.00 $16,855.05

LX-S AUTO $19,525.00 $17,588.81

EX MANUAL $19,975.00 $17,751.55

EX AUTO $20,775.00 $18,485.31

EX MANUAL/NAVI $21,975.00 $19,585.95

EX AUTO/NAVI $22,775.00 $20,319.71

EX-L MANUAL $21,525.00 $19,173.21

EX-L AUTO $22,325.00 $19,906.97

EX-L MANUAL/NAVI $23,525.00 $21,007.61

EX-L AUTO/NAVI $24,325.00 $21,741.37

 

The internet price includes the destination charge of $670.00 and the Mud Guard Protection Package (a $159.00 value). Pricing does not include the sales tax or fees.

 

The Fusion and Fiesta will be the largest sellers for Ford in the coming years. Their sales will cause more harm to USA workers then a USA made Civic will.

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

Edited May 15, 2009 by mettech

[jpd80]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

 

 

The Fusion and Fiesta will be the largest sellers for Ford in the coming years. Their sales will cause more harm to USA workers then a USA made Civic will.

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

1.)

Because Honda builds its cars from imported parts, the labor involved in building cars

is about 10% of the total cost - one of the biggest UAW gripes with cutting conditions.

 

2.) Focus based products will be much bigger than Fusion and Fiesta sales, that's why Ford is

devoting two to three plants to the c1 architecture and derivatives.

 

3.) because D3 are big vehicles and people are moving to smaller more efficient vehicles.

 

I sincerely believe Ford will rebuild its name and empire with good products

and that more work will flow back to the USA as people realize the newer

Fords are easy to build, look good and are high quality.

The C1 has the ability to be lengthened and widened to a qazi D sized car,

it is this product along with the Focus hatch that will drive Ford sales in the USA.

 

Oh, and let's not forget the former F Truck plant in Mexico now producing Fiestas,

all that F Truck production cam back to US factories.

Edited May 15, 2009 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

 

Because its lot harder to ship a car over the Pacific then it is from Canada or Mexico....

[mettech]

1.)

Because Honda builds its cars from imported parts, the labor involved in building cars

is about 10% of the total cost - one of the biggest UAW gripes with cutting conditions.

2.) Focus based products will be much bigger than Fusion and Fiesta sales, that's why Ford is

devoting two to three plants to the c1 architecture and derivatives.

 

3.) because D3 are big vehicles and people are moving to smaller more efficient vehicles.

 

I sincerely believe Ford will rebuild its name and empire with good products

and that more work will flow back to the USA as people realize the newer

Fords are easy to build, look good and are high quality.

The C1 has the ability to be lengthened and widened to a qazi D sized car,

it is this product along with the Focus hatch that will drive Ford sales in the USA.

 

Oh, and let's not forget the former F Truck plant in Mexico now producing Fiestas,

all that F Truck production cam back to US factories.

 

Take a look at the "USA made Contents" on a Civic vs a Fusion. You will be surprised.

[mettech]

Because its lot harder to ship a car over the Pacific then it is from Canada or Mexico....

 

?

[NickF1011]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

 

 

The Fusion and Fiesta will be the largest sellers for Ford in the coming years. Their sales will cause more harm to USA workers then a USA made Civic will.

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

 

Aren't you forgetting about a little American-made car called the Focus? It will undoubtedly outsell the Fiesta by a margin of 2 to 1 at the very least. And as has been pointed out a thousand times before -- nobody builds a B-car in the U.S. You can make your argument about the Fusion, but I just don't see where the Fiesta belongs in any of this.

[jobu37]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

 

 

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

 

1st question

Because that competitive price that you are referencing is usually alot closer to the actual selling price for Honda while Ford's transaction price on the Focus is at least $2,000.00 below where the Honda transaction takes place. So Ford has had to sell their cars that cost them more to build for less money. Fortunately, with the latest iteration of the Focus this gap has closed a bit and will close more with the next Focus since the labor agreement in place for that will put Ford on more level footing on the cost side and one would expect that Ford will be able to exert more pricing power on the retail side with the more desirable attributes of the future Focus.

 

2nd question

How many of those transplants are moving into Michigan? Ford moved production out of the U.S. under the old labor agreement. On future product plans it is very likely that the U.S. plants will be more competitive with Mexico and you can very well anticipate to see U.S. plants win more future production. Louisville for instance is just waiting to find what C platform vehicle it will be getting in the future.

 

Perhaps you would have preferred it if Ford would have built the Fusion in the U.S four years ago which would have allowed them to make maybe a third (if that much) as much profit on each unit sold under the ridiculous labor agreements that were still in place at that time. Maybe if you had had your desire we could see Ford in the same predicament that GM and Chrysler are currently in. I'm one that is all about buying American made products and make quite the effort to do so every chance I get. But if labor is going to price themselves out of the running for new product I can certainly understand why a corporation such as Ford has no choice but to move to a more economically feasible production site. At least it wasn't across the globe. A healthy Mexico leads to more U.S. exports while a healthy Asia provides less benefit to U.S. exports since we only have one-way free trade with most Asian countries. And that one-way is not in our favor.

 

If the current Fusion continues to demonstrate strength it is possible that Louisville may get a shift of Fusion production to go along with whatever C-car version they land. Or if the Mustang doesn't use up all the non-Mazda6 capacity at Flat Rock it may be possible that they get a shift of Fusion production. The difference now as opposed to four years ago is that both these plants are in the running whereas there was no economic reason to consider them four years ago.

[LSFan00]

A healthy Asia would be a great thing, just as a healthy Mexico would be. Mexico is a LOT wealthier today than 20 years ago, and hopefully their society and government will improve vs. the violence/corruption seemingly growing still today. As for China alone as an indicator in Asia, in 1985 average income in China was $293; in 2006 the average income is $2,025, and I think it's over $2500 now. They're unquestionably becoming wealthier, but freedom/change is a real challenge for the entire continent.

 

There's a lot of racist demagoguery on here about the auto market, and products from around the world. The best way to reinvigorate our manufacturing in my opinion is to see a healthier world economy.

[Surgen]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

 

 

The Fusion and Fiesta will be the largest sellers for Ford in the coming years. Their sales will cause more harm to USA workers then a USA made Civic will.

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

 

The Civic is a competitor to the Focus -- All Focus's are made in the U.S. Not all Civic's are (some are made in Canada).

 

The Honda Fit is by far the best selling subcompact. It was outsold last month by the Ford Focus and Ford Mustang (as well as the Ford Fusion). There is no reason to believe that the Fiesta will outsell Focus or Mustang.

 

And by the way -- there is not a single sub-compact car manufactured in the U.S. Not by ANYONE.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

The Fusion and the Fiesta are not platforms that should be celebrated.

 

Many believe that they are the light at the end of the tunnel for Ford. True, they will bring in more sales and higher profits.

 

However, in reality, they are nothing more than a train light at the end of the tunnel for the USA auto worker.

 

Those two platforms along with GM plan to import China cars will cause more harm to the USA auto workers than Toyota and Honda have with its imports.. (not transplants...., imports)

 

Gotta say l agree with you 100%, it saddens and hurts me a lot to see Fiesta's & Fusions being built in South America. Ford is an American company entity first priority perks should be to build 100% of its cars for North American market in Detroit which is its homebase in world. Fiesta & Fusions might double their sales if they had a "made in the USA" tag & not to forget the billions $$$ from workers wages would stay in the US economy, it would be win win for the US taxpayer who would not have to pay keep unemployed folk to produce nothing, do nothing and leading a life of crime on the dole.

 

What makes it stink a bit is Germany CAN produce small cars like the new Fiesta in Germany which is the most expensive place in the world to build cars by German hands that are also the highest paid hands in the world. Do folk desert the Fiesta because it to expensive NOOOOOOOOO they don't it hangs out at the top of Europes top ten sellers.

 

Fiesta's & Fusions can't be built in Detriot? Bullshit - If expensive Germany can why can't Detroit, things neeeeeeed to change this is sheer and utter madness. Ford can prop up deadwood like Jaguar/Land Rover with 15 billions which never returned 1 dime in profit for decades which didnot bring one job to Detroit, yet they worry about saving a few bucks by producing Fusions in South America and waste millions paying Germans sky high wages in Cologne to build Fiesta's, gotta say l just dont get it.

Edited May 15, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[blazerdude20]

The Civic is a competitor to the Focus -- All Focus's are made in the U.S. Not all Civic's are (some are made in Canada).

 

The Honda Fit is by far the best selling subcompact. It was outsold last month by the Ford Focus and Ford Mustang (as well as the Ford Fusion). There is no reason to believe that the Fiesta will outsell Focus or Mustang.

 

And by the way -- there is not a single sub-compact car manufactured in the U.S. Not by ANYONE.

 

some civics are still built in japan as well (hybrid, si) so its kind of a moot point. people want to complain about usa workers losing their jobs, but what they fail to realize is that north america as a whole is becoming a large single economy, similar to the EU. whats good for the economies of mexico and canada will help america as well, usually.

[focus05]

Why is it that Honda can build the Civic in the USA at a completive price?

 

The Fusion and Fiesta will be the largest sellers for Ford in the coming years. Their sales will cause more harm to USA workers then a USA made Civic will.

 

Why is it that more transplants are coming to the USA while the D3 are moving out of the USA?

 

Labor cost is only part of the equation. Ford doesn't have enough demand in NA to fill a factory at UAW labor rates. However, if it could export its Fusion to South America or its Edge or its Flex, then they'd be able to produce them in the U.S. However, if they produce them in the U.S., their cars would be heavily taxed going into South America, and that would hurt sales. So, they produce them in Canada and Mexico where there are no such restrictions.

 

I predict that if the Fusion and MKZ grow to be a 350k-400k/year vehicles across North and South America, you will see another plant producing them, and it will probably be in the U.S. The Fiesta just cannot be made stateside. However, the UAW should be happy that 2 of Ford's 3 C plants will be in the U.S. All or almost all C-platform cars sold in the U.S. will be built in the U.S. Eventually, if consumer demand changes drastically towards B, C and CD cars and prices go up, Ford may be able to build most of the ones sold in the U.S. in the U.S.

 

However, it's economics plain and simple. Some of it to do with the cost of employing an American worker in the areas where Ford operates plants. Note that Honda and Toyota can't build the Fit and Yaris here either. The only exceptions to high American labor cost are plants in the deep south. Some of the economics have nothing to do with American labor costs - like trade tariffs between countries (go talk to the corn farmers).

 

In the end, you have to take a holistic view of Ford. A job exists directly to support the product the person is producing. However, it is indirectly supported by all of Ford. If Ford produces the Fiesta in the U.S., it will lose money on them. If it doesn't produce the Fiesta, Ford will lose out on a market that is performing slightly better than the industry and is predicted to gain marketshare. They may also be fined money for violation of CAFE. In all those cases, Ford loses sales, money or both, which cuts from its development budget. That, in turn, lowers sales even more and eventually the original person producing cars in the U.S. is out of a job. At which point the person could go work for Toyota or Hyundai who either do take advantage of regional economic factors or pay terribly.

 

Keep in mind that there are also 15,000 people working up in Dearborn. And although Ford may have passed up on 3,000 UAW workers building at two plants, they will be able to retain 15,000 workers who are just as critical a piece to the economy as a laborer in manufacturing.

 

I disagree that these vehicles are a danger to U.S. labor. The Fiesta and Fusion will ultimately help save Ford. The Fusion in and of itself has raised the profile of Ford - specifically in the mind of Consumer Reports, which influences millions of brain-washed individuals. The Fusion is a high-quality vehicle that is getting traffic into Ford showrooms again and raising the perception of the Ford brand. The Fiesta will get young drivers into a Ford and probably keep them there. They will eventually upgrade to a Focus-based product produced in the US. They might even buy an Explorer produced in Chicago or a truck produced in Kansas City. I believe that Ford's real revolution might come on the back of two Mexican built products - but it won't be at the expense of the American laborer in the long run. It will be to the benefit of those workers.

 

And how do you prove that Ford needs to keep American laborers around for the long haul? By putting the highest effort into your job as possible. Top quality numbers. Identification of waste in the system. Flexibility when your plant needs it. It's what I have to do in my job every day (half our company is off-shore, and I have to constantly prove why I'm better at 4x the cost), but the U.S. labor base will be that much more successful because of it.

 

I have every confidence you can do it, mettech. And I have every confidence in the Ford's U.S. workers.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Labor cost is only part of the equation. Ford doesn't have enough demand in NA to fill a factory at UAW labor rates. However, if it could export its Fusion to South America or its Edge or its Flex, then they'd be able to produce them in the U.S. However, if they produce them in the U.S., their cars would be heavily taxed going into South America, and that would hurt sales. So, they produce them in Canada and Mexico where there are no such restrictions.

 

I predict that if the Fusion and MKZ grow to be a 350k-400k/year vehicles across North and South America, you will see another plant producing them, and it will probably be in the U.S. The Fiesta just cannot be made stateside. However, the UAW should be happy that 2 of Ford's 3 C plants will be in the U.S. All or almost all C-platform cars sold in the U.S. will be built in the U.S. Eventually, if consumer demand changes drastically towards B, C and CD cars and prices go up, Ford may be able to build most of the ones sold in the U.S. in the U.S.

 

However, it's economics plain and simple. Some of it to do with the cost of employing an American worker in the areas where Ford operates plants. Note that Honda and Toyota can't build the Fit and Yaris here either. The only exceptions to high American labor cost are plants in the deep south. Some of the economics have nothing to do with American labor costs - like trade tariffs between countries (go talk to the corn farmers).

 

In the end, you have to take a holistic view of Ford. A job exists directly to support the product the person is producing. However, it is indirectly supported by all of Ford. If Ford produces the Fiesta in the U.S., it will lose money on them. If it doesn't produce the Fiesta, Ford will lose out on a market that is performing slightly better than the industry and is predicted to gain marketshare. They may also be fined money for violation of CAFE. In all those cases, Ford loses sales, money or both, which cuts from its development budget. That, in turn, lowers sales even more and eventually the original person producing cars in the U.S. is out of a job. At which point the person could go work for Toyota or Hyundai who either do take advantage of regional economic factors or pay terribly.

 

Keep in mind that there are also 15,000 people working up in Dearborn. And although Ford may have passed up on 3,000 UAW workers building at two plants, they will be able to retain 15,000 workers who are just as critical a piece to the economy as a laborer in manufacturing.

 

I disagree that these vehicles are a danger to U.S. labor. The Fiesta and Fusion will ultimately help save Ford. The Fusion in and of itself has raised the profile of Ford - specifically in the mind of Consumer Reports, which influences millions of brain-washed individuals. The Fusion is a high-quality vehicle that is getting traffic into Ford showrooms again and raising the perception of the Ford brand. The Fiesta will get young drivers into a Ford and probably keep them there. They will eventually upgrade to a Focus-based product produced in the US. They might even buy an Explorer produced in Chicago or a truck produced in Kansas City. I believe that Ford's real revolution might come on the back of two Mexican built products - but it won't be at the expense of the American laborer in the long run. It will be to the benefit of those workers.

 

And how do you prove that Ford needs to keep American laborers around for the long haul? By putting the highest effort into your job as possible. Top quality numbers. Identification of waste in the system. Flexibility when your plant needs it. It's what I have to do in my job every day (half our company is off-shore, and I have to constantly prove why I'm better at 4x the cost), but the U.S. labor base will be that much more successful because of it.

 

I have every confidence you can do it, mettech. And I have every confidence in the Ford's U.S. workers.

 

How can Ford waste billions of $$$ building the Fiesta in expensive Germany that have the highest manufacturing costs in the world when it could have been built for a fraction of the cost elsewhere in Europe making billions for Ford in extra profits?

 

Do Germans have ten hands or something compared to an Americans auto workers two? Gotta say l have never heard such a lot of shit, build them in Detroit for Godsake you are an American company not Mexican Pedro's Motor Company.

Edited May 15, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds

[rmc523]

?

 

He's saying that it's cheaper/easier to ship the cars in from Canada/Mexico than it is to ship them across the Pacific from Japan.

 

In other words, it makes more sense for the Japanese companies to produce here because 1) they don't have the legacy costs the D3 do, 2) it's better/easier/(cheaper?) for them to produce in the US where the cars are being sold than it would be to produce them in Japan and then ship them halfway across the world.

 

Ford on the other hand, has higher legacy costs, and until now the unfavorable union contracts, which makes it better/easier/cheaper for them to produce the cars in Mexico/Canada.

 

So essentially, both companies are following the better/easier/cheaper (at the time these decisions were made) plans, respectively.

[Extreme4x4]

Gotta say l agree with you 100%, it saddens and hurts me a lot to see Fiesta's & Fusions being built in South America. Ford is an American company entity first priority perks should be to build 100% of its cars for North American market in Detroit which is its homebase in world. Fiesta & Fusions might double their sales if they had a "made in the USA" tag & not to forget the billions $$$ from workers wages would stay in the US economy, it would be win win for the US taxpayer who would not have to pay keep unemployed folk to produce nothing, do nothing and leading a life of crime on the dole.

 

 

Of course you don't get it................ you think that Mexico is in South America.

 

Mexico is one of our NAFTA partners, and is in North America............... the same continent that the United States, and Canada are in.

 

It has been explained over and over, why the Fusion and Fiesta are being built in Mexico. I refuse to get into in again, since you won't retain the information anyway.

 

That may sound harsh, but it has been in, probably, 20 threads already................ and you still haven't retained it. What would make me think that this time would be any different.

 

Same with Mettech.

[focus05]

How can Ford waste billions of $$$ building the Fiesta in expensive Germany that have the highest manufacturing costs in the world when it could have been built for a fraction of the cost elsewhere in Europe making billions for Ford in extra profits?

 

Do Germans have ten hands or something compared to an Americans auto workers two? Gotta say l have never heard such a lot of shit, build them in Detroit for Godsake you are an American company not Mexican Pedro's Motor Company.

 

Cost of complex in Germany for Fiesta: $1 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mill (est)

Cost of workers/year: $500 mill (high est)

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Low

 

Cost of complex in Eastern Europe for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mil (est)

Cost of workers/year: $200 mill

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Moderate, unknown labor force

 

Higher labor costs, but upfront investment would be high for a cheap labor market. Low risks. Germany wins. Ford can slowly penetrate the Eastern European market to test the waters (see Romanian plant where overflow for Fiesta/B-Max and new 1.0 engine will be).

 

Cost of complex in US for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mill (est)

Cost of workers/year: $500 mil (low est in 2007 when they were choosing a spot, cheaper now)

Cost of exporting to South America: $200 mill/year

Risks: Low

 

Cost of complex in Mexico for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mil (est)

Cost of workers/year: $150 mill

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Moderate, drug cartel activity

 

Similar upfront costs since Ford does not have a suitable facility in either location (and gov'ts equally likely to provide tax incentives). But labor and tariffs just clobber any advantage they try to get. Mexico wins.

 

Similarly (but in reverse direction), if Fiesta becomes a runaway success on this hemisphere, Ford will likely equip a facility somewhere in the U.S. to produce B-segment cars. But it would be supplmental and NA market only since they cannot be exported to much of South America.

 

The new UAW contract also eliminated a lot of labor cost risks to Ford in the U.S. They will now be able to invest in plants based on a hourly rate that is nearly $25/hour cheaper than just two years ago. Because of that and the DoE loans, we will see significant U.S. investment over the next 2-3 years.

 

Why do I even bother, though...

[mettech]

Of course you don't get it................ you think that Mexico is in South America.

 

Mexico is one of our NAFTA partners, and is in North America............... the same continent that the United States, and Canada are in.

 

It has been explained over and over, why the Fusion and Fiesta are being built in Mexico. I refuse to get into in again, since you won't retain the information anyway.

 

That may sound harsh, but it has been in, probably, 20 threads already................ and you still haven't retained it. What would make me think that this time would be any different.

 

Same with Mettech.

 

Civic.... I think have three plants in NA and two are in USA and one in Canada

Link

 

Focus one plant in NA

Link

 

Honda is able to build and profit from the Civic, CR-V and Element that are made in the USA.

 

Mazda is able to build and profit from the 6 here in the USA.

 

Two out of the three newest platforms from Ford will be imported. I would not be surprised to see the Mexico imports become the top selling platforms for Ford within 5 years.

 

I would expect that Honda's (Civic and Accord) best selling performer along with Toyota's (Camry and Corolla) will be made here in the USA.

 

It appears that GM will import (from China) most of it's new platforms.

 

 

How many see a trend here. :shades:

[Pioneer]

2 of Ford's 3 C plants will be in the U.S.

 

WHat other "C" plant other than MAP and Louisville? The Cuautitlán plant is going to a "B" platform (Fiesta).

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Cost of complex in Germany for Fiesta: $1 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mill (est)

Cost of workers/year: $500 mill (high est)

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Low

 

Cost of complex in Eastern Europe for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mil (est)

Cost of workers/year: $200 mill

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Moderate, unknown labor force

 

Higher labor costs, but upfront investment would be high for a cheap labor market. Low risks. Germany wins. Ford can slowly penetrate the Eastern European market to test the waters (see Romanian plant where overflow for Fiesta/B-Max and new 1.0 engine will be).

 

Cost of complex in US for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mill (est)

Cost of workers/year: $500 mil (low est in 2007 when they were choosing a spot, cheaper now)

Cost of exporting to South America: $200 mill/year

Risks: Low

 

Cost of complex in Mexico for Fiesta: $3 billion

Cost of optimizing supply base: $250 mil (est)

Cost of workers/year: $150 mill

Cost of exports: $0

Risks: Moderate, drug cartel activity

 

Similar upfront costs since Ford does not have a suitable facility in either location (and gov'ts equally likely to provide tax incentives). But labor and tariffs just clobber any advantage they try to get. Mexico wins.

 

Similarly (but in reverse direction), if Fiesta becomes a runaway success on this hemisphere, Ford will likely equip a facility somewhere in the U.S. to produce B-segment cars. But it would be supplmental and NA market only since they cannot be exported to much of South America.

 

The new UAW contract also eliminated a lot of labor cost risks to Ford in the U.S. They will now be able to invest in plants based on a hourly rate that is nearly $25/hour cheaper than just two years ago. Because of that and the DoE loans, we will see significant U.S. investment over the next 2-3 years.

 

Why do I even bother, though...

 

I know why you bother because you are GERMAN

 

Gotta say with all your dodgy numbers & knowlege of what you think it costs and a name like Focus 05 that's also built in EXPENSIVE Germany the world's most EXPENSIVE place to build cars built by the worlds most highest paid EXPENSIVE workforce, the one any only reason you still build Ford cars in Germany is because you are the most EXPENSIVE workforce in the world to get rid of. With the minimum redundancy costs of 2 year full pay & full cost of retraining you for a new job outside the world of making cars for Ford makes the German worker almost unsackable the cost would be to prohibitive for Ford under German law. UK just like the US has lost most of its manufacturing base because we are the easiest cheapest to hire and fire. France is not as bad as Germany but it will still cost $150,000 pay off to get rid of French car worker, in the UK you can get rid of a Brit car worker with 20 year service for just under $7,500. Thats why GM want to dump Opel on somebody else rather than pay its German workforce off. Fiat also have said they will keep the German Opel plants open and close the British plants down because it will cost them next to nothing and would have lost billions in German redundancy payments if they had to shut down the Opel plants.

LINK

 

.Labour Costs

A West German car worker earns 10 times more an hour than his or her Czech counterpart, Toyota, which hopes to sell 1m cars in Europe for the first time this year, has joined forces with Peugeot Citroën at a new Czech plant in Kolin.

LINK

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Known Build Quality

Skoda Czech 5 star & Toyota's Czech 4 star build quality is better than a EXPENSIVE German made Ford average 3 star rated build quality.

 

 

 

Gotta say l didnot see many links in your post Fritz it looks all made up dross, the plants wind power is about the only good thing the Fiesta plant has in Germany everything else is more expensive in Germany than a Czech made Fiesta or Focus, Czech could also build better quality cars for Ford than German workers can at a fraction of the cost saving Ford billions in the process what do you think Fritz? please supply some LINKS rather than your empty dreams.

 

If Ford can built in your EXPENSIVE Germany and not build Fiesta's & Fusions just for the North American market in Detroit Fords home base something is very wrong, Ford have lost the plot they are an American car company not a Mexican Car Company they should there to benefit the US economy the most. If Ford moved production of the Fiesta & Focus out of Germany and let the Czech build them Ford would save billions Fritz.

Edited May 15, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds