Ford says "No thank you"; U.S. govt. may take stake in auto industry

[battyr]

 

US DEBT CLOCK

 

You must buy a lot of Arab oil, Yota's, best quality Chinese plastic goods from Walmart & rubber dog shit then.

 

Almost half of this debt is money that the government has lent to itself to fund future Social Security. This should be paid for with taxes, not future debt.

You want to look at the net debt. The debt held by the public is $6.4 trillion.

 

The bad thing is that it has grown by almost 24% this year alone. Expect it to be $10.66 tillion by the time Obama finishes his first term.

Interest rates are cheap now but the doubling of the public debt, the end of the carry trade and the need to devalue the currency to creat jobs will result in inflation and higher interest rates. The interest per year could be $ 1 trillion per year or much more. That is $3,333 per person, per year in interest alone at 10%. A Familly of 4 would have to make $ 13, 300 a year just to pay the interest on the national debt. Scary.

 

5 Years of pain to get over this crisis.

 

10 Years of more pain to control the National debt.

 

Ooops. Some of the gross debt is for buying bad debt from the banks. Add a $1 trillion to the public debt.

Edited December 10, 2008 by battyr

[battyr]

Too bad that GM is forced to sell their assets in China. GM China would be worth more than GM USA.

[old_fairmont_wagon]

Woah, nice cheap shot there, too bad that it doesn't have as much basis in reality as you imagine.

 

Couple of "facts" for ya, from some recent surveys I've seen on the matter.

 

Democrats tend to skew more to the poor and working poor.

 

The poor and working poor are the ones that are forced to shop at mass discounters like Family Dollar and Walmart, the largest purveyors of "made in china" or "made in (insert poor thrid world country here)", because that's all they can afford to do.

 

Those socialism hating republicans that have the wherewithall to make a choice commonly do when there is a choice that can be made. MAnufacturing has fallen to such low levels in this country that many things simply aren't made or grown here at all or in sufficient numbers to make mass market. When my family goes out to shop, we (a) try to avoid walmart when possible (B) try to choose products that are made in the USA (and, to a lesser degree canada and other close allies) and © try to buy only domestically grown foods. This doesn't mean that we always do so. Sometimes, money is tight and you buy what you have to to make it till the next payday. But, when you can make the choice, you do.

 

As for the vehicles in my sig, be aware that before we purchased the Sienna, we looked at and tried to purchase a Grand Caravan. The financing fell through due to the expected initial depriciation of the Grand Caravan. Ford didn't make a minivan or anything with that capacity in our price range. Neither did GM. We then went to Toyota and, low and behold, for the same transaction price, the financing actually worked, with even more favorable terms, for that vehicle. And, as a welcome bonus, the Sienns was even assembled in the USA. So, at least a few american workers benifited from our purchase.

 

 

So, say what you want about "republicans" supporting cheap labor in foreign countries, but, those of us that know what's going on act differently. Even if it means supporting a strongly democratic leaning union, we do it for the good of the country.

 

"So we have become China"

 

Yes, thanks to all the cosumers buying made in China products.

 

Funny, Republicans hate socialism, yet have no problem at all with sending $$ to those countries for cheap labor, products, and 'junk'.

[mnm]

if there wasnt any internal guilt about buying a toyota, why did you feel the need to defend yourself for buying one? there are hundreds of models of vehicles to choose from and the sienna was the ONLY one for you to choose? ok

[RangerM]

:lol: Maverick can fly it out of Hong Kong!

 

Nice one, Iceman.

 

That movie was playing when I was a theater usher in my teenage years. I caught two (very) young girls making out during that movie. One of many "incidents" during my tenure there.

Edited December 10, 2008 by RangerM

[Extreme4x4]

We always try to buy USA made........................ and even get excited when something says "Made in Mexico."

 

You know that you are getting desperate, when "Made in Indonesia," or "Made in Honduras," actually makes you feel good.

 

I would easily pay more for "Made in USA."

 

As an example, we had to buy new nail clippers. Since I live in a small town, shopping establishments are few, with the primary one being Walmart (do not buy groceries there, only stuff I cannot get elsewhere in town). I looked at every nail clipper they had, and they were all "Made in China." The price, on average, was $1.97. I would have happily paid $10.00+ for USA made. Not only would I feel better about my purchase, but chances are real good that it would actually last longer than 6 months to 1yr before needing to be replaced.

 

On a side note, if you have younger kids, Little Tykes is made in the US. You have no idea how long and hard you have to look, to find toys made here.

[silvrsvt]

That movie was playing when I was a theater usher in my teenage years. I caught two (very) young girls making out during that movie. One of many "incidents" during my tenure there.

 

Kinky, getting started at young age I see

[fordmantpw]

On a side note, if you have younger kids, Little Tykes is made in the US. You have no idea how long and hard you have to look, to find toys made here.

 

And Little Tykes toys last forever...even with my son punishing them daily!

[NickF1011]

I would easily pay more for "Made in USA."

 

Most Americans would pay more for "Made in USA", but only if it is "QUALITY Made in USA".

[Extreme4x4]

I cannot think of one thing that I have bought, made in China, that lasted anywhere near as long as the older, made in USA version.

 

Take the nail clippers, for example. The old one, which was made in USA, worked fine after 5-7 years. We had to replace it because small son lost it. The made in China ones usually get so loose and dull, after 6 months to 1 year, that you keep replacing them................. and throwing out the old ones.

[LSFan00]

Most Americans would pay more for "Made in USA", but only if it is "QUALITY Made in USA".

 

I would pay more for "Non UAW Made in USA" but I don't suppose that fits the bill. Of course the Sienna above would count, and when I had one it did, and my Aunt worked at the plant too!

[V8 Ford]

I would pay more for "Non UAW Made in USA" but I don't suppose that fits the bill. Of course the Sienna above would count, and when I had one it did, and my Aunt worked at the plant too!

Doesn't paying more for something non-UAW defeat the purpose of it being non-union?

[Dale143]

This is not good. I can see the new leadership team of Ralph Nader and Joan Claybrook. I can't wait to see what Federal Government leadership will do to this industry. It's going to be ugly!

 

probably the same as they did to Fannie may and Freddie mac.

[one2gamble]

Walmart (do not buy groceries there,

 

 

Sort of curious about why you dont other than its the same stuff you can get at a locally owned place.

[Pioneer]

Of course the Sienna above would count, and when I had one it did, and my Aunt worked at the plant too!

 

 

Now all of your non-UAW posts make sense. :shades:

[FordBuyer]

I cannot think of one thing that I have bought, made in China, that lasted anywhere near as long as the older, made in USA version.

 

Take the nail clippers, for example. The old one, which was made in USA, worked fine after 5-7 years. We had to replace it because small son lost it. The made in China ones usually get so loose and dull, after 6 months to 1 year, that you keep replacing them................. and throwing out the old ones.

 

Yep, I bought some pruning shears about 7 years ago and had choice between cheap Overseas jobs and expensive ones made in Amercia. I bought the American ones and use them all the time and they cut as well as they did new. If I had bought the cheap foreign ones, I would be on my fourth pair by now as I really use them. Ditto with water nozzle...I spent the extra bucks and got a good American one that was expensive, and it will last my lifetime instead of having to buy some cheap foreign plastic one every summer season.

[Critic]

Add to that, shovels and other garden lawn eq.

 

Perhaps people would like to know, Dec. 1 Tecumseh moved production operations to CHINA. Daily moves.... Vice Grip..... everything is getting out now, while their is a chance.

 

Last one out, please turn off the lights.

[Extreme4x4]

Sort of curious about why you dont other than its the same stuff you can get at a locally owned place.

 

There are no "Payson only" grocery stores. However, we do have Bashas, which is an Arizona chain. I do most of my grocery shopping there.

 

I have found that Bashas has far better produce, and they will buy much of that from AZ farms. They also have much better meat. Walmarts produce and meat is so-so. Bashas sale prices are better than Walmarts regular prices............. and of late, I have found that some of the regular prices are better also. Walmart seems to pick certain blocks of products to have very low prices. On some items, they don't seem to care, and the prices have really gone up.

 

Since I am a stay-at-home Mom now, I have the time to be more careful about my shopping, paying attention to sales, and stocking up when there is a good buy. By doing this, I now buy less and less from Walmart. Since Sam Walton died, Walmart is not the same company they once were. Under Sam, they bragged about "made in USA" and treated their employees great. Once he died, things got worse................. but they have really started dumpster diving since Sams wife died. The greed just got way out of control............... and much of their merchandise is "made in China." Sam Walton is probably rolling over in his grave.

 

BTW, we have a Walmart, and a Home Depot as our major employers here (other than the county). Walmart is referred to as HELL.................. and Home Depot is Hell Lite.

[F250]

I would pay more for "Non UAW Made in USA" but I don't suppose that fits the bill. Of course the Sienna above would count, and when I had one it did, and my Aunt worked at the plant too!

 

Toyota Sienna!

The current generation Sienna holds Toyota's all-time record for recalls.

 

The Sienna's latest "warranty extension" is because the front doors are so thin the door check breaks out of the metal requiring the replacement of the entire door. good luck with that color match at warranty rates.

After the first 6 safety recalls Toyota thought they were out of the woods on that crapwagon but at least the latest is just to replace the rear hatch supports so it doesn't slam down on your head.

I'll spare the entire list of recalls and "warranty extensions" (aka law suit dodges)

 

Speaking of Toyota problems what's up with all of these 3.5L V6 oil tube failures downing the vehicle for weeks because of parts backorders.

Edited December 11, 2008 by F250

[RangerM]

Toyota Sienna!

The current generation Sienna holds Toyota's all-time record for recalls.

 

I rented a Sienna about two months ago. Gotta say it was superior to the Caravan I'd rented on a previous trip.

 

IMO, neither of them drove as well as an Aerostar I rented many years ago, but maybe it's because the Aerostar drove as I expected a van to drive. Both the Sienna/Caravan were trying so hard to ride smoothly, they felt like (Buick-style) floatmobiles.

[LSFan00]

Toyota Sienna!

The current generation Sienna holds Toyota's all-time record for recalls.

 

The Sienna's latest "warranty extension" is because the front doors are so thin the door check breaks out of the metal requiring the replacement of the entire door. good luck with that color match at warranty rates.

After the first 6 safety recalls Toyota thought they were out of the woods on that crapwagon but at least the latest is just to replace the rear hatch supports so it doesn't slam down on your head.

I'll spare the entire list of recalls and "warranty extensions" (aka law suit dodges)

 

Speaking of Toyota problems what's up with all of these 3.5L V6 oil tube failures downing the vehicle for weeks because of parts backorders.

 

A lot of hostility here. It was the wife's car and she insisted on selling/trading up to an SUV once the youngest got to a bigger car seat (after about 2.5 years.) It only depreciated about $6K with what Carmax gave us and I think Toy. did do one recall mod on it during an oil change but give it a rest already. I think it was a 2003 or 2004. You and Pioneer et al. who feel that this minivan represented some sort of paradox/paradigm as to my thoughts on the UAW, Ford, or cars/America in general are comical.

 

I'll badmouth the replacement ML all day long, but you pick your battles in a marriage...it's only saving grace has been the "warranties direct" ext. serv. contract.