H. D. Hogman Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 OK, but what's "decent?" If you ask 10 people, you'll probably get 8 different answers. Here's a suggestion: give the people from the 70's their lost time back, on condition that if they get it, they must retire. How many people would that get, company-wide? I think that's a number the company could count on to go. I would be OUT in a heart beat !!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. D. Hogman Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Can you be more specific about people who were laid off in 79/80? I heard something today at our union meeting that I think goes along with what you are saying about 79/80 layoffs. fantasyfrank what did you hear about the 79/80 layoffs at your union meeting ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellcat_F6F Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Put me down as one of the people who would've jumped at $140k and accrued pension. Ford must want me to hang around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justhefacts Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Boo-Yeah!Truer words were never spoken. Give us our time back, but just for retirement purposes, and we are GONE! All I want is what I've got coming to me. All I want is my fair share. Ha Ha! Seriously though, just throw us a freakin' bone. I've got 20 years in; If Ford would give us credit for our 20 plus years, with a "2/3 of 30" retirement offer, including healthcare until Medicare kicks in, then that would make it easy enough to go. Otherwise, you'd have to be crazy to go. It will be our jobs to stay and make Ford Motor pay for their transgressions. And pay, and pay, and pay... So it's a REAL 20 year retirement offer, or nothing for me. There you go Ford, and I've already given you the snappy little acronym;-) REAL: Restitution Enabled And Liberated program. Now, put that in your Pinto four-banger and smoke it. yOU GOT THAT RIGHT!!! Give me the time back that I lost hired in 78 laid off in 83 then rehired in 95 you give me my time back & 70K with bennies & veba GOOOOOONE in sixty seconds.............................................. Pipe dreaming it just anit gonna happen!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOULJABOY Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Folks this is my first post on here. So be gentle with me. I would like to get back to the one question that was asked so long ago, " What would it take for you to leave? ". I am too young to leave and too old to go anywhere else, yet I feel young enough to make a new start on life with the right buy-out package. I have less than 15 years in and more than 10. For the people in my senority range it will take a larger amount of money for us to go. We more-than-likely will get no future retirement or healthcare, so money is our only option unless you count the education package. I understand how all the 20 plus year people feel more so the one's with the break in service. You people should get something for your trouble. A better healthcare package at best. Greatest is to get all your lost time back. We are all in this together though. As I see it we can sit at our computer's all day long and bitch to each other as to who deserves what or we can use that same time to send E-MAILS to our local and international Union Reps to broker a better buy-out deal. Calling each other names and saying which plant or which type of employee is better is nothing more than keeping the bigwigs in Detroit amused. UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasyfrank Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 fantasyfrank what did you hear about the 79/80 layoffs at your union meeting ??? Our union prez stated that if Ford didn't get the numbers they want for this round of buyouts, they will come after the people who were laid off back in 79/80 and bridge our time, then we would retire. In my case, I hired in June of 78. I would assume IF this happens and I take the offer I would be gone this coming June. That's the way I'm taking this info. I will believe it when I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 The way I see this and this is my own opinion all of these posts are missing the whole picture. 1) The Union negotiated these packages for people that want to leave with some incentive. No more no less. Voluntary!!!!! 2) The packages are not designed to give someone with 8 years seniority age 35, 140,000 and benefits for the rest of their lives. Or give me 10,000 for every year of service. Will not happen……Never will happen 3) Management is clearly trying to reduce retirement eligible employees with the new incentives. 4) The 50k and 70k and possibility of getting back lost pension credits are a clear sign of this action. 5) Instead of complaining why are we not being supportive of our union and all of these efforts to give people options never seen in any other sector. If I was an outside customer looking to buy a Ford, reading through these selfish posts I would be turned off from all of this rhetoric and probably go to a competitor’s brand. If this alarms you go back and look at what we are posting publically and how these posts end up after 3 pages. This board is for information among the employees not bashing the Union or our brothers and sisters. Let’s share good info and not be so selfish…….. Good Luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Alan has no say so in the VEBA waldfk! The UAW wants everyone to stay!!! That means that the Veba will be safe. Especially when you guys croak in the plant. That is just less we have to pay for your health care and leaves more for me. :happy feet: Correction, UAW doesnt want anyone to GO with any VEBA money since they are in charge of admin. it. They probably would get a ton of them if they offered 140k,pension and VEBA. The more on VEBA for a longer period of time could get dicey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moon0917 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Our union prez stated that if Ford didn't get the numbers they want for this round of buyouts, they will come after the people who were laid off back in 79/80 and bridge our time, then we would retire. In my case, I hired in June of 78. I would assume IF this happens and I take the offer I would be gone this coming June. That's the way I'm taking this info. I will believe it when I see it. They should give everyone their time back... 8 years ago at Wixom, the cafeteria had a reduction. Most of these employees who worked in the cafeteria had at least 8 years seniority. Due to them losing their jobs, they were given the opportunity to become production workers. A few months after they started working production, they got together and started a lawsuit against Ford Motor Company to be given back the time they lost. Several whom I know personally, were given their time back. One actually worked on the floor approximately 2 years slipped and fell, won a huge settlement against the company including the 18 years she worked in the cafeteria. To make a long story short, she recently retired with a 30 year pension only having worked on the floor 2 years. The kicker is, they worked for an outside company, not Ford Motor Company while working in the cafeteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 (edited) They should give everyone their time back... 8 years ago at Wixom, the cafeteria had a reduction. Most of these employees who worked in the cafeteria had at least 8 years seniority. Due to them losing their jobs, they were given the opportunity to become production workers. A few months after they started working production, they got together and started a lawsuit against Ford Motor Company to be given back the time they lost. Several whom I know personally, were given their time back. One actually worked on the floor approximately 2 years slipped and fell, won a huge settlement against the company including the 18 years she worked in the cafeteria. To make a long story short, she recently retired with a 30 year pension only having worked on the floor 2 years. The kicker is, they worked for an outside company, not Ford Motor Company while working in the cafeteria. The key work is worked...these employees worked at Ford, maybe not Ford, but at Ford. I still don't think they deserved, but great for them...Those that were laid off in 79,80 were laid off and not called back in any order. Some supervisors kids got brought to other plants with no regaurd for seniority. There was nothing in the agreement about transfering to other openings in the Ford system. There were a lot that did not get the opportunity while some with less seniority did. This would not happen today because we have language that protects us. Although this is extremely costly to the company, the UAW and company are working on creating a formula to get these members some time back!! If they give time back it will only be to receive a packages. Keep your fingers crossed and lockers cleaned out!! :party2: PS...I don't know if any time back will get you 50k & 70k....just retirement!! keep fingers crossed on this!!! Edited January 27, 2008 by Captain723 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendew_15 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 The key work is worked...these employees worked at Ford, maybe not Ford, but at Ford. I still don't think they deserved, but great for them...Those that were laid off in 79,80 were laid off and not called back in any order. Some supervisors kids got brought to other plants with no regaurd for seniority. There was nothing in the agreement about transfering to other openings in the Ford system. There were a lot that did not get the opportunity while some with less seniority did. This would not happen today because we have language that protects us.Although this is extremely costly to the company, the UAW and company are working on creating a formula to get these members some time back!! If they give time back it will only be to receive a packages. Keep your fingers crossed and lockers cleaned out!! :party2: PS...I don't know if any time back will get you 50k & 70k....just retirement!! keep fingers crossed on this!!! I feel ya on that.I have a guy I work with who was laid off in 79 and not called back until 91.He said alot of people he know for a fact were called back before him that shouldn't have been if they went in any kind of order. He said if they give him his time he is gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. D. Hogman Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I feel ya on that.I have a guy I work with who was laid off in 79 and not called back until 91.He said alot of people he know for a fact were called back before him that shouldn't have been if they went in any kind of order. He said if they give him his time he is gone. From what I was told about calling people back in no certain order was....... The company did not have to call anyone back that was laid off longer than you worked because you had NO recall rights so that's how the company got around from calling back by senority. It happened to me BUT if they give us our time back ..... I'M GONE :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 From what I was told about calling people back in no certain order was....... The company did not have to call anyone back that was laid off longer than you worked because you had NO recall rights so that's how the company got around from calling back by senority. It happened to me BUT if they give us our time back ..... I'M GONE :happy feet: :happy feet: :happy feet: Good Luck...hope this happens for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Put me down as one of the people who would've jumped at $140k and accrued pension. Ford must want me to hang around. I'll walk for $140.000 and no pension! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbldbxorntnap Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 The key work is worked...these employees worked at Ford, maybe not Ford, but at Ford. I still don't think they deserved, but great for them...Those that were laid off in 79,80 were laid off and not called back in any order. Some supervisors kids got brought to other plants with no regard for seniority. There was nothing in the agreement about transferring to other openings in the Ford system. There were a lot that did not get the opportunity while some with less seniority did. This would not happen today because we have language that protects us.Although this is extremely costly to the company, the UAW and company are working on creating a formula to get these members some time back!! If they give time back it will only be to receive a packages. Keep your fingers crossed and lockers cleaned out!! :party2: PS...I don't know if any time back will get you 50k & 70k....just retirement!! keep fingers crossed on this!!! I agree with what your saying, I think they were being secretive about things like the PPP, take me for example, i got laid off from NAP in 11/80 then a friend and myself heard a rumor that NAP was going back on two shifts, false but were informed about the PPP by one of the truly honest salary labor reps. i jumped on it, my friend didn't [ at that time three plants in ford system were going back on double shifts ST PAUL, AAP and Kansas truck] It would be interesting to know how many people stayed in touch with their base plant to find out info. like this or just waited around for ford to call them back . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain723 Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I'll walk for $140.000 and no pension! have you been drinking the koolaid or something...no pension??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I know a perfect foolproof way to get people with 30+ years out the door. For every year past 30, deduct $50 from their monthly pension check. Watch the mass exodus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I know a perfect foolproof way to get people with 30+ years out the door.For every year past 30, deduct $50 from their monthly pension check. Watch the mass exodus. There you go. Take away that little extra if they dont go by say Apr 1st. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trimdingman Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I know a perfect foolproof way to get people with 30+ years out the door. For every year past 30, deduct $50 from their monthly pension check. Watch the mass exodus. I would stay longer. Wages+Overtime=$50,000 a year more than pension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 I would stay longer. Wages+Overtime=$50,000 a year more than pension. And, the company will pay for the ambulance ride from the plant when you die of a heart attack! :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 (edited) have you been drinking the koolaid or something...no pension??? Cap I did not lie in my earlier postings, I have other marketable skills and made a good living before coming to Ford. $140,000 after tax would pay my house off, and then I could go back to opperating heavy equipment with no house payment. I would acctually be better off and have a better job, (maybe not as high paying) at least one that I prefer. I loved excavating! I would not doubt the Pension is next to go, next contract they'll be crying Pension, pension, pension, "we have to close the gap with our competitors!" and you guys will be telling us why it is better for the union to control the pension fund! If I stay I don't see us having a pension when it is time for me to retire, so why not take $140,000 with no pension and run. At least I can be my own man again, and basically run my own crew. If it was offered, I think you would be surprised to see how many will take it! I know a perfect foolproof way to get people with 30+ years out the door. For every year past 30, deduct $50 from their monthly pension check. Watch the mass exodus. Instead of 30 and out change the wording to mandatory 30 and out with possible 1 or 2 year extensions if a child is in college, and people will take it seriously and get their sh-t together before it's time to go. Anyone who has been working for Ford for 30 years at this point and is not financially prepared for retirement, is an over indulgent boob!!!!!!!! Edited January 28, 2008 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twincam Harley Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Allow me to play devil's advocate here for a minute. Let's say Ford doesn't get many to take these buyouts. They are still going to do the reduction they are looking for albeit through idling plants or shift reductions. Now we have all of those folks in JSP. Then Ford comes and offers all in JSP two transfer opportunities that they are required to do by contract. Now, those layed off have to make a rather quick choice, either transfer, buyout or do nothing and quit receiving pay, benefits and healthcare. Seems like one way the company could trim the rolls fairly quickly if they didn't get the buyout numbers they needed. If you don't like the buyout packages, don't take one. Keep working and enjoying the great pay and benefits we receive. For all those wishing for $200K and medical and full pension, keep dreaming. Based on the offers this time around, I'd say Ford is specifically targeting those that already have 30 years in. I bet a large group of them take it, especially skilled trades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twincam Harley Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Instead of 30 and out change the wording to mandatory 30 and out with possible 1 or 2 year extensions if a child is in college, and people will take it seriously and get their sh-t together before it's time to go. Anyone who has been working for Ford for 30 years at this point and is not financially prepared for retirement, is an over indulgent boob!!!!!!!! Get real. Although I won't, if I want to work until I have 45 year sin, I will. You are ELIGIBLE to retire at 30 years and IT WILL ALWAYS stay that way. Who are you to say when enough is enough? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSMJ Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 (edited) Allow me to play devil's advocate here for a minute. Let's say Ford doesn't get many to take these buyouts. They are still going to do the reduction they are looking for albeit through idling plants or shift reductions. Now we have all of those folks in JSP. Then Ford comes and offers all in JSP two transfer opportunities that they are required to do by contract. Now, those layed off have to make a rather quick choice, either transfer, buyout or do nothing and quit receiving pay, benefits and healthcare. Seems like one way the company could trim the rolls fairly quickly if they didn't get the buyout numbers they needed. they will trim it big time just wait. And the Ford plant employees are alot safer then the non ford employees (AKA ACH), there the ones who will be on the fence regardless of seniority because they aint bumping noone working at a Ford plant period..................... Edited January 28, 2008 by CSMJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 Ford, at this time, does not NEED people to take buyouts. They just want to reduce the workforce so they can hire people at the lower wage. If Ford got rid of all the TFT's at their plants, there would be plenty of room for the people at the closing plants and ACH Ford workers, trades excluded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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