Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 (edited) SKY NEWS REPORTS...... He may be close to the driving seat, but Barack Obama has still urged outgoing President Bush to come to the rescue of the country's ailing auto industry before he leaves office. But it was troubles in an auto industry Senator Obama has described as the "backbone of American manufacturing" which he appears to have pressed Mr Bush to act on first during their private meeting. America's motoring giants are looking for up to $25bn (£16bn) in emergency loans that backers say is needed to prevent the industry's collapse. Sales in General Motors Corp, Ford Motor Co and Chrysler LLC are plunging and the companies are haemorrhaging money. SKY NEWS http://news.sky.com/skynews/video Edited November 11, 2008 by Ford Jellymoulds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerM Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Until the WHY they are hemorrhaging money is resolved, nothing will change, even with an extra $50 Billion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Pouring water in a bucket with a big hole in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 Pouring water in a bucket with a big hole in it. Its good to see Rick Wagoner is being so dynamic at fixing GM's $75 million dollar a day leak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I say file for Backruptcy and fuck it, there's no way to repair the issue unless the slate is wiped clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 President-elect Barack Obama has been given 100 days to save the American motor industry from collapse. Industry executives have warned him that up to 3m jobs could be lost unless the Big Three - General Motors, Ford and Chrysler - are bailed out with fresh loans of up to $50bn (£30bn). The US industry is bleeding to death. It is haemorrhaging sales, cash and jobs. With sales at a 25-year low, GM and Chrysler could run out of cash within months. If the Big Three "simply" halved output, 2.5m jobs would be lost and government coffers would lose $100bn over three years, analysts said this week. http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/no...motive-industry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 (edited) Until the WHY they are hemorrhaging money is resolved, nothing will change, even with an extra $50 Billion. Daily Mail reported today. Fears for 2.5m jobs if General Motors goes under GM chief Rick Wagoner gave a grim assessment of the situation, saying: 'We're convinced that the consequences of bankruptcy would be dire and extend far beyond GM.' GM had cash, or assets that can be quickly converted to cash, of just £10.3billion at the end of the quarter. This compares with liquidity of £13.4billion at the end of the second quarter. The car giant needs at least £7billion in cash each quarter just to pay the bills. Stephane Zeisel, credit analyst at Barclays, said this was worrying, adding: 'Unless a solution is found in the very near term, a bankruptcy is definitely on the cards in the first half of 2009.' Professor Garel Rhys, auto industry expert at Cardiff University, said this was the 'worst crisis' the American car industry had ever faced. He added: 'We are in the final phase for GM, and possibly Ford, as independent players. Possibly by 2020, they could be part of another group.' New car purchases have stalled around the world, and it has not only blighted Detroit's manufacturers. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/article-1...goes-under.html Edited November 11, 2008 by Ford Jellymoulds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 If only Ford still sold the Anglia...all their troubles would be far away. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 If only Ford still sold the Anglia...all their troubles would be far away. :rolleyes: LOL Nick,Fiat 500 proppng up Fiat at the moment. From the Daily Mail post on GM above One highlight was the sporty performance of Porsche, which yesterday notched up a 46 per cent hike in annual pretax profits to £7billion. However, most of this was on the back of better-than-expected returns from insuring its 74 per cent stake in Volkswagen against a share price fall, known as hedging. If only Ford had kept the Capri and developed it like Porsche & 20,000,000,000 Escort sales in the good ole days when Ford used to post billions $ profits hey Nick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 If only Ford had kept the Capri and developed it like Porsche & 20,000,000,000 Escort sales in the good ole days when Ford used to post billions $ profits hey Nick? No one can say for sure at all. One thing is for sure though: the market isn't the same as it was 30 years ago, as much as you wish it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Hedging isn't supposed to turn a profit.... Either Porsche is doing it WRONG, or there are major problems with EU GAAP. ---- Hedging is, well, insurance. You should no more turn a profit on a hedge than you would on a house fire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 No one can say for sure at all. One thing is for sure though: the market isn't the same as it was 30 years ago, as much as you wish it was. Corporate boring dull blandom rules OK today when it comes car design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 (edited) Corporate boring dull blandom rules OK today when it comes car design. When it comes to mainstream sedans, boring has always ruled. It's not just a thing of today as you want to think it is. It has always been that way. Most people simply don't want to make a statement with their vehicle. They buy it as an appliance. Edited November 11, 2008 by NickF1011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordowner Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 (edited) bankruptcy could merely shift pension liabities and health care cost from the companies to the government. I'd hate to see both GM and Ford have to declare bankruptcy. They can easily be profitable, they just got caught by the double punch of crazed gas price swings and the free fall of the economy. Did most people expect gas prices to rise to $4 this quickly, (though last night I bought it for 2.05 ???). I think Ford is on the right track. I think when people start buying again and when contractors and homebuilders start building again and needing F150s Ford will be profitable. So providing some liquidity to keep Ford from declaring bankruptcy is a decent investment - the government can set it up in such away so that they get a return. As to GM and Chrysler - ? haven't followed them closely enough to know - though someone mentioned if GM declares bankruptcy it gives them to much of a competitive advantage over Ford? Is that due to the residual value issue on leases? or just cost of doing business. Edited November 11, 2008 by Fordowner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevys Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I dont think anybody will buy a car from a bankrupt company. Just my opinion of course. This crap is bad and it scares me. I dont want to see GM or any American company go down the drain but at the same time Im sick and tired of the govt bailing out everybody when the tax payers will pay the tab. Where does it all end? I just saw on the news this morning that the execs at AGI have been out partying at yet another luxury resort at our expense. Where is the accountability? Steve Forbes just said there was no doubt the auto companies will no doubt get low cost loans but Im not convinced its not prolonging the inevitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one2gamble Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I say file for Backruptcy and fuck it, there's no way to repair the issue unless the slate is wiped clean. The government should come in and take over the pension obligations of the workers, allow bankruptcy and restructuring to take place and then see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLaudioF150 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 $50 billion seems like chump-change considering we spend $10 billion in Iraq per month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpc655 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 The government should come in and take over the pension obligations of the workers, allow bankruptcy and restructuring to take place and then see what happens. The government already has a 53 trillion dollar deficit (including soc. sec., medicare and medicaid liabilties), don't think they can afford it, and i don't think they should risk tax payer's money. At the end of the day, many retiree's will get screwed. Hopefully they saved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Can somebody tell me why the heck didn't the shareholders fire Wagoner and his douches? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 Can somebody tell me why the heck didn't the shareholders fire Wagoner and his douches? Shareholders really don't have the power to do that, especially considering the diluted nature of the power structure of GM's shares. Why GM's Board of Directors has kept him this long though? That's anybody's guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 Can somebody tell me why the heck didn't the shareholders fire Wagoner and his douches? With GM's shares down at $2.75 today it won't be long before a shareholder lynch mob string him up Lincoln. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I dont think anybody will buy a car from a bankrupt company. Just my opinion of course. This crap is bad and it scares me. I dont want to see GM or any American company go down the drain but at the same time Im sick and tired of the govt bailing out everybody when the tax payers will pay the tab. Where does it all end? I just saw on the news this morning that the execs at AGI have been out partying at yet another luxury resort at our expense. Where is the accountability? Steve Forbes just said there was no doubt the auto companies will no doubt get low cost loans but Im not convinced its not prolonging the inevitable. i agree totally..and if the big 3 become a state run company i will never come back (quality will be zero if those workers know they have a job for life..product will be junk)...i will buy foreign most likely datsun as they will get the ram hopefully..if not ill just buy a jap titan and smile everyday knowing how screwed detroit north is.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 i agree totally..and if the big 3 become a state run company i will never come back (quality will be zero if those workers know they have a job for life..product will be junk)...i will buy foreign most likely datsun as they will get the ram hopefully..if not ill just buy a jap titan and smile everyday knowing how screwed detroit north is.... Who the heck has even suggested that any of the American automakers would become "state run"? Seriously, did your medication run out? You've been a bit irrational lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 Who the heck has even suggested that any of the American automakers would become "state run"? Seriously, did your medication run out? You've been a bit irrational lately. What they should do is adopt Japanese work practices if the company fails the CEO should fall on his sword, that would keep the CEO on his toes, yes Rick Wagoner should copy be more like Toyota CEO - Yota Joko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 i agree totally..and if the big 3 become a state run company i will never come back (quality will be zero if those workers know they have a job for life..product will be junk)...i will buy foreign most likely datsun as they will get the ram hopefully..if not ill just buy a jap titan and smile everyday knowing how screwed detroit north is.... the anger runs deep and long with this one... back to "Datsun" days... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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