Lincoln rolls out plan to shift out of reverse

[Blue Oval Staff]

After languishing for years, Cadillac started roaring back in 2003 with aggressively-styled vehicles that exude American attitude. Now, Ford wants to do the same with Lincoln.

 

ARTICLE LINK

[waymondospiff]

ARTICLE LINK

As I wrote in my duplicate post: two things: the Lincoln Fairlane isn't mentioned at all. And the article states the MKS won't be available until 2009. Even assuming a 2009 M/Y & 2008 on-sale date, isn't that later than originally thought? I was under the impression the MKS would be on sale in fall 2007 as a 2008 M/Y.

 

If the 2009 M/Y is true, it give Lincoln a very busy 2009: MKS, MK-Fairlane, & new MK LT. And aren't the Panthers supposed to receive an update around then? If so, add a revised Town Car to the list. A busy year, that's for sure.

 

And Very Good News: Lincoln gets its biggest ad budget ever. Let's see if Ford Marketing can actually put together something decent with the money and spur some sales!

 

Scott

[Roadrunner]

http://cmsimg.detnews.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/b...00&MaxW=500

Above: Ford (Lincoln division) press release photo

 

You know, at this angle I actually like this Em Kay Ecks. It has an agreeable front fascia. Or it looks like a vacuum. I'm just not sure.

 

And that back end -- for a full light bar, much, much better than a Buick Rendezvous.

[LincolnFan]

ABOUT TIME! though the bean counters need to be shot, NOW!

 

anyway, the Lincoln Fairlame was cancelled, I remember reading it in the latest article about the Chicago factory.

 

MKS is way too late, by that time it should have a RWD platform Ford, it better have a V8 though.

[ZanatWork]

I'm hoping that Lincoln is the brand that gets Ford USA working with its Aussie partner in terms of the next-gen Falcon chassis.

 

The VERY good news is that Mulally seems to agree with us out here-specifically, that there are too many platforms globally and that there wasn't a real plan. I'm really hoping that Lexus of his leads to Lincoln getting some potentially sweet rwd hardware.

 

After Lincoln gets it, it trickles down through Mercury and Ford...that's the way it SHOULD be, instead of starting with a Ford and adding luxury amenities to make Mercury and Lincon versions.

 

I'm excited, but I also know that the transition period will be ongoing through 2010.

[johnnyb82]

Mullally also likes the Lexus LS and the Lincoln Towncar. Those who are hoping for a big, RWD flagship may actually get your wish with him at the helm.

[OrlandoGuy80]

Disappointing.

 

I read the title at the Detroit News website and was thinking we were going to get an announcement about some new project (or projects) that we didn't know about before.

 

It's going to take a lot more than a big advertising budget to change buyers' minds about the Lincoln brand, and unfortunately, I don't see a whole lot in the way of exciting product from this article.

[Edgey]

For a company that is losing money hand over fist, the fact Lincoln is being as well tended as it is should be worth something. Granted, it's a real stretch to say that Lincoln has 4 new vehicles coming out this year, but these are new products none-the-less. They all have the same design language and are fitted with excellent interiors...and aren't priced too high. It will take a few years, but they are clearly making progress.

 

Walking onto a Lincoln/Mercury lot is a lot more gratifying to me than walking onto a Ford lot. All the products are beautifully designed and finished. It's very easy to shop between the vehicles since they all compliment each other. No other Ford brand is as fully modernized.

 

Walking onto a Ford lot is an entirely different experience. There are many nice stand alone products, but everything is wildly inconsistent. There is a hodge-podge of designs and features, nothing compliments each other and many products are extremely outdated. Thankfully, it appears Ford is endeavoring to do the same to its own brand as it has done so well with Lincoln/Mercury. All the cosmetic updates in 2008 are part of that endeavor of bring everything up to speed. Ford has also done a brilliant job bringing all optional equipment to all of its vehicles, such as Navigation, Sirius, and Ipod connections. Anybody coming into a Ford lot unsure of what they are looking for should find the experience a lot less frustrating in 2008.

Edited November 5, 2006 by Edgey

[lincmerc51]

http://cmsimg.detnews.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/b...00&MaxW=500

Above: Ford (Lincoln division) press release photo

 

You know, at this angle I actually like this Em Kay Ecks. It has an agreeable front fascia. Or it looks like a vacuum. I'm just not sure.

 

And that back end -- for a full light bar, much, much better than a Buick Rendezvous.

 

Yeah, it would've looked even better if there was NO light on it at all.

 

I do like the ass end of the thing, but I'm at a loss as to how they're going to fing enough AMC Spirit grilles in junkyards to make enuf emmkayexxes

 

BYW, did you see that Motor Trend totally PANNED the Edge and the mkx in it's SUVOTY this month? Hell, the Suzuki and Hyundai scored better than these 2 modified Mazdas.

 

Did Nasser get rid of everyone with a clue during his purge?

 

For a company that is losing money hand over fist, the fact Lincoln is being as well tended as it is should be worth something. Granted, it's a real stretch to say that Lincoln has 4 new vehicles coming out this year, but these are new products none-the-less.

 

Funny, the article only lists 3 "new" vehicles: emmkayzee, navigator L and emmkayexx. First, where's the fourth one? ANd, the first 2 are a BIG STRETCH to be called new. I say there's ONE new vehicle this year, and it replaced the Aviator.

[Edgey]

The 4 new vehicles are the MKZ, MKX, Navigator, and Navigator L. The MKS won't be in production before 2nd quarter, 2008.

 

I'm not sure what to make of the critical response to the Edge. I expected the Edge to be treated more favorably, but I don't quite understand the 'comparison' they are using to judge the Edge. Exactly which competitor is better? I didn't realize there was a lot of vehicles like the Edge out there. Of course, this is bound to happen when the segment is so hard to classify.

 

I would have liked to see the Edge closer to the Escape, perhaps even replacing the Escape, and then scaled upward. A 7-seating CUV should then be placed above the Edge that starts at 25 (a sexier Freestyle). I'm not sure the Escape can remain competitive with the 2008 update, the Edge seems far better equipped to take on the lower-end competitors.

Edited November 5, 2006 by Edgey

[lincmerc51]

The 4 new vehicles are the MKZ, MKX, Navigator, and Navigator L. The MKS won't be in production before 2nd quarter, 2008.

 

The Navigator is a new vehicle? So what is this thing in my garage that I bought in 2004 then? The only new vehicle here in the X.

 

I'm not sure what to make of the critical response to the Edge. I expected the Edge to be treated more favorably, but I don't quite understand the 'comparison' they are using to judge the Edge. Exactly which competitor is better? I didn't realize there was a lot of vehicles like the Edge out there. Of course, this is bound to happen when the segment is so hard to classify.

 

MT compared 22 vehicles to determine SUV of the Year (Mercedes won. Yeah, for close to $70,000 i guess it would have the inside track.) Everything from Audi to Suzuki was in there, if the vehicle is 'new' this year. Come to think of it, the Navigator was in there so MT considers it new as well. It actually fared a lot better than the MKX in their little rating system. Both new Acuras were there, the Santa Fe, the Tahoe etc etc. And the MKX and Edge were near the bottom. In performance, in braking (almost dead last), handling,etc. Only thing Lincoln got right according to them is the interior. Even then, they bitched about cheap materials and an uncomfortable back seat. AND they compained about my pet peeve - the transmission hunted a lot and the STOOOOPID shifter which has only D and L does not allow the driver to do anything about it. Can someone tell me what the hell is FOrd thinking with these stupid shifters in these cars (the Mazda clones have em too, yet the Mazda offers a select shift - and even a manual tranny.)

 

I would have liked to see the Edge closer to the Escape, perhaps even replacing the Escape, and then scaled upward. A 7-seating CUV should then be placed above the Edge that starts at 25 (a sexier Freestyle). I'm not sure the Escape can remain competitive with the 2008 update, the Edge seems far better equipped to take on the lower-end competitors.

 

 

The 4 new vehicles are the MKZ, MKX, Navigator, and Navigator L. The MKS won't be in production before 2nd quarter, 2008.

 

 

Oh, about 2008 - not according to Horbury. The new Lincoln flagship (cough cough) V6 Volvo-clone goes into PRODUCTION in 2009. So isn't that a 2010 model?

[Footballfan]

Disappointing.

 

I read the title at the Detroit News website and was thinking we were going to get an announcement about some new project (or projects) that we didn't know about before.

 

It's going to take a lot more than a big advertising budget to change buyers' minds about the Lincoln brand, and unfortunately, I don't see a whole lot in the way of exciting product from this article.

 

I agree. Three badge-engineered SUVs and a front-wheel-drive sedan? I hardly call this an earth-shattering product lineup. To put Lincoln in the same category of Lexus, BMW and Cadillac is a joke; they missed their chance to be at this level when they let the DEW 98/LS die without different variants.

 

Like it or not, the customer sees Lincoln now as a competitor with the Buick and Chrysler brands. That is not necessaryily a knock, but face it- BMW, Cadillac, and Lexus are in a different leauge, and unless Lincoln can revive the DEW 98 or go to an all rear-wheel-drive lineup with distinct styling, they will be stuck in the mud.

[LincolnFan]

I agree. Three badge-engineered SUVs and a front-wheel-drive sedan? I hardly call this an earth-shattering product lineup. To put Lincoln in the same category of Lexus, BMW and Cadillac is a joke; they missed their chance to be at this level when they let the DEW 98/LS die without different variants.

 

Like it or not, the customer sees Lincoln now as a competitor with the Buick and Chrysler brands. That is not necessaryily a knock, but face it- BMW, Cadillac, and Lexus are in a different leauge, and unless Lincoln can revive the DEW 98 or go to an all rear-wheel-drive lineup with distinct styling, they will be stuck in the mud.

 

Making an all-new RWD platform would cost less than modifiying the lame DEW, just let die goddamnit.

 

I am more with the Orion Falcon chassis, the Mustang's delayed redesign to '11 is the proof that it will use the Orion Falcon chassis.

 

Add to that, the Falcon's chassis is capable of handling the big Ford V8s, the DEW would take a shit load of money to shove a Mod or even a Boss in there.

Edited November 5, 2006 by LincolnFan

[DCK]

This is extremly sad, Ford simply does not care about Lincoln.

 

This effort is nothing but pathetic, GM built cadillacs comeback on aggressive power-trains, engines, style and refinement. Ford plans Lincolns comeback with pretty much adding some chrome and retro interiors to ford products.

 

Look at this:

 

Horbury said future Lincolns will feature even more distinctive styling. He said the brand's transformation will be complete when its new flagship, the MKS, goes into production in 2009.

 

How sad..............Lincoln is not serious about competing.

Edited November 5, 2006 by DCK

[Edgey]

Lincoln is trying to be more Lincolnish, but with a more modern interpretation. Essentially, it's going back to uncompromised plushness. That happens to be the most affordable way of making a luxury car and it's the ONLY way Lincoln can properly utilize its brand equity. Lincoln is not competing with anybody, they have established their own niche in an under-serviced entry level luxury market. They are not immitating anybody, not as far as I can recognize anyway. The best way for Lincoln to suceed is to give people the type of luxury they expect from Lincoln but don't recognize in any other brand. In that way, they can get buyers to look at Lincoln on its own merits instead of looking at their product as the value compromise.

[DCK]

Lincoln is trying to be more Lincolnish, but with a more modern interpretation. Essentially, it's going back to uncompromised plushness. That happens to be the most affordable way of making a luxury car and it's the ONLY way Lincoln can properly utilize its brand equity. Lincoln is not competing with anybody, they have established their own niche in an under-serviced entry level luxury market. They are not immitating anybody, not as far as I can recognize anyway. The best way for Lincoln to suceed is to give people the type of luxury they expect from Lincoln but don't recognize in any other brand. In that way, they can get buyers to look at Lincoln on its own merits instead of looking at their product as the value compromise.

I wonder if GM took a Malibu popped some chrome on it and gave it a retro interior, all while promoting it as a sports sedan against the BMW 3 series if you would have the same mindset for them. Because the is what the Zephyr was and Lincoln tried to market it against the 3 Series.

 

That is complete and utter crap.

 

Ford simply doesn't care, is not willing to put up a fight and being able to compete against the luxury leaders as the likes of BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Cadillac and so on.... that is the sole reason we are mouth fed the BS above in your post. Cadillac was ina worst situation than Lincoln and pledged to come back without excuses and they succeeded, Lincoln won't. Fordis making lincoln into really what Mercury should be. So mercury is about dead now with this "let's bring Lincoln down to near luxury" attitude Ford has because the luxury market requires devotion.

 

The MKZ and MKX they didn't even invest in unique sheet metal, what a crock ony the front is different. They are only moving from being completely dormant with Lincoln into throwing dressied up Fords at them to keep them from dieing, not making them the best theycan be. Ford's Niche will simply be luxury cars that are second tier to other brands.

 

Now they are stuck desperately trying to be like acura, only difference is acura has world class interiors and attract people under the age of seventy.

Edited November 5, 2006 by DCK

[Edgey]

I wonder if GM took a Malibu popped some chrome on it and gave it a retro interior, all while promoting it as a sports sedan against the BMW 3 series if you would have the same mindset for them. Because the is what the Zephyr was and Lincoln tried to market it against the 3 Series.

 

That is complete and utter crap.

 

Ford simply doesn't care, is not willing to put up a fight and being able to compete against the luxury leaders as the likes of BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Cadillac and so on.... that is the sole reason we are mouth fed the BS above in your post. Cadillac was ina worst situation than Lincoln and pledged to come back without excuses and they succeeded, Lincoln won't. Fordis making lincoln into really what Mercury should be.

 

Since when has Lincoln put the Zephyr against the 3-Series. Since when has Lincoln ever tried to peddle itself as an alternative to BMW? The last time they did that was the Lincoln LS, and although the car superb, it was a huge money-loser and failed to bring in the crowd.

 

Personally, I think the Zephyr was wildly over-priced car with the horrid D30, but it still sold up to expectations. The MKZ is a much better product for the money and I have no trouble endorsing the car after my first drive. Unfortunately, I ended up purchasing my first Caddy because the Zephyr couldn't compete. I'm certain my Wife would have liked the MKZ better than the CTS, although the CTS would have been cheaper in any case (those GM rebates make a big difference).

 

I am skeptical about the new MKS, but if the production version looks very close to the concept, then it should be sharp. There is a significant likelihood that the production version will loose its edge and become very Buicky. I hope they keep the lines crispy and slick. I am glad to see Licnoln moving away from the slab-sided design however. One of my favorite things about the Lincoln LS was the muscular fender designs and the MKS has some of that while the MKZ doesn't.

[DCK]

Since when has Lincoln put the Zephyr against the 3-Series. Since when has Lincoln ever tried to peddle itself as an alternative to BMW? The last time they did that was the Lincoln LS, and although the car superb, it was a huge money-loser and failed to bring in the crowd.

 

Obviously you didn't see any zephyr commercials comparing its engine againt the BMW 3 series.

 

Second the LS sold twice as much as the Zephyr sold, people loved it, brought in younger people and now a lot of kids at my college drive used ones, that shows how succesfull it was attracting a younger audience to lincoln.

 

Ford simply needed to advance their development to make it profitable, like what cadillac did with the sigma, but instead ford gave up turned lincoln from being the number one selling luxury mark with sales rising and average buying age lowering and turned them completely around to have its sales tumble and the average buying age into the 70's. I mean look at where it is where they only psotive thing the blind fanboys here can do is to praise it for selling a few more units than Infiniti, I guess that is a positive spin on going from number one to one the verge of dropping out of the top 5 in 5 short years.

 

This effort they are now pushing is nothing but a crock. IMO

[Edgey]

Lincoln LS may have sold better initially, but what kind of rebates did it take to keep them going? How much money did Ford lose on each one after that?

 

And no, I have never seen a Lincoln ad draw a line to a BMW. I would be very interested in seeing that ad.

 

Did you also know that the Zephyr is considerably larger than a 3-Series? It's actually bigger than a 5-series.

 

The MKZ is nearly 10K cheaper than an LS, offers AWD, 6-speed ATX, and far better fuel economy on an engine that burns regular; yet has a similar level of refinement (I didn't say comparable, but similar). The 2003 Lincoln LS lost most of its agile handling characteristics so the MKZ handles about as well as the outgoing LS. The LS does have better steering, but even that was numbed in 2003.

 

The LS has its own advantages of course, namely in cabin quietness, especially around the doors which are completely silent while they remain very noisy on the MKZ. This is one of the obvious characteristic carried over from the shared Fusion components. And, of course, there is that 280 HP smooth-as-silk drivetrain which is the real heart of the LS.

 

In any case, the MKZ offers some of what the LS did (and more), but for a lot less money. Unfortunately, without rebates, those who are use to buying $47,000 Lincolns will find it costs just as much to buy a $37,000 Lincoln.

Edited November 5, 2006 by Edgey

[silvrsvt]

anyway, the Lincoln Fairlame was cancelled, I remember reading it in the latest article about the Chicago factory.

 

The Lincoln Fairlane is going to be build in Oakville, not Chicago.

[lincmerc51]

Lincoln LS may have sold better initially, but what kind of rebates did it take to keep them going? How much money did Ford lose on each one after that?

 

And no, I have never seen a Lincoln ad draw a line to a BMW. I would be very interested in seeing that ad.

 

Did you also know that the Zephyr is considerably larger than a 3-Series? It's actually bigger than a 5-series.

 

The MKZ is nearly 10K cheaper than an LS, offers AWD, 6-speed ATX, and far better fuel economy on an engine that burns regular; yet has a similar level of refinement (I didn't say comparable, but similar). The 2003 Lincoln LS lost most of its agile handling characteristics so the MKZ handles about as well as the outgoing LS. The LS does have better steering, but even that was numbed in 2003.

 

The LS has its own advantages of course, namely in cabin quietness, especially around the doors which are completely silent while they remain very noisy on the MKZ. This is one of the obvious characteristic carried over from the shared Fusion components. And, of course, there is that 280 HP smooth-as-silk drivetrain which is the real heart of the LS.

 

In any case, the MKZ offers some of what the LS did (and more), but for a lot less money. Unfortunately, without rebates, those who are use to buying $47,000 Lincolns will find it costs just as much to buy a $37,000 Lincoln.

 

First, there have been Lincoln ads comparing a Lincoln to a Bimmer before. They appeared in 2003 or 2004 and showed an LS OUTHANDLING a BMW 5-Series.

Next, I dont know what you've been smoking but the LS certainly did NOT lose "most of its agile handling characteristics" in 2003. Where the hell did u get that? The LS is the best handling Lincoln ever built and probably the best that ever will be built.

 

The MKZ is nothing but a Mazda 6 with a waterfall grille, plusher seats and instruments from a 76 Granada. It is a FWD car and cannot compete withthe likes of the CTS on any level. I don't even know what the Z is supposed to compete against, save perhaps the Milan. And that ridiculous D-L shifter just absolutely KILLS any pretensions to be a sporty driver. To go from the LS with the option of a V8 or a 5speed manual or a select-shift manumatic to a V6-only with only 2 selectable forward gears is utterly shameful.

 

I own 2 Lincolns and it is my considered opinion that Lincoln will soon be dead. I see the future of Ford as Ford, Mazda and Volvo. Unless they sell Volvo.

 

Oh and I saw that you bought a CTS, cross-shopping with a Z? You make my case right there. However, if you are a Ford guy and could get A-plan (even if not) I am at a loss as to why you would get a CTS over an LS. Did u cross-shop the LS against the CTS? Unless you bought a CTS-V, the LS is the better car. Yeah, I know they're discontinued but there are 2006s to be had.

[SysEng]

Mullally also likes the Lexus LS and the Lincoln Towncar. Those who are hoping for a big, RWD flagship may actually get your wish with him at the helm.

 

Glad to hear that . Guess he need to make up for loseing out to the A380 someplace :shades: .

 

But I don't actually know if he understands some fo the problems he's up against at Ford. Though I have no doubt he understands the book-keeping parts real well.

 

First, he need to get a handle on PowerTrain. The "hurricane" project looks to be off side and losing focus based on what some posts we're seeing on this forum are saying.

 

Second, the Tranny division needs to beef up their products. There is a general trend to weaker trannies on an across the board basis in Detroit. For the companies sake, Mulally needs to stop that at Ford ... Pronto.

 

Third, he has to get the company planners OFF this "me too" kick they seem to be on. The long lived product lines are there for a reason, and if other manufacturers have to find a niche to compete against Ford, That is hardly a reason to follow them.

 

And Fourth, NEVER FORGET, the customer always wants Safety, Reliability and Economy in that order! Pizzazz is a nice "add on" only.

Edited November 5, 2006 by SysEng

[Extreme4x4]

The MKZ competes with the Lexus ES330.

 

I am guessing that somewhere along the lines, many of you just didn't see the article after article after article, that stated that Lincoln no longer was competing with Cadillac, but more with the upper end of Buick/ lower end of Lexus??? It was only talked about ad nauseum, some time back.

 

GM moved Cadillac upmarket. Ford moved Lincoln slightly down market.

 

DCX, what do you propose that Ford do with their limited resources??? Should they concentrate only on Lincoln??? Should they spend a billion or two on a new platform for Lincoln................ and billions more developing new stand alone products for Lincoln.................. all the while totally ignoring all other divisions / Ford included.

 

You have to look at the reality of the situation. Ford has limited resources. They are spending the most where they have to, on their highest volume product. That they are spending on the others at all, is rather amazing to me. Lincoln is getting new product at least. Once Ford brand is doing better in the NA market, then they will have more money to spend elsewhere.

 

Noone here has any dillusions that FMC made serious errors in the past. However, unless you have a time machine that noone knows about, the constant rehashing of what coulds, shoulda, woulda, is just a waste of time. NOONE has forgotten those errors, believe me. The difference is that most of us are at the "what do we need to do to fix it" stage.

 

You are not.

[lincmerc51]

The MKZ competes with the Lexus ES330.

 

I am guessing that somewhere along the lines, many of you just didn't see the article after article after article, that stated that Lincoln no longer was competing with Cadillac, but more with the upper end of Buick/ lower end of Lexus??? It was only talked about ad nauseum, some time back.

 

GM moved Cadillac upmarket. Ford moved Lincoln slightly down market.

 

Noone here has any dillusions that FMC made serious errors in the past. The difference is that most of us are at the "what do we need to do to fix it" stage.

 

You are not.

 

First, there is no more Lexus ES330. It is now the ES350. And it has more HP and gets better gas mileage than the Zephyr or the emmkayzee. And don't ask about reliability. Does anyone here think the MK Z would stand a ghost of a chance against the Lexus in a head-to-head comparo? The only thing the MKZ has going is it uses regular fuel, has std leather and offers AWD (an expensive, heavy failure-prone option).

The Lexus has a std moonroof, a SELECT_SHIFT 6Speed tranny(CAN SOMEONE WHO WORKS AT FORD TELL ME WHY THEY ARE USING THE STOOOOOPID D-L SHIFTER? IS THERE ANY HOPE OF SOMETHING AN ACTUAL DRIVER WOULD WANT, NOT A BLUE-HAIR COUCH RIDER?), stability control (which the Z does not even offer as an option), tire pressure monitor, 3 headrests in rear which are height-adjustable, and a few more doo-dads. The Lexus offers radar creuise and accident avoidance, bluetooth, parking assist and rear side airbag, amoung other things.

 

Oh, and the Lexus is not a warmed-over Mazda. Made in Mexico. YOu want a Mazda made in Mexico or a Lexus made in Japan. HMMMM?

 

Sorry, for me (an owner of 2 Lincolns) there is no comparison.

 

Next, yeah, I've seen lots of articles how Ford has decided to (paraphrasing here) CHEAPEN Lincoln to compete with Buick and not Cadillac. I haven't compared the Z to the Lucerne yet, but I know already that the Lucerne offers V8. 1 for Buick already. Of course, the article that these messges refer to says that Lincoln is bringing out 4 new models (the first lie or distortion, your choice) to compete agains BMW, CADILLAC and LEXUS. Buick is not mentioned. SO, has Lincoln changed direction again???

 

I do wish you and Ford lotsa luck, Gloria, but I see nothing in Lincoln's described future that will 'save' the brand, or compete with Lexus, let alone Buick.

Edited November 5, 2006 by lincmerc51

[silvrsvt]

First, there is no more Lexus ES330. It is now the ES350. And it has more HP and gets better gas mileage than the Zephyr or the emmkayzee. And don't ask about reliability. Does anyone here think the MK Z would stand a ghost of a chance against the Lexus in a head-to-head comparo? The only thing the MKZ has going is it uses regular fuel and offers AWD (an expensive, heavy failure-prone option).

The Lexus has a std moonroof, a SELECT_SHIFT 6Speed tranny(

 

Uh where do you get that AWD is a heavy failure prone system?

 

The Lexus is also nearly 6K more then the MKZ when fully optioned out. The only thing it has that the MKZ doesn't is the Radar cruse control and bluetooth intergration. Not to mention that XM or Sirius is $400 dollar option without a subscription, where as its a less then 200 dollar option on the MKZ with a 6 month subscription. The E350 doesnt offer traction control (according to KBB) nor heated and cooled seats like the MKZ