RichardJensen Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 it is all just math, nothing but math and logic. That does not mean that the problem can be solved: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halting_problem 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 (edited) Flying a plane (even taking off and landing) in autopilot is much easier than a 100% driverless car. Yeah, they don't have trucks pulling out on front of them.... and Autopilot might have to learn sign language......... Edited July 6, 2016 by jpd80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Only way automotus cars would be successful is if every single vehicle was equipped with a compatible system. I don't see that happening for another 10-20 years at the earliest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted July 6, 2016 Author Share Posted July 6, 2016 Airplanes have Auto pilot from cruising, but they still don't have "auto-take off" or "auto landing". And would you fly in one that supposedly did? Can't expect 100% driverless cars, "in a few years" as some fanatics say. IMHO. Airplanes can land by autopilot now... just not take off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4d4evr-1 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 That does not mean that the problem can be solved: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halting_problem and we have how many deaths now? Determine what the real problem is before you say it can not be solved.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blwnsmoke Posted July 6, 2016 Author Share Posted July 6, 2016 Another accident.. Another Tesla crashes and Autopilot is blamed againhttp://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2016/07/05/owner-survives-tesla-crash/86729076/ In his crash report, Vukovich stated that Scaglione's car was traveling east near mile marker 160, about 5 p.m. when it hit a guardrail "off the right side of the roadway. It then crossed over the eastbound lanes and hit the concrete median." After that, the Tesla Model X rolled onto its roof and came to rest in the middle eastbound lane. A 2013 Infiniti G37 driven in the westbound lane by Thomas Hess of West Chester, Penn.., was struck by debris from the Scaglione car, but neither he nor his passenger was hurt. Vukovich said he likely will cite Scaglione after he completes his investigation, but he declined to specify the charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Determine what the real problem is before you say it can not be solved.... The real problem is that machines have neither language nor agency. I would explain further, but I am certain that I would be wasting my time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4d4evr-1 Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 The real problem is that machines have neither language nor agency. I would explain further, but I am certain that I would be wasting my time. cars are inanimate objects subject to control by humans whether by direct manipulation by steering wheel and brakes or computers that communicate with each other. As NASA has been able to control space flight cars will be controlled by computers as soon as tech is developed. there was a time when everything that does now work, that it did not.... please waste some more time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 (edited) As NASA has been able to control space flight You can send a space ship to the moon using a computer program that takes up less space than the graphic at the top of this page. Edited July 7, 2016 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Isn't it interesting that those of us with the least faith in fully autonomous vehicles are the folks that have spent considerable amounts of time programming computers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Isn't it interesting that those of us with the least faith in fully autonomous vehicles are the folks that have spent considerable amounts of time programming computers? Hmmm. Hmmmmmm.................... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 The only software without bugs is the one that hasn't been written..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 The only software without bugs is the one that hasn't been written..... I don't know, that hello world app I wrote back when I was first learning ASP was rocking it! Oh wait, it was hosted in classic ASP... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Maybe they should revise that saying as "the only piece of software that actually does something useful...." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4d4evr-1 Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Isn't it interesting that those of us with the least faith in fully autonomous vehicles are the folks that have spent considerable amounts of time programming computers? Not saying any program is perfect, just saying no driver is perfect is either. This is a work in progress and will continue whether any or all of the neanderthals of the world agree or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Not saying any program is perfect, just saying no driver is perfect is either. This is a work in progress and will continue whether any or all of the neanderthals of the world agree or not. Of course it's a work in progress, and it's obviously going to continue. I'm not saying driver aids and semi-autonomy are bad things, I welcome them to make vehicles safer. However, thinking that we are going to be riding around in fully autonomous vehicles in 5 - 10 years is pie-in-the-sky thinking. There are just too many variables to make that a reality (IMO). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 There are ways to develop and test this software without going full autopilot at highway speeds. If autopilot fails at 25 mph you probably won't kill anybody. If autopilot fails at 50-60 mph you probably will kill somebody. You can reap all of the safety benefits with driver assistance. It's amazing what people will sacrifice (literally) in the name of cool gadgets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 (edited) People Are Idiots http://digg.com/video/self-driving-car-patty-cake?utm_content=buffer3ed24&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer I like the Tesla statement at the end that autopilot does not "allow" the driver to abdicate responsibility. I'm sorry, but based on those videos it plainly does allow drivers to check out. Edited July 9, 2016 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fgts Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 People Are Idiots http://digg.com/video/self-driving-car-patty-cake?utm_content=buffer3ed24&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer I like the Tesla statement at the end that autopilot does not "allow" the driver to abdicate responsibility. I'm sorry, but based on those videos it plainly does allow drivers to check out. How many car crashes (fender bender to deadly) happen per year with humans?. Yes, new tech will have teething problems but that no excuse for throwing away the tech. From what is reported the guy probably wasn't awake which Tesla prohibits with you having your hands on the wheel after a short distance or the car will pull over and stop. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 Tesla prohibits with you having your hands on the wheel after a short distance or the car will pull over and stop. Yeah. It looks like that "feature" of the 'auto pilot' works real well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 (edited) The real problem is that machines have neither language nor agency. I would explain further, but I am certain that I would be wasting my time. If I was to say that the main failing of a computer is that it cannot interact in a social network (like bees / other drivers) without being connected to every other unit around it.......and that's before we discuss the actions taken. Edited July 9, 2016 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 (edited) Autonomous tech won't ever work in a manner deemed safe unless EVERY vehicle on the road is using it and interacting with each other over the air. At that point you might as well just take the train. Edited July 9, 2016 by Anthony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fgts Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Yeah. It looks like that "feature" of the 'auto pilot' works real well. And humans drive so good... The future of auto driving is going to be a reality, even if you don't want it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Autonomous tech won't ever work in a manner deemed safe unless EVERY vehicle on the road is using it and interacting with each other over the air. At that point you might as well just take the train. Unless you outright ban cars that don't have this tech...which would never happen...this going to never happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 And humans drive so good... The future of auto driving is going to be a reality, even if you don't want it. In very limited scenarios for the next 20-30 years. Just look at this way...how is my (future dream car) 2018 Mustang GT350 supposed to interact with autonomous vehicles in 2030 or so when I'm driving it? How about people who have Model Ts or 1967 Shelby Mustangs? Your always going to have cars that lack autonomous controls for a very long time going forward... I seriously doubt I'll ever see it before I stop driving in the next 30 years or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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