RichardJensen Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 What does this have to do with the Ford Motor Company ? Please move this thread. It's illustrative of the tendency of a few on this board to predict dire futures based on incomplete analysis of the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fords#1Fan Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 GO PATRIOTS!!! :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordFanForEver Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 My team, the St.louis rams had a bad season. 3-13. They had alot of injuries, but i gave them credit for trying. When on fire, the rams can dominate and maybe next season, the Greatest Show On Turf might return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Your point was to disguise a significant decline in Silverado volume. And you haven't told me what your opinion of the Patriots' future was in '93. The Patriots had no future until the Krafts bought the team in 1994. They almost went to STL before Kraft bought them. Remember the Cardinals went to Phoenix and a local STL businessman, Orthwine owned the Pats. When Kraft bought the team, you could tell right away that big changes were coming. Still until they hired Parcels, no one believed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 When Kraft bought the team, you could tell right away that big changes were coming. Still until they hired Parcels, no one believed. Hmmm. But with Mulally & Farley and a total change in business practices, it's just going to be "OH NOES!!!!!!!!!!! TEH FORD IS GOING DOWN!!!!!" Right. Riiiiggggghhhhhhhhhtttttttt. Go sell crazy somewhere else. We're full up here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Hmmm. But with Mulally & Farley and a total change in business practices, it's just going to be "OH NOES!!!!!!!!!!! TEH FORD IS GOING DOWN!!!!!" Right. Riiiiggggghhhhhhhhhtttttttt. Go sell crazy somewhere else. We're full up here. Mulally is trying to save his way to prosperity and is using Ford's cash to reduce expenses rather than to significantly increasre growth. It is a formula that has never worked. Without significant top line growth, Ford will continue to struggle. Ford ain't Boeing. Customers in the large commercial airplane market have only one other choice. However in the car business customers have many choices and if you want to be a success, you have to build the car or truck everyone wants and not the one you want to sell them. It is not easy and Ford, IMO, has not done it since the Explorer, a brand that should be the #1 SUV in the market today. Maybe the Explorer was more of an accident than research based. If it was research based, then Ford would know the process and what was required to build the car that people want to buy. This process has been endemic in the Japanese since Deming and is sorely lacking in most US manufacturers, however Lutz gets it. When Ford dismissed the hybrid and the diesel out of hand, it was clear that Ford had problems. For example what would Ford give for a 50 state 3.0L diesel with 25/33+ right now? How about a hybrid that looks better than a Prius and gets better performance? Personally I don't think Mulally gets it and since he is CEO, Ford may turn a profit, but at the cost of the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Mulally is trying to save his way to prosperity and is using Ford's cash to reduce expenses rather than to significantly increasre growth. It is a formula that has never worked. Without significant top line growth, Ford will continue to struggle. Ford ain't Boeing. Customers in the large commercial airplane market have only one other choice. However in the car business customers have many choices and if you want to be a success, you have to build the car or truck everyone wants and not the one you want to sell them. It is not easy and Ford, IMO, has not done it since the Explorer, a brand that should be the #1 SUV in the market today. Maybe the Explorer was more of an accident than research based. If it was research based, then Ford would know the process and what was required to build the car that people want to buy. This process has been endemic in the Japanese since Deming and is sorely lacking in most US manufacturers, however Lutz gets it. When Ford dismissed the hybrid and the diesel out of hand, it was clear that Ford had problems. For example what would Ford give for a 50 state 3.0L diesel with 25/33+ right now? How about a hybrid that looks better than a Prius and gets better performance? Personally I don't think Mulally gets it and since he is CEO, Ford may turn a profit, but at the cost of the company. Milf, Flex coming, 09 F-150 coming, fusion Hybrid COMING, Verve coming, new Explorer in the works, RWD platforms ( panther replacement? ) coming, upgraded Escape with HYBRID right around the corner, but wait theres more......sure day late and dollar short...but ITS COMING! Future looks pretty good, I will be the first to ask you about a year from now.....would you like a side of potatoes with the crow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 This process has been endemic in the Japanese since Deming and is sorely lacking in most US manufacturers, however Lutz gets it. Gee, Peter, you keep justifying my pics. Bob "too much quality can ruin you" Lutz most certainly does NOT understand Deming. Bob Lutz is, if anything, the ANTI-Deming. His "8 Laws of Business" are in clear conflict with Deming's 14 points of management. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Milf, Flex coming, 09 F-150 coming, fusion Hybrid COMING, Verve coming, new Explorer in the works, RWD platforms ( panther replacement? ) coming, upgraded Escape with HYBRID right around the corner, but wait theres more......sure day late and dollar short...but ITS COMING! Future looks pretty good, I will be the first to ask you about a year from now.....would you like a side of potatoes with the crow? Be very happy to eat the crow, however let's wait and see if the actual is as good as the promised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Gee, Peter, you keep justifying my pics. Bob "too much quality can ruin you" Lutz most certainly does NOT understand Deming. Bob Lutz is, if anything, the ANTI-Deming. His "8 Laws of Business" are in clear conflict with Deming's 14 points of management. Maybe but Lutz understands that to be sucessful you must sell what people want to buy and not what you think they should buy. I give you the Malibu and the Buick Enclave SUV as a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 (edited) Be very happy to eat the crow, however let's wait and see if the actual is as good as the promised. beleive me...with 20 years of constantly having hopes shattered with the OCCASIONAL "horray" all this new product has great potential...add to that the development of the ecoboosts with exceptional economy and I have a gut feeling the board rooms as your beloved Toyota boardroom may be littered with fingers....... Edited February 1, 2008 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 (edited) if he's knocked out of it he will :P :shades: Sorry Patriots offensive line is not allowing any sacks on Sunday. Unlike the last game, the Patriots have the two starters who were out due to injuries. Brady to Moss all day long. or Brady to Welker, to Faulk, to Gaffney, etc. You get the picture. Rerun Pats offense in the Jacksonville game. Edited February 1, 2008 by mlhm5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 I give you the Malibu and the Buick Enclave SUV as a start. Yeah. Because Ford totally screwed up the Fusion and Edge. :rolleyes: Maybe YOU need to realize that global platform integration is the ONLY area where GM is ahead of Ford. Ford already does a darn sight better when it comes to managing money, their quality is so much better than GM's that the two don't even belong in the same sentence anymore, unless your contrasting them, and Ford has put more desirables on the market than GM. Ford actually has a full hybrid vehicle nearing its second generation, and a PIH variant undergoing testing. GM has a vaporware vehicle alleged to go on sale maybe in 2 years. You could not possibly pick a less apt comparison than GM. === AND, BTW, Mulally negotiated that loan in part to guarantee money to finance R&D regardless of what the short term economic situation is in '08. Blah blah blah "Mulally is trying to save his way to profitability" Nothing like discarding facts to paint a gloomy picture. === Although Ford DID save $1B last year due to improved quality. But you can't save your way to profitability, can you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Sorry Patriots offensive line is not allowing any sacks on Sunday. Unlike the last game, the Patriots have the two starters who were out due to injuries. Brady to Moss all day long. or Brady to Welker, to Faulk, to Gaffney, etc. You get the picture. Rerun Pats offense in the Jacksonville game. You argue for the sake of aruging Huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 It's illustrative of the tendency of a few on this board to predict dire futures based on incomplete analysis of the past. Illustrate this: "retail sales at dealerships - an area that Ford has tried to stabilize as part of its restructuring - fell 9% in January" Inventory is piling up and according to Ford. "It's not going to get any easier - at least for a while," said Ford Motor Co.'s (F) marketing chief, Jim Farley. "Recent monetary actions and the proposed stimulus package may help the economy later this year, but we're not pinning our hopes on that." Shorter, 2008 is in the toilet. Sure, I am willing to eat crow if I am wrong but didn't Bill Ford promise that 25% of Ford's profit would come from the luxury group in 2005? All we have ever gotten from Ford are promises and tell me why we should believe now when the record speaks for itself. If Ford puts a vehicle out that compares favorably with the Buick Enclave, then I will start to believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sixt9coug Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Im rooting for the Patriots just because the Giants beat Green Bay I wanted to see Favre get one more then head out to pasture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pictor Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 While having the oil changed on our Edge at the local dealer, aprox. 10 miles from the home of the soon to be 2008 Super Bowl champions NE Pats, I had an opportunity to walk around the dealership and was surprised at the lack of new inventory on site. A couple of Taurus, one Taurus X, a few Escapes, a few Focus, a few Edges, a few Fusions and a sufficient number of trucks and Explorers. One of the sales guys came out and I was curious about this and asked how the last two months have been. He stated that they had two very good months and that they actually outsold the two larger GM dealers located within a mile of this very small dealership by a large margin. His biggest complaint was that their allocation has been so reduced that they were having trouble getting inventory restocked. Ford may actually be in a good position to weather the recession. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2008 Author Share Posted February 2, 2008 "retail sales at dealerships - an area that Ford has tried to stabilize as part of its restructuring - fell 9% in January" Inventory is piling up and according to Ford. If Ford puts a vehicle out that compares favorably with the Buick Enclave, then I will start to believe. 1) And what was retail demand for the entire market? Where was that at? Crapper too, eh? Well, then there you go. Overall SAR is more than 10% off last January, so a 9% drop in retail sales matches, more or less, the action of the entire market. Ford is not in a position to pick up market share, however, they are in position to hold steady as Farley indicated on that conference call. 2) Inventory is almost exactly what it was last year, and with a 4% drop in overall volume, that does not even remotely qualify as "piling up" 3) 'If if if if,' it's all excuses from -you- too. Ford Edge volume is approximately equal to the cumulative total of the Lambda crossovers, and you dismiss it, demanding some other token to justify extending the slightest amount of credit to an individual (Mark Fields) who was tasked with turning around FoE during the 2001/2002 recession. Who had to turn around Mazda in the 90s Japanese depression (let's call that what it was), and who currently works for the man who had to salvage Boeing's commercial airline business in a global recession and after catastrophic drop in airline load factors that forced many of his customers into bankruptcy protection. As far as this recession is concerned, for Mulally and Fields, it's very much 'been there, done that'. Can you say the same for a company that just had to write off $39B in tax assets based on the likelihood that they will not be used within the foreseeable future? But, no, it's much easier to do this: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZanatWork Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Why is this posted in the FoMoCo forum by a Moderator??? Because it's leading up to Superbowl weekend...and he gave the posters the credit of assuming they WEREN'T anal-intensive morons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2005Explorer Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 FREAKING WORTHLESS PATRIOTS...WHAT A BUNCH OF SCREW-UPS! How can you win all season then loose it all????? Sorry just a frustrated Patriots fan. What a crappy team! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nwe/1993.htm No way THAT team wins a Super Bowl anytime in the next 10 years.... (p.s. I'll be rooting for the Giants this weekend.) And I guess you were right, they did suck...lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Sorry Patriots offensive line is not allowing any sacks on Sunday. Unlike the last game, the Patriots have the two starters who were out due to injuries. Brady to Moss all day long. or Brady to Welker, to Faulk, to Gaffney, etc. You get the picture. Rerun Pats offense in the Jacksonville game. 3 Sacks 2 passes to Moss And they LOST! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 And I guess you were right, they did suck...lol. Can you imagine? The only game you lose all year is the SUPER BOWL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordFFfan Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 I have a new tagline for the Patriots. "Nobodies perfect" I don't know who was better the Giant's defense or Eli Manning. I have to give it the Patriots though for putting up a great game, my game was in a knot the entire game. They made some fantastic plays, and shouldn't be discredited for all the work they put in. Both teams did a great job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Sorry Patriots offensive line is not allowing any sacks on Sunday. Unlike the last game, the Patriots have the two starters who were out due to injuries. Brady to Moss all day long. or Brady to Welker, to Faulk, to Gaffney, etc. You get the picture. Rerun Pats offense in the Jacksonville game. Once again, you are WRONG! I'll give you this: at least you're consistent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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