jm2607 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Link http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/artic...0353/1001/rss21 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
010300 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 So we might not loose the gen pool after all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Let`s see what the facts are first.Sacrifice should be across the board,meaning salaried and retiree`s as well.If the concessions are reasonable,I understand the economic situation is fragile.Then let`s make some great product and get back to kickin ass.Marketing and vehicle sales.Those are the two most important things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFA Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Retirees should not be touched. They did their job and retired with what they have. No reason to touch them. That would truly be unfair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvsked Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Retirees should not be touched. They did their job and retired with what they have. No reason to touch them. That would truly be unfair. Retirees are HALO ground we all hope to get there one day. Retirees shouldn't enter discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadzee Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 I agree with leaving the retirees alone. Let former senator such and such take a cut from their 75% or better friggin pension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) Retirees should not be touched. They did their job and retired with what they have. No reason to touch them. That would truly be unfair. Legacy costs are the main problem.Why should someone earning $14 an hour be required to support a retireed person who`s pension is more than $14 an hour?We ALL do our job!We should ALL sacrifice. Edited January 13, 2009 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckman Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Legacy costs are the main problem.Why should someone earning $14 an hour be required to support a retireed person who`s pension is more than $14 an hour?We ALL do our job!We should ALL sacrifice. Screw you Fatso! Those retirees paid for the retirees ahead of them too! Leave the retirees alone, along with future retirees! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordguy61mi Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Hey Fatso that sounds great now but it won't sound so great when you retire and are having trouble making ends meet with your pension and trying to cough up major co-payments for medical expenses should it go that way. We need to protect our future. The low tier people should know what they're supporting when they come in and decide whether they want to work here or not. No one gets forced to work here. Hell, they're knocking down the doors trying to get these $14 jobs. The days of jobs like the ones we have are gone so lets try to protect what we have while we can! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) Hey Fatso that sounds great now but it won't sound so great when you retire and are having trouble making ends meet with your pension and trying to cough up major co-payments for medical expenses should it go that way. We need to protect our future. The low tier people should know what they're supporting when they come in and decide whether they want to work here or not. No one gets forced to work here. Hell, they're knocking down the doors trying to get these $14 jobs. The days of jobs like the ones we have are gone so lets try to protect what we have while we can! When I what?If I was retireed I would give back $25 a week.So hire someone at 'cooley wages' with the clear understanding that they will always be 'second class'and make them pay?Anyways,I will tell you this,,,,LEGACY COSTS ARE THE MAIN PROBLEM and one day all those $14 an hour people will be the ones who are RUNNING THE PLANTS and have all the leverage. Edited January 13, 2009 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigcountry Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Legacy costs are the main problem.Why should someone earning $14 an hour be required to support a retireed person who`s pension is more than $14 an hour?We ALL do our job!We should ALL sacrifice. You worry me sometimes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 You worry me sometimes! and? Oh don`t bother.Here look at these :happy feet: , , , , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) The reason Ford`s average wage per hour is so much greater than the transplants is because of Legacy Costs.That problem is not going to be solved easily.All I am suggesting is that we share any concession`s given back across the board.One last bit of advice,,,,,do NOT rely solely on Ford Motor pension benefits.Take responsibility for your own financial security.Contribute to TESPHE and invest and save and live within your means.You don`t want to touch the current retiree`s and SER people,,,,okay.Then would you be willing to give up 30 and out? Edited January 13, 2009 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCM Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 When I what?If I was retireed I would give back $25 a week.So hire someone at 'cooley wages' with the clear understanding that they will always be 'second class'and make them pay?Anyways,I will tell you this,,,,LEGACY COSTS ARE THE MAIN PROBLEM and one day all those $14 an hour people will be the ones who are RUNNING THE PLANTS and have all the leverage. Everyone knows that legacy costs are an issue. But lets not forget the reason you have all the benefits and wages you have are from those same retirees!! Legacy costs are only an issue because Toyota and the other foreign companies have no legacy costs, so you are comparing apples and oranges! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) Everyone knows that legacy costs are an issue. But lets not forget the reason you have all the benefits and wages you have are from those same retirees!! Legacy costs are only an issue because Toyota and the other foreign companies have no legacy costs, so you are comparing apples and oranges! Thank you for acknowledging that 'Legacy Costs' are a current problem to the financial results of Ford Motor Company.Now take emotion out of the equation and tell me,,,,what is the solution? Edited January 13, 2009 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feegsit Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Reducing legacy costs, isn't that what VEBAs all about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 (edited) I think VEBA has to do with providing health care to retiree`s and it is considered a help to the Company.Look I do not like concession`s either.If concession`s are necessary then realistically,everyone who is involved should contribute something.That is all I am saying.We need some more sales.Which reminds me of my neighbor who is a UAW/Ford retiree who brags about his Honda Odyssey.Oh that`s right,,,leave emotion out of it,,,sorry. Edited January 13, 2009 by Fatso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefstang Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Screw you Fatso! Those retirees paid for the retirees ahead of them too! Leave the retirees alone, along with future retirees! So no retirees should make sacrifices, and neither should future retirees? Who does that leave? Are you saying that no one should make sacrifices, or just that sacrifices are OK, as long as it doesn't effect you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makeastand Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 The retirees already paid their dues, just like we are paying ours now. If we make $30 an hour and our benefits cost another $10 an hour, where do you think our pension money comes from? The retires already paid for their pensions while they were working. If the company is complaining about legacy cost, shouldn't we be complaining about where the money went and not talking about which one of us should pay for it? Or what about the fact that congrress says "hey you can only put x amount of dollars into your companies pension fund", shouldn't we be confronting that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 So no retirees should make sacrifices, and neither should future retirees? Who does that leave? Are you saying that no one should make sacrifices, or just that sacrifices are OK, as long as it doesn't effect you? Yeah I know,,,and then they wonder why the UAW workers get a bad rap.Screw me anyways! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatso Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 The retirees already paid their dues, just like we are paying ours now. If we make $30 an hour and our benefits cost another $10 an hour, where do you think our pension money comes from? The retires already paid for their pensions while they were working. If the company is complaining about legacy cost, shouldn't we be complaining about where the money went and not talking about which one of us should pay for it? Or what about the fact that congrress says "hey you can only put x amount of dollars into your companies pension fund", shouldn't we be confronting that? I think the way it works is that current workers are paying for current retirees.That is why our cost per hour are inflated up to $73.You don`t want to disturb the retirees leisure time or disposable income,fine.Then what?Surrender 30 and out?If concessions are necessary then everyone should share in the burden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forddaughter Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Leave the retirees alone! Those of you who say cut their benefits and pay are really STUPID! If the benefits and pay are cut, then guess what? They WON"T be retiring which means no job openings for the younger generation! DUH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckman Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Leave the retirees alone! Those of you who say cut their benefits and pay are really STUPID! If the benefits and pay are cut, then guess what? They WON"T be retiring which means no job openings for the younger generation! DUH! Definitely screw fatso! those retirees struck for your sorry ass! You wouldnt be making the wages you do today! You should be called FUCKSO not FATSO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCM Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 I think VEBA has to do with providing health care to retiree`s and it is considered a help to the Company.Look I do not like concession`s either.If concession`s are necessary then realistically,everyone who is involved should contribute something.That is all I am saying.We need some more sales.Which reminds me of my neighbor who is a UAW/Ford retiree who brags about his Honda Odyssey.Oh that`s right,,,leave emotion out of it,,,sorry. Hey if I had the solution I would be the million dollar man.! You should have a word or two with the retiree with the Honda. That is fuckin bullshit!!! Give him this>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereswaldo Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 So we might not loose the gen pool after all? You are dreaming......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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