The C&D Midsize Sedan Comparison

[MKII]

So the 2006 Fusion could be had with the red inserts in the seats?

[NickF1011]

So it seems. Who knows, maybe next year the Fusion moves up to first place in the C&D comparison test. I somehow doubt it but you never know right? But as for right now, I have to say I can understand them taking issue with the engine and tranny because I've driven the 4 cylinder Fusion and I came away with the same impression of the drivetrain. Very unrefined.

 

Unfortunately I agree. I really wanted to get my girlfriend into a Fusion...but after we test drove an I4 automatic, I can completely understand why she didn't want anything to do with it. Shame too. She loved the rest of the car.

[SVT_MAN]

Unfortunately I agree. I really wanted to get my girlfriend into a Fusion...but after we test drove an I4 automatic, I can completely understand why she didn't want anything to do with it. Shame too. She loved the rest of the car.

 

Same thing happened to me, but my GF had no business test driving the Fusion anyway. I didn't realize she was already making $470 / month payments on her truck. So, we're looking into Mercury Cougars for her now (2000+). The I4 in the Fusion was really loud and coarse with the automatic tranny. We insisted on a manual. She actually loved the 5spd I4 in the Milan we test drove. If she had the money, she would have bought it. The I4 is actually not the problem. It's the transmission, as many, including CD have mentioned. That transmission is not a compliment to the car at all.

[NickF1011]

Same thing happened to me, but my GF had no business test driving the Fusion anyway. I didn't realize she was already making $470 / month payments on her truck. So, we're looking into Mercury Cougars for her now (2000+). The I4 in the Fusion was really loud and coarse with the automatic tranny. We insisted on a manual. She actually loved the 5spd I4 in the Milan we test drove. If she had the money, she would have bought it. The I4 is actually not the problem. It's the transmission, as many, including CD have mentioned. That transmission is not a compliment to the car at all.

 

Yeah well...teaching her to drive stick is still a work in progress on my end.

[SVT_MAN]

Yeah well...teaching her to drive stick is still a work in progress on my end.

 

NickF1011 : Not particularly happy to say it, but my GF knew how to drive a stick long before I did. She learned when she was 16. I didn't learn until last summer (I'm 21). She tried having me drive her 2004 F-250 SuperDuty this past summer ... it was a bad situation. I told her I didn't know how to drive stick, but she was like, c'mon just try it. I only stalled it once, but I was really nervous about driving the thing because it was so expensive. Honestly, the most intimidating thing wasn't driving a stick - it was driving a vehicle that huge. I had never driven a truck before. The other thing that threw me off was that the only manual I had driven previously was the 99 Mustang GT. Way different clutch setup. (I had only driven the Mustang once before. So I, for all reasonable purposes, basically had never driven a stick ..) Then she put me in her 4 cylinder Probe which felt the same clutch-wise as her truck. Clutches - you never know what they're going to feel like it seems.

 

Also, in terms of you - I wonder which vehicle you are teaching her to drive a stick on? I would use the 6 if I were you. My girlfriend was so scared to drive my Mustang. She would let the clutch out so slowly. She's like "When it is going to catch?" And, she's been driving stick forever. The problem is, she's used to vehicles with adequete power, so she is pretty liberal with throttle application. I was afraid that we'd do a burnout or something in the Mustang. Instead, we drove around like granny ... because she was so afraid of the car.

Edited January 28, 2008 by SVT_MAN

[NickF1011]

NickF1011 : Not particularly happy to say it, but my GF knew how to drive a stick long before I did. She learned when she was 16. I didn't learn until last summer (I'm 21). She tried having me drive her 2004 F-250 SuperDuty this past summer ... it was a bad situation. I told her I didn't know how to drive stick, but she was like, c'mon just try it. I only stalled it once, but I was really nervous about driving the thing because it was so expensive. Honestly, the most intimidating thing wasn't driving a stick - it was driving a vehicle that huge. I had never driven a truck before. The other thing that threw me off was that the only manual I had driven previously was the 99 Mustang GT. Way different clutch setup. (I had only driven the Mustang once before. So I, for all reasonable purposes, basically had never driven a stick ..) Then she put me in her 4 cylinder Probe which felt the same clutch-wise as her truck. Clutches - you never know what they're going to feel like it seems.

 

Also, in terms of you - I wonder which vehicle you are teaching her to drive a stick on? I would use the 6 if I were you. My girlfriend was so scared to drive my Mustang. She would let the clutch out so slowly. She's like "When it is going to catch?" And, she's been driving stick forever. The problem is, she's used to vehicles with adequete power, so she is pretty liberal with throttle application. I was afraid that we'd do a burnout or something in the Mustang. Instead, we drove around like granny ... because she was so afraid of the car.

 

Oh I know what you mean about the different clutch feels between vehicles. They couldn't be more night-and-day between my Cobra and the 6. I wouldn't wish the Cobra upon ANYONE trying to learn to drive a manual. The clutch is pretty stiff with relatively long throws, and with the 4.10s, it's pretty unforgiving off the line. I've definitely been using the 6 to teach her. She's doing okay. I'm sure she would do just fine out on the open road, but she's afraid to try it. We've gotten it through 4 gears and reverse just fine in some big empty parking lots, so I don't know what's holding her back. I think it might be the hills. I remember being terrified whenever a car would pull behind me at a red light if we were facing uphill.

[Edstock]

I think it might be the hills. I remember being terrified whenever a car would pull behind me at a red light if we were facing uphill.

 

Ford should adopt something that Studebaker originated and copied by Subaru, called a "Hill Holder". It's simple. On a hill, as the car comes to a stop, the clutch pedal is depressed and the brake pedal is depressed. THe Hill Holder allows you to take your foot off the brake pedal. When the clutch pedal rises for take-off, the brakes release. Worked really well on my old '54 Commander V-8 3-in-the-tree with electric O/D.

[NickF1011]

Ford should adopt something that Studebaker originated and copied by Subaru, called a "Hill Holder". It's simple. On a hill, as the car comes to a stop, the clutch pedal is depressed and the brake pedal is depressed. THe Hill Holder allows you to take your foot off the brake pedal. When the clutch pedal rises for take-off, the brakes release. Worked really well on my old '54 Commander V-8 3-in-the-tree with electric O/D.

 

BMW uses a system like that also. It's pretty slick.

[Michael Reynolds]

I don't believe they could say the interior was fantastic................wit the new sonata interior, the Fusion only beats the Avenger as far as interior goes and the Avenger will get a new interior next month...................most likely leaving the fusion with the worst interior in its class........but to be positive the 09 fusion is around the corner and if Ford is thinking it will have a new interior as it desperately needs one...I still can't understand why the Taurus didn't get a new interior.

 

You don't even know what the updates to the Avenger's interior will be. So let's not jump the gun, lets also not jump the gun in terms of what Hyundai is offering either. I've yet to see something from that company that vastly exceeds what everyone else offers.

 

Then you have cars like the Camry (which offers up NOTHING special), the Malibu's aint that great either. Ford's main issue here is the radio head unit and goofy gauge cluster that lacks inspiration.

[Noah Harbinger]

NickF1011 : Not particularly happy to say it, but my GF knew how to drive a stick long before I did. She learned when she was 16. I didn't learn until last summer (I'm 21). She tried having me drive her 2004 F-250 SuperDuty this past summer ... it was a bad situation. I told her I didn't know how to drive stick, but she was like, c'mon just try it. I only stalled it once, but I was really nervous about driving the thing because it was so expensive. Honestly, the most intimidating thing wasn't driving a stick - it was driving a vehicle that huge. I had never driven a truck before. The other thing that threw me off was that the only manual I had driven previously was the 99 Mustang GT. Way different clutch setup. (I had only driven the Mustang once before. So I, for all reasonable purposes, basically had never driven a stick ..) Then she put me in her 4 cylinder Probe which felt the same clutch-wise as her truck. Clutches - you never know what they're going to feel like it seems.

 

Also, in terms of you - I wonder which vehicle you are teaching her to drive a stick on? I would use the 6 if I were you. My girlfriend was so scared to drive my Mustang. She would let the clutch out so slowly. She's like "When it is going to catch?" And, she's been driving stick forever. The problem is, she's used to vehicles with adequete power, so she is pretty liberal with throttle application. I was afraid that we'd do a burnout or something in the Mustang. Instead, we drove around like granny ... because she was so afraid of the car.

 

A girlfriend tried to teach me to drive stick... in a busy parking lot (lots of restaurants with sunday morning traffic coming in and out). This was before I even had my license. It did not go well.

[atomaro]

Why is that so shocking or hard to understand?

 

 

Because despite a lot of improvements, they are still big POS. Actually, I shouldnt complain...if it weren't for them, I'd only be working 5 days a week instead of 6.

[silvrsvt]

Better learn to like ! The comapny is betting on selling a lot of the 2.5L version, especially w/ExoBoost in Fusion and probably Taurus as well as Edge, Flex and the new Explorer. It might even show up as the base engine on the Mustang !

 

How much of the 2.5L is based on the 2.3L? The impressions around here was that it was a new engine or much improved upon, since both FNA and FOE didn't care for it all that much, since it sucked down gas pretty bad...

[rmc523]

So the 2006 Fusion could be had with the red inserts in the seats?

 

No, that's new for either 07 or 08, he was implying that that's when the vehicle was all new.

[BORG]

I just got my issue of this rag and I honestly don't understand what they are talking about with the 2.3L. It's not nearly that bad.

 

I agree that the CD3 is a better chassis than the bits and pieces bolted onto them, but that was true of the D3 and those have been substantially improved by the new drivetrains.

[BlackHorse]

I just got my issue of this rag and I honestly don't understand what they are talking about with the 2.3L. It's not nearly that bad.

 

I agree that the CD3 is a better chassis than the bits and pieces bolted onto them, but that was true of the D3 and those have been substantially improved by the new drivetrains.

 

I have to disagree, when I drove a Fusion the transmission was god awful and it had the motor winding out to 3500 or 4000 rpm for shift changes under normal acceleration. I don't blame them for thrashing it.

 

Frankly posts about how good the Fusion is going to be in a year or two with the 2.5 engine don't matter. That car is not available right now. Right now at this time in present day if someone wants a 4 cylinder Fusion they have to get the 2.3 with the screwy transmission. Promises and platitudes about what is coming down the road don't sell cars right now. Who tested this car before they put it on the market anyway? Who at Ford thought this drivetrain wasn't going to get bashed on for being so coarse? Rightly so. You can't sell me a 2.5 Fusion because one doesn't exist right now. So it doesn't matter how good it's going to be. By that time the car may have developed enough of a stigma that it won't matter.

[Admiral]

Right now at this time in present day if someone wants a 4 cylinder Fusion they have to get the 2.3 with the screwy transmission.

 

What's wrong with the MTX-75 five-speed manual? It works dandy in my Focus, shifts perfectly every time.

[BlackHorse]

What's wrong with the MTX-75 five-speed manual? It works dandy in my Focus, shifts perfectly every time.

 

From what I hear, nothing is wrong with it, except that you'll be hard pressed to find one on a lot and if you do you'll be really hard pressed to find two. LOL Look we both know the vast majority of midsize sedan buyers don't want a stick shift, they want automatics. That's like saying "Hey I want good semi-auto rifle from Acme rifles." The guys at Acme say "Have a shotgun instead."

[Admiral]

From what I hear, nothing is wrong with it, except that you'll be hard pressed to find one on a lot and if you do you'll be really hard pressed to find two. LOL Look we both know the vast majority of midsize sedan buyers don't want a stick shift, they want automatics. That's like saying "Hey I want good semi-auto rifle from Acme rifles." The guys at Acme say "Have a shotgun instead."

 

Yeah. I bet you'd have to special order a five-speed CD3 if you really wanted one! Lazy Americans won't change their own gears so no dealers stock five-speed cars. It's a shame too, if more people drove manual transmissions they'd probably love them. But they won't, and IMO part of the problem is that car companies don't build enough cars with good manual transmissions. Oh, but that's right, you can't text message, drink a latte and change gears at the same time so Americans just opt for the auto. It sucks for enthusiasts like me because (unless my left leg gets amputated) I don't ever want an automatic. And I don't care how good a 'manumatic' transmission is (even VW's awesome DSD), it's just not the same.

[BlackHorse]

Yeah. I bet you'd have to special order a five-speed CD3 if you really wanted one! Lazy Americans won't change their own gears so no dealers stock five-speed cars. It's a shame too, if more people drove manual transmissions they'd probably love them. But they won't, and IMO part of the problem is that car companies don't build enough cars with good manual transmissions. Oh, but that's right, you can't text message, drink a latte and change gears at the same time so Americans just opt for the auto. It sucks for enthusiasts like me because (unless my left leg gets amputated) I don't ever want an automatic. And I don't care how good a 'manumatic' transmission is (even VW's awesome DSD), it's just not the same.

 

Well don't go all Don Quixote on us buddy. LOL I have bad news for you, stick shifts will become more and more a thing of the past until they're gone entirely. I would submit it's possible that we will see them go extinct in our lifetime, especially as hybrid and electric vehicles become more prevalent. Coupled with that is the fact that modern ECM's are better drivers than you are. The Sky Redline automatic is faster than the stickshift version thanks to the ECM. So it's not so much about your hatred of all things American as it is about the march of progress Admiral.

[timmm55]

I actually drove a 4 cylinder/5 speed manual Milan. It was a fun little package. Sporty even. I looked for one....and they (Milan/Fusion with manuals) are around.

 

As far as the manual vs automatic argument goes, I like both. I have a 5 speed manual in the Miata and a 5 speed auto in the Mustang GT. The Miata is more "fun" than fast. The auto in the Mustang GT is pretty slick....shifts way faster than I can.

[Admiral]

Well don't go all Don Quixote on us buddy. LOL I have bad news for you, stick shifts will become more and more a thing of the past until they're gone entirely. I would submit it's possible that we will see them go extinct in our lifetime, especially as hybrid and electric vehicles become more prevalent. Coupled with that is the fact that modern ECM's are better drivers than you are. The Sky Redline automatic is faster than the stickshift version thanks to the ECM. So it's not so much about your hatred of all things American as it is about the march of progress Admiral.

 

I know. I'm in denial, just like the Panther Mafia. Sticks are going the way of the four-barrel and the CV. They've been dying slowly in this country for decades. And yes, today's new automatics shift quicker than I ever could, are more efficient, CHEAPER to build and make the cars faster, but they just aint got no soul. It's sad when I go to a media event and the valet parking my car has to call someone else on the radio because he CAN'T drive a stick. It's a tragedy in my book. For me, few things are as satisfying as a perfectly rev-matched five-three down shift right before flawlessly carving an apex. I made the shift. I made it perfect. No computer controlled it, no computer timed it. I did. And for the record, I don't hate anything American, except maybe the Panther cars.

[BlackHorse]

I know. I'm in denial, just like the Panther Mafia. Sticks are going the way of the four-barrel and the CV. They've been dying slowly in this country for decades. And yes, today's new automatics shift quicker than I ever could, are more efficient, CHEAPER to build and make the cars faster, but they just aint got no soul. It's sad when I go to a media event and the valet parking my car has to call someone else on the radio because he CAN'T drive a stick. It's a tragedy in my book. For me, few things are as satisfying as a perfectly rev-matched five-three down shift right before flawlessly carving an apex. I made the shift. I made it perfect. No computer controlled it, no computer timed it. I did. And for the record, I don't hate anything American, except maybe the Panther cars.

 

I know what you mean. Unfortunately in our modern age of glorious technology and political correctness we find ourselves living in some sort of almost sterilized, zombie like transe of a culture. It's a shame. Everything from cars, to TV shows, to music, to people. The whole thing. Lifeless, without soul or merit or any real zest. I spend a lot time wondering how the hell we got this way, and amazed at how detestable it can be. But alas I rant on. I know what you mean about the stick. A reminder of a better time when a man "drove" a car, was a part of the car, understood the car and neither had to make apologies or excuses for one another.

[Admiral]

I know what you mean. Unfortunately in our modern age of glorious technology and political correctness we find ourselves living in some sort of almost sterilized, zombie like transe of a culture. It's a shame. Everything from cars, to TV shows, to music, to people. The whole thing. Lifeless, without soul or merit or any real zest. I spend a lot time wondering how the hell we got this way, and amazed at how detestable it can be. But alas I rant on. I know what you mean about the stick. A reminder of a better time when a man "drove" a car, was a part of the car, understood the car and neither had to make apologies or excuses for one another.

 

Hear Hear.

[NLPRacing]

All 4 cylinder models, which was why the slammed the Ford to 6th. They loved everything about the Fuison. They said the interior was fantastic, great wheels, well handled. But the 2.3 engine they said was underpowered. The Fusion was the slowest car in the group in all respects, 0 to 30, 0 to 60 and 1/4 mile. They also had absolutely nothing nice to say about the transmission.

 

That's basically the impression I got from the article. I don't think Ford realized how important the 4 cylinder model is in this class. The new 2.5/6SP that's coming should do wonders for this car.

 

That's my understanding. I mean it's replacing the CD4E (?), so it's replacing about a 10 year old automatic. I would think that it should be as light/lighter than what it's replacing, even if it's not lighter than the Aisin unit.

 

The 4 cyl Fusion had a 5 speed auto, is the CD4E a 5 speed?

[Edstock]

I know what you mean. Unfortunately in our modern age of glorious technology and political correctness we find ourselves living in some sort of almost sterilized, zombie like transe of a culture. It's a shame. Everything from cars, to TV shows, to music, to people. The whole thing. Lifeless, without soul or merit or any real zest. I spend a lot time wondering how the hell we got this way, and amazed at how detestable it can be. But alas I rant on. I know what you mean about the stick. A reminder of a better time when a man "drove" a car, was a part of the car, understood the car and neither had to make apologies or excuses for one another.

 

Now that sure is middle-age grumpy. You need an attitude adjustment.