rmc523 Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 (edited) retracted. Edited June 8, 2009 by rmc523 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 Perhaps Blueblood is willing to pay to put new powertrains (and all related expenses) in the TC for the couple years before it's produced here? This is why I hardly post here anymore, you can't even make a comment on something with out being insulted and trolled by RJ and his band of immature followers that have ruined this website. Why don't you get a hobby, you have how many posts now in such a short time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 you can't even make a comment on something with out being insulted your posts are insulting and you are insulted. You might as well complain about getting wet when you go swimming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 (edited) This time next year, the arguments about importing the C1 Focus will be moot, the next Focus is built in the USA along with specific derivatives and it wouldn't surprise if Transit Connect finally moves from the old C 170 platform to C2. Edited June 6, 2009 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 (edited) This is why I hardly post here anymore, you can't even make a comment on something with out being insulted and trolled by RJ and his band of immature followers that have ruined this website. Why don't you get a hobby, you have how many posts now in such a short time? Think about all the factors regarding the TC. The TC is (currently) made in Turkey. Last I read here, TC production is to be moved here to the US in the next few years, if that. That's your first factor.....do you think Ford would spend the time, money, etc. to ship all the parts and engines overseas and to also train the employees on the new equipment they'll need to install into US-bound TC's for a vehicle that's production (for US consumption) will be removed from that plant within the next year or two? That would likely eliminate any profit they're gonna pull out of what they will be doing. Second (and this is also an important one), Ford will bring (IIRC) 20,000 of them here to the US this year, no? 2008 production for Ford's Turkey plant was about 320,000 from what I could find. I'm not sure the split between Transit's and Transit Connects, but I doubt those 20,000 units would make up a large percentage of their TC output. So right there, is another reason it doesn't make sense - with the relatively small number of US-bound TC's, it doesn't make sense to do all the work to put new powertrains into them, which again would require changing production techniques, etc., especially with the upcoming production move. Another factor is the fact that European models won't be getting different powertrains from what we're getting (I mean, yeah they have other options, but not a larger I4). ----As a side note - I don't know the percentage of gas-to-diesel TC sales, but it seems that the Euro model manages fine with the I4 we're recieving.... Now, if production of models for US consumption weren't being shipped here to the US within the next year or so, I'd fully support your complaints - especially if (when?) US sales increase/take off (in this case, you'd wanna further improve the product, increasing Ford's commercial marketshare, etc...) and/or are lackluster (in this case, companies may not think it can handle the loads with the current powertrain, so it needs a powertrain boost to help sales). BUT, production is shifting here soon, as well as the low percentage of production numbers, eliminating both problems. It simply would not be cost effective for Ford to give it new powertrains in the current setup. ----- Now, as for the personal attack.....if you don't like the fact that I post a lot, ok that's fine. Is it gonna change the way I post? No, most likely not. Is there really a problem with the way I post? I don't know how others (aside from yourself) feel, but I feel as though most of the time I contribute to many of the topics at hand. Have there been times where I throw a post in just to have a post? Sure there have been, but I'll be the first to admit it. Also, after I first joined, I didn't realize there was a multi-quote "tool," so that led to a large number of my posts, as I would reply to multiple thoughts/posts in separate post boxes, again because I didn't realize there was a better way to do it. Some were understandably getting frustrated with that and pointed out the mulit-post feature, and I happily complied (also made it easier on me trying to get thoughts across). I'm sorry you feel that way about my posting habits. If RJ and/or others here want me to change my habits, I'll do my best, but with the exception I just explained, I haven't gotten the impression they want me to change the way I post. As for hobbies, I've got plenty - I play soccer, am a state-champion track runner/athlete, a straight A college student with the exception of one or two classes, and probably my personal favorite - I draw. Here's some of my work: ....with more scattered about the forums here, and many, many (literally hundreds) more that I'd rather not post here (PREMiERdrum can fill you in on the quality of the one's I haven't posted). Also, you can see the photochops section for more of my hobbies in the form of chops. So just because I post a lot here doesn't mean I don't do anything else. ----- Back to the topic currently being discussed. Edited June 7, 2009 by rmc523 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 Think about all the factors regarding the TC. The TC is (currently) made in Turkey. Last I read here, TC production is to be moved here to the US in the next few years, if that. That's your first factor.....do you think Ford would spend the time, money, etc. to ship all the parts and engines overseas and to also train the employees on the new equipment they'll need to install into US-bound TC's for a vehicle that's production (for US consumption) will be removed from that plant within the next year or two? That would likely eliminate any profit they're gonna pull out of what they will be doing. Second (and this is also an important one), Ford will bring (IIRC) 20,000 of them here to the US this year, no? 2008 production for Ford's Turkey plant was about 320,000 from what I could find. I'm not sure the split between Transit's and Transit Connects, but I doubt those 20,000 units would make up a large percentage of their TC output. So right there, is another reason it doesn't make sense - with the relatively small number of US-bound TC's, it doesn't make sense to do all the work to put new powertrains into them, which again would require changing production techniques, etc., especially with the upcoming production move. Another factor is the fact that European models won't be getting different powertrains from what we're getting (I mean, yeah they have other options, but not a larger I4). ----As a side note - I don't know the percentage of gas-to-diesel TC sales, but it seems that the Euro model manages fine with the I4 we're recieving.... Now, if production of models for US consumption weren't being shipped here to the US within the next year or so, I'd fully support your complaints - especially if (when?) US sales increase/take off (in this case, you'd wanna further improve the product, increasing Ford's commercial marketshare, etc...) and/or are lackluster (in this case, companies may not think it can handle the loads with the current powertrain, so it needs a powertrain boost to help sales). BUT, production is shifting here soon, as well as the low percentage of production numbers, eliminating both problems. It simply would not be cost effective for Ford to give it new powertrains in the current setup. ----- Now, as for the personal attack.....if you don't like the fact that I post a lot, ok that's fine. Is it gonna change the way I post? No, most likely not. Is there really a problem with the way I post? I don't know how others (aside from yourself) feel, but I feel as though most of the time I contribute to many of the topics at hand. Have there been times where I throw a post in just to have a post? Sure there have been, but I'll be the first to admit it. Also, after I first joined, I didn't realize there was a multi-quote "tool," so that led to a large number of my posts, as I would reply to multiple thoughts/posts in separate post boxes, again because I didn't realize there was a better way to do it. Some were understandably getting frustrated with that and pointed out the mulit-post feature, and I happily complied (also made it easier on me trying to get thoughts across). I'm sorry you feel that way about my posting habits. If RJ and/or others here want me to change my habits, I'll do my best, but with the exception I just explained, I haven't gotten the impression they want me to change the way I post. As for hobbies, I've got plenty - I play soccer, am a state-champion track runner/athlete, a straight A college student with the exception of one or two classes, and probably my personal favorite - I draw. Here's some of my work: ....with more scattered about the forums here, and many, many (literally hundreds) more that I'd rather not post here (PREMiERdrum can fill you in on the quality of the one's I haven't posted). Also, you can see the photochops section for more of my hobbies in the form of chops. So just because I post a lot here doesn't mean I don't do anything else. ----- Back to the topic currently being discussed. [/thread win] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 your posts are insulting and you are insulted. You might as well complain about getting wet when you go swimming. Bluebood complains about rmc523 posting too much, yet he has 2800+ posts? He certainly seems to like the attention, judging by his provocative comments....another P-71 in the making! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 Bluebood complains about rmc523 posting too much, yet he has 2800+ posts? He certainly seems to like the attention, judging by his provocative comments....another P-71 in the making! His complaint is because he joined in almost 10 years ago in Sept. of '99 and now has 2894 posts, while I joined almost 2 years ago in July of '07 and now have 9872 posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 ... It simply would not be cost effective for Ford to give it new powertrains in the current setup. I don't disagree with this statement. I just bugs me knowing that if the TC was built in the US, where we have the technology readily available, it would be soooooo much better ! The next generation TC assembled in the US will not likely share any parts with this generation, making these few years of production "orphans". Remember the Versailles ? P.S. "Soon" is always relative. My bet is, they won't start building TCs in the US until 2012CY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 your posts are insulting and you are insulted. You might as well complain about getting wet when you go swimming. Wow, so now you resort to lying to cover for your favored members. Pathetic. I never insulted ANYBODY, I was personally attacked and insulted by several people, totally un-provoked, and you accuse me of insulting people? Go read the thread again mr. "moderator". Robert Lane should remove your moderator status, as you are nothing of the sort, this board was not intended to be a cheer squad for Ford, people shouldn't have to face insults for discussing things. You set a horrible example for people like rmc who thinks it's ok to be rude, condescending, and insulting because he knows you'll let him get away with it. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index...showtopic=32068 You're not following your own rules, and I really don't care, but the hypocrisy and the hyper-sensitivity among some people here is ridiculous, you can't even offer up constructive criticism anymore without being attacked. It's a shame because this used to be the best Ford website out there, now it's like reading Ford's press releases, it's boring and debate is dead, unless you consider "Toyota SUCKS! Ford rules!" thoughtful debate. :rolleyes: If the rules don't apply to everybody, get rid of them, your job as a moderator isn't to bend the rules in favor of people you agree with, and let those people attack those you disagree with, your job is to be unbiased, clearly you are not so I wonder why you still have the position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 This is why I hardly post here anymore, you can't even make a comment on something with out being insulted and trolled by RJ and his band of immature followers that have ruined this website. Why don't you get a hobby, you have how many posts now in such a short time? This is an attack, and nothing was personally attacked about you. RMC joked that you might be willing to fork over the cash to pay for the new powertrain you're asking for. That's all. Perhaps you should reread the thread? There are several, logical points brought up as reasons that they could not simply drop in the new powertrain when shipped over. They all make sense. Would it be nice? Sure. Was it considered? I would be willing to be it was. And for it to be done the numbers had to make sense. Apparently, they didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 (edited) Perhaps Blueblood is willing to pay to put new powertrains (and all related expenses) in the TC for the couple years before it's produced here? Wow, so now you resort to lying to cover for your favored members. Pathetic. I never insulted ANYBODY, I was personally attacked and insulted by several people, totally un-provoked, and you accuse me of insulting people? Go read the thread again mr. "moderator". Robert Lane should remove your moderator status, as you are nothing of the sort, this board was not intended to be a cheer squad for Ford, people shouldn't have to face insults for discussing things. You set a horrible example for people like rmc who thinks it's ok to be rude, condescending, and insulting because he knows you'll let him get away with it. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index...showtopic=32068 You're not following your own rules, and I really don't care, but the hypocrisy and the hyper-sensitivity among some people here is ridiculous, you can't even offer up constructive criticism anymore without being attacked. It's a shame because this used to be the best Ford website out there, now it's like reading Ford's press releases, it's boring and debate is dead, unless you consider "Toyota SUCKS! Ford rules!" thoughtful debate. :rolleyes: If the rules don't apply to everybody, get rid of them, your job as a moderator isn't to bend the rules in favor of people you agree with, and let those people attack those you disagree with, your job is to be unbiased, clearly you are not so I wonder why you still have the position. I'll retract my statment if you're that offended by it, but it was supposed to be more of a joke than anything. I in no way meant it to be a personal attack, an I'm sorry you felt that it was. I just feel like you aren't looking at the TC situation logically. Especially with Mulally, anything Ford does will require it making a profit. Shipping engines over to Europe for a small and short production run for to-be-US-consumed-models doesn't make sense and more than likely will NOT result in a profit, even if it does result in a better vehicle. As I said in one of my last posts, I agree with you that it could use a more powerful and (theoretically) more efficient powertrain setup. I just don't feel as though, especially with the economic times we're in, that that change should be made which ends up resulting in losses. Do they wanna make a good first impression with the vehicle? Sure, of course they do. Quite obviously the vehicle performs well with the current setup, otherwise that setup wouldn't be offered in Europe, either. I'm sure Mulally and Ford have weighed the benefits and risks of the situation and they feel as though the benefits of bringing the vehicle over now as-is (with the exception of the changes necessary for US crash tests, etc) out-weigh the risks. You should also consider that since there are not really any other true competitors to this vehicle, Ford is able to be a little more "relaxed" with it's introduction. Now, had there been some established players in the market, I'm sure Ford would've either waited for the US production or they would've done what you're proposing. But, that is not the case. Edited June 8, 2009 by rmc523 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 Think about all the factors regarding the TC. The TC is (currently) made in Turkey. Last I read here, TC production is to be moved here to the US in the next few years, if that. That's your first factor.....do you think Ford would spend the time, money, etc. to ship all the parts and engines overseas and to also train the employees on the new equipment they'll need to install into US-bound TC's for a vehicle that's production (for US consumption) will be removed from that plant within the next year or two? That would likely eliminate any profit they're gonna pull out of what they will be doing. Second (and this is also an important one), Ford will bring (IIRC) 20,000 of them here to the US this year, no? 2008 production for Ford's Turkey plant was about 320,000 from what I could find. I'm not sure the split between Transit's and Transit Connects, but I doubt those 20,000 units would make up a large percentage of their TC output. So right there, is another reason it doesn't make sense - with the relatively small number of US-bound TC's, it doesn't make sense to do all the work to put new powertrains into them, which again would require changing production techniques, etc., especially with the upcoming production move. Another factor is the fact that European models won't be getting different powertrains from what we're getting (I mean, yeah they have other options, but not a larger I4). ----As a side note - I don't know the percentage of gas-to-diesel TC sales, but it seems that the Euro model manages fine with the I4 we're recieving.... Now, if production of models for US consumption weren't being shipped here to the US within the next year or so, I'd fully support your complaints - especially if (when?) US sales increase/take off (in this case, you'd wanna further improve the product, increasing Ford's commercial marketshare, etc...) and/or are lackluster (in this case, companies may not think it can handle the loads with the current powertrain, so it needs a powertrain boost to help sales). BUT, production is shifting here soon, as well as the low percentage of production numbers, eliminating both problems. It simply would not be cost effective for Ford to give it new powertrains in the current setup. This is the deal, it was just an idea, none of us know the fine details of what Fords costs are to conduct business, it never even crossed my mind for Ford to do something like ship Fusion engine's and tranny's all the way to Turkey. I figured by the time they go on sale here, that they would be making them here considering Ford is shifting some of their plants to car production from trucks, and that the Focus chassis is supposed to be a huge part of that. No big deal. Now, as for the personal attack.....if you don't like the fact that I post a lot, ok that's fine. Is it gonna change the way I post? No, most likely not. Is there really a problem with the way I post? I don't know how others (aside from yourself) feel, but I feel as though most of the time I contribute to many of the topics at hand. Ok, it has nothing to do with how much you post, go back and read your post again, you made a condescending remark directed towards me, so that's why I brought up your post count, and I was in a bad mood at the time anyways, so forget about it. Have there been times where I throw a post in just to have a post? Sure there have been, but I'll be the first to admit it. Also, after I first joined, I didn't realize there was a multi-quote "tool," so that led to a large number of my posts, as I would reply to multiple thoughts/posts in separate post boxes, again because I didn't realize there was a better way to do it. Some were understandably getting frustrated with that and pointed out the mulit-post feature, and I happily complied (also made it easier on me trying to get thoughts across). I'm sorry you feel that way about my posting habits. If RJ and/or others here want me to change my habits, I'll do my best, but with the exception I just explained, I haven't gotten the impression they want me to change the way I post. As for hobbies, I've got plenty - I play soccer, am a state-champion track runner/athlete, a straight A college student with the exception of one or two classes, and probably my personal favorite - I draw. Here's some of my work: ....with more scattered about the forums here, and many, many (literally hundreds) more that I'd rather not post here (PREMiERdrum can fill you in on the quality of the one's I haven't posted). Also, you can see the photochops section for more of my hobbies in the form of chops. So just because I post a lot here doesn't mean I don't do anything else. ----- Back to the topic currently being discussed. I've seen your work, have you considered going to art school? I went to the same one J Mays did, incredible school, but I stopped going because it was very expensive, and I just didn't have the artistic ability to make it at that level, you've gotta be born with it. The people and the facilities there are top notch, I wanted to be a designer for Ford, I can see the concepts in my head, but I just can't put them onto paper. I thought they could work some magic and teach me, but drawing cars is very difficult, you've really gotta have a natural artistic ability to get it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 This is an attack, and nothing was personally attacked about you. RMC joked that you might be willing to fork over the cash to pay for the new powertrain you're asking for. That's all. Perhaps you should reread the thread? There are several, logical points brought up as reasons that they could not simply drop in the new powertrain when shipped over. They all make sense. Would it be nice? Sure. Was it considered? I would be willing to be it was. And for it to be done the numbers had to make sense. Apparently, they didn't. http://www.blueovalforums.com/forums/index...st&p=514188 Look closely.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 Bluebood complains about rmc523 posting too much, yet he has 2800+ posts? He certainly seems to like the attention, judging by his provocative comments....another P-71 in the making! Unlike P71, I don't hate Ford, and I own 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 1 This is the deal, it was just an idea, none of us know the fine details of what Fords costs are to conduct business, it never even crossed my mind for Ford to do something like ship Fusion engine's and tranny's all the way to Turkey. I figured by the time they go on sale here, that they would be making them here considering Ford is shifting some of their plants to car production from trucks, and that the Focus chassis is supposed to be a huge part of that. No big deal. 2 Ok, it has nothing to do with how much you post, go back and read your post again, you made a condescending remark directed towards me, so that's why I brought up your post count, and I was in a bad mood at the time anyways, so forget about it. 3 I've seen your work, have you considered going to art school? I went to the same one J Mays did, incredible school, but I stopped going because it was very expensive, and I just didn't have the artistic ability to make it at that level, you've gotta be born with it. The people and the facilities there are top notch, I wanted to be a designer for Ford, I can see the concepts in my head, but I just can't put them onto paper. I thought they could work some magic and teach me, but drawing cars is very difficult, you've really gotta have a natural artistic ability to get it right. I broke your post into 3 points, which I'll address seperately. 1) I understand. The TC will be here this summer (?) and I can't remember where it's to be produced in the US, but IIRC production will be switched over here in 18-24 months after US launch, but again IIRC. 2) Again, I'm sorry that you took my remark as a personal attack. I didn't mean it to be one, it was more of a joke than anything. 3) I have considered it, and we'll see what happens over the next couple years regarding that. One of my biggest problems is that I can't really seem to "see down the road" to what cars may look like in the future. I hate all of those goofy little things you see people come up with that they think may be a future car - quite frankly I think most of them are ugly. Most of the stuff I do is understated and elegant (or so I think) stuff that you could theoretically see on the road today rather than flashy and "out there" cars of "tomorrow." I also don't see the point of doing crazy concepts 1) because as I already said, most are ugly IMO, and 2) why waste money on something you're not even considering making?, and in that sense, I guess I'm a bit like Mulally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 Unlike P71, I don't hate Ford, and I own 2. [JOKE!!] (just wanna make sure this time...) Neither is a Panther are they? :lol: [/JOKE!!] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 (edited) Blueblood, you call people cheerleaders all the time---if you were the slightest bit civilized, if you did not insist on starting arguments and keeping arguments going, I would defend what you do here. But, as your own record demonstrates, time and again you bring a truculent and bellicose attitude to this board and routinely insult people that you disagree with. Therefore, crying to me about how people are picking on you is not going to do any good. If you want people to stop insulting you, stop insulting them. Edited June 8, 2009 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 And, more to the point, you said that it was foolish to defend Ford's decision when you yourself weren't even aware of Ford's plans. On the sales thread, you trashed people who discussed Ford positively citing 'higher incentives', only to be confronted with evidence that Ford's incentives were lower, evidence found in the first sentence of the first paragraph of Ford's monthly sales release. You have a history of going off half-cocked and taking shots at anyone that disagrees with you. Again, don't expect sympathy from me unless and until you change -your- behavior. After all, it's the only thing on this site that's entirely within your control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 How about a 212 hp flower shop car: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 I don't disagree with this statement. I just bugs me knowing that if the TC was built in the US, where we have the technology readily available, it would be soooooo much better ! The next generation TC assembled in the US will not likely share any parts with this generation, making these few years of production "orphans". Remember the Versailles ? P.S. "Soon" is always relative. My bet is, they won't start building TCs in the US until 2012CY. Ford would have wrecked the Transit Connects reputation by using this 2.0L engine by the time US production starts. If they put out an underpowered poor MPG gasoline only Connect before the Ecoboost version is ready. Ford sold 110,000 Connects all of them were diesels in Europe not one gasoline version got sold here. You cannot buy a gasoline Transit Connect in the UK. The US 2.0 gasoline Transit Connects engine return up to 24 US MPG on the highway, the UK Transit Connect diesel has more torque & return 52 UK MPG (43 US MPG) on the highway that why not one gasoline Transit Connect is sold here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 (edited) The US 2.0 gasoline Transit Connects engine return up to 24 US MPG on the highway,. That's 22mpg city/25mpg Hwy and in the USA, gasoline costs 46 pence/litre. You must be sick with envy, what ridiculous price are you paying for diesel FJM? Never mind here they are: UK Petrol Prices forSunday 7th Jun 2009 Avg. Min. Max. Unleaded: 101.2p 96.9p 111.9p Diesel: 104.0p 99.9p 116.9p LRP: 106.3p 99.9p 109.9p Super: 107.5p 99.9p 117.9p LPG: 51.9p 43.9p 59.9p I see diesel is two times the price of US petrol FJM, does that mean it has to be two times as economical? I sure would hate to buy those expensive diesels FJM, how much more than a petrol engine are they? I guess the Ford North American executives know what they are doing FJM, we can only hope. Edited June 8, 2009 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 That's 22mpg city/25mpg Hwy and in the USA, gasoline costs 46 pence/litre. You must be sick with envy, what ridiculous price are you paying for diesel FJM? Never mind here they are: UK Petrol Prices forSunday 7th Jun 2009 Avg. Min. Max. Unleaded: 101.2p 96.9p 111.9p Diesel: 104.0p 99.9p 116.9p LRP: 106.3p 99.9p 109.9p Super: 107.5p 99.9p 117.9p LPG: 51.9p 43.9p 59.9p I see diesel is two times the price of US petrol FJM, does that mean it has to be two times as economical? I sure would hate to buy those expensive diesels FJM, how much more than a petrol engine are they? I guess the Ford North American executives know what they are doing FJM, we can only hope. Gotta agree nobody here likes paying 70% in taxes on unleaded fuels and more tax on diesel thats why a lot of youngsters don't bother with cars and are anti-car, insurance for a young 18 year old can be has high as $3,000 just a little second hand FWD shitbox. Most youngsters use the bus or tube in London. Gotta say l don't know how much a diesel v gasoline Transit Connect would cost here, because Ford gave up on selling the gasoline version years ago. But if you compare the price of a Fiesta diesel to gasoline with the same sized engine, the diesel Fiesta is just a little bit cheaper to buy new. North Sea oil production peaked at the start of this decade and we see a massive dip in supplies come 2014. So maybe the tax will act as buffer when the price soars. Diesel used to be a lot lot cheaper in Europe until diesel cars that everybody here said would not take off did, and the refinery production could not keep up with demand. India have built and got a lot diesel refineries planned for the future so the price will come down in the future. You are a bit out of touch with US diesel prices JPD. Current Average US oil prices Regular unleaded - $2.619 Mid Unleaded - $2.781 Premium Unleaded - $2.880 Diesel $2.515 Gotta say JPD l think l would be green with envy at those US diesel prices if l lived in the USA. http://www.fuelgaugereport.com/ State by State prices http://www.fuelgaugereport.com/sbsavg.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 thats why a lot of youngsters don't bother with cars and are anti-car, insurance for a young 18 year old can be has high as $3,000 just a little second hand FWD shitbox. I was quoted 7K a year on a 98 Mustang GT I had when was 24 years old! LOL I was paying about $2500 at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 I was quoted 7K a year on a 98 Mustang GT I had when was 24 years old! LOL I was paying about $2500 at the time. My 72 Capri is $180 fully comp and is road tax exempt tax free, somebody who owns a Mondeo would pay $1500 a year road tax and a youngster would have to pay $3,000 for a second hand old 1000 cc Fiesta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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