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The Ford Order Tracking System Is No Longer Available.  THANKS Cyberdman For Making Available All Of These Past Years.  More Here.

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Ford’s Mustang Mach-E Profit Wiped Out by Commodity Costs

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Must be fake news!  Tesla and their gigafactories and vertical integration are invincible!

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29 minutes ago, akirby said:

Must be fake news!  Tesla and their gigafactories and vertical integration are invincible!

 

😂

Tesla is far ahead of any other global automaker when it comes to BEV production capabilities, but like any manufacturing firm it is not immune to supply chain disruptions.

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1 hour ago, rperez817 said:

 

😂

Tesla is far ahead of any other global automaker when it comes to BEV production capabilities, but like any manufacturing firm it is not immune to supply chain disruptions.


I agree, but I’m reasonably sure you said that Tesla’s vertically integrated gigafactories were immune to supplier issues unlike legacy mfrs.

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20 minutes ago, akirby said:

I agree, but I’m reasonably sure you said that Tesla’s vertically integrated gigafactories were immune to supplier issues unlike legacy mfrs.

 

I've said in other threads on this site that a high degree of vertical integration/gigafactory model is necessary though not sufficient for automakers (both new and legacy) to mass produce BEV efficiently and profitably nowadays. And ultimately to survive and thrive amid the ongoing automotive industry revolution.

 

I did not mean to imply that this business model is immune to supply chain disruptions or other macroeconomic factors. My apology if my previous comments came across that way.

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Posted (edited)

There’s now a $15,000 price difference between the starting price of a Mach E and Tesla Y, increasing materials costs passed onto consumers is a reality that buyers have to accept or be allowed to cancel their orders, refund deposit and go elsewhere.


Mach E Break even?

Earlier this year, Ford increased prices for European Mach E by $6,000, so I’m a little surprised that they didn’t do the same for North American prices. So there’s room to increase prices and still be way less than Tesla Y pricing….starting Mach E pricing above $50,000 is still $10,000 less than the entry level Y.

Edited by jpd80

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https://www.autoblog.com/2022/06/24/ford-ends-purchase-option-on-leased-vehicles/

 

Quote

Ford appears to have designated June as the month for realigning customer rights. A few days ago came word that dealers would be able to insert language into sales contract for the F-150 Lightning prohibiting buyers from selling the electric pickup for one year after purchase. Dealers wouldn't need to do this, but they could. Over on the leasing side, Cars Direct discovered a letter Ford sent to dealers eliminating the end-of-lease purchase option for the F-150 Lightning, Mustang Mach-E, and E-Transit van. In the plainest language possible, Ford's new prohibition tells lessees, "you do not have the option to purchase the Vehicle at the end of the lease term." The change took effect on June 15 in 37 states and will be enacted in the remaining 14 states plus the District of Columbia by the last quarter of this year.

 

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On 6/20/2022 at 4:06 PM, HotRunrGuy said:

 

Just to clarify, they are using an incandescent CHMSL, just not an LED one, correct?  The vehicle is still equipped with a CHMSL.

 

HRG


Yes it still has a CHMSL that is incandescent, however on the window sticker under the Safety/Security listing it shows LED CTR HIGH MNT STOP LAMP.



 

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On topic, why doesn’t Ford just increase Mach E’s North American prices like it did for the Euro models?

Surely that would be better than broadcasting  that Mach E is now break even, just do something about it…

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36 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

On topic, why doesn’t Ford just increase Mach E’s North American prices like it did for the Euro models?

Surely that would be better than broadcasting  that Mach E is now break even, just do something about it…

Aren’t they locked in to the price for existing orders?  Rivian tried to increase the price on vehicles that had been ordered and took a beating with bad publicity and threats of cancelled orders.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, slemke said:

Aren’t they locked in to the price for existing orders?  Rivian tried to increase the price on vehicles that had been ordered and took a beating with bad publicity and threats of cancelled orders.

Yeah but Ford also shut down the order bank in April because it couldn’t meet demand mostly due to limited production capacity until 2023, so maybe there’s a way to increase prices on new orders beyond those currently held…

Edited by jpd80

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2 hours ago, jpd80 said:

On topic, why doesn’t Ford just increase Mach E’s North American prices like it did for the Euro models?

Surely that would be better than broadcasting  that Mach E is now break even, just do something about it…

 

They have, just not enough to keep up with rising costs.  They also planned a price increase in April after the order bank closed for MY 2022 MME and decided against it.  Presumably not enough stock orders expected to be built to make it worth the hassle with all the price-protected orders.  And that's the rub - a good bulk of the units they're building now are orders protected to lower pricing.  Raising prices doesn't help if you don't have new orders for it to apply to, and you honor your pricing commitments to your retail customers.

 

It'll be interesting to see what happens with pricing when the order bank for MY 2023 opens up...  Will they try to absorb the cost increases to subsidize the EV transition?  Will they pass it all along?  Or somewhere in the middle?  Of course, lots of things could bring costs back down between now and then.

 

Price increase on December 8, 2021: 

 

Price increase on April 13, 2022:

 

Canceled April 13, 2022 price increase:

 

 

 

1 hour ago, slemke said:

Aren’t they locked in to the price for existing orders?  Rivian tried to increase the price on vehicles that had been ordered and took a beating with bad publicity and threats of cancelled orders.

 

Ford has been providing price protection for retail orders, yes.

 

In Rivian's case, sure some have reason to be frustrated, but that wasn't quite how it was made out to be.  Part of the problem is that what Rivian called preordering was really just a reservation with the opportunity to select a tentative build.  From there, no different than if your F-150 Lightning reservation came up, you were given the opportunity to finalize your build, presented with timing, and (well, unlike Ford), probably presented with a rough delivery timeline.  At that point, you had actually ordered an R1T and your pricing was set.  If your reservation ("preorder") hadn't been picked to be converted to an order, then you would receive whatever pricing was in effect (read: higher) when it was.

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Maybe the trick is to aim for a richer sales mix (remove the entry trim) and then see how the prices sit post 2023.

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8 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Maybe the trick is to aim for a richer sales mix (remove the entry trim) and then see how the prices sit post 2023.

 

Most definitely jpd80. Removing entry trim levels is a common technique in the automotive industry nowadays to improve profitability. Tesla is well known for it, but several incumbent automakers including Honda, Toyota, and VW have done it too.

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