Versa-Tech Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 IMHO, it's a nice progression from the original Zephyr. It doesn't look Asian, and in today's economic climate, it doesn't make the statement of "I make too much money". Dean, IMO, you'd be a lot happier with a 370 hp Z with the biggest tires and brakes they can fit. Since when does Nissan make a 370hp Z? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Since when does Nissan make a 370hp Z? don't like Nissans current design direction either...the boomerang lights are just plain awkward....admire the "risk" but they plain just dont work........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 The more ballsy move, in my opinion, would be to just flat out admit that old people like your cars and cater to them. Not every brand needs to try to be "hip" and appeal to the latest generation of hip-hop lovin' iPod-ownin' fools. OH for shame. like the Concept C they prominently display on the Lincoln web site? OH, the horror.. Dump it.. it won't sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Since when does Nissan make a 370hp Z? Sorry, I meant MK Z, with a 3.7 EB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Sorry, I meant MK Z, with a 3.7 EB. my background mandates I like the styling first...initially that is what attracts me to a car...THEN the undrpinnings.....but a car can have an AWESOME drivetrain and look like crap and i'll turn the other cheek or in certain cases amuse me with its quirkyness and lack of styling simpleness....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbuck15 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 When the '10 MKZ starts at $34.5K; Doesn't it make more sense to spend the extra $5K and get an MKS? When the older Zephyr (MKZ) debuted in 2006 it started under 30K. It undercut the Lexus ES & Acura TL by at least $4K. What has Ford added to justify the $4K price increase? 1- Sync -- $400 option at most other Fords. 2- Cooled Seats??-- It is standard on '09 MKZ. Anyhow it was $495 option which included heated washer fluid. 3- Bigger engine-- Compared to the 3.0L in 2006; then yes. But the 2007 MKZ had it and it started just over $30K. I think the new '10 MKZ is $9-10K more than an equivalent '10 Ford Fusion V6 Sport which starts at $24K with Sync & leather seats. That in my mind is way too expensive. What if someone was on a budget,$5,000 is a big difference to a lot of people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkoko Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 What if someone was on a budget,$5,000 is a big difference to a lot of people. Yes when you are comparing 20K to 25K cars; but not 35K-43K cars. So a MKZ with sunroof and other basic amenities (like THX) will run 38K while an equivalent MKS will run 42K. At that price point, the difference is not much. I still think it will need heavy rebates/incentives($2000+) to sell at that price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 my background mandates I like the styling first...initially that is what attracts me to a car...THEN the undrpinnings.....but a car can have an AWESOME drivetrain and look like crap and i'll turn the other cheek or in certain cases amuse me with its quirkyness and lack of styling simpleness....... You talkin' 'bout Camaro? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 (edited) You think the new '10 interior is better than your G35?? I still think the best interior in this class is the CTS. I would call the new interior different from the outgoing model. Is it significantly more modern? Yes. More Luxurious? NO, It feels like any other mid size car interior. It doesn't have the feel of luxury car interior. IMHO, It doesn't look expensive. Have you sat in a G35 as of late? I love the car, but the interior is at best mid-pack in its class. Some of the comfort features in the MKZ aren't even available (would be nice to have cooled seats in SoCal), the leather is nothing to write home about, and honestly the interior doesn't look expensive either (then again neither does the interior of the new A4 nor does the C Class outside of special editions). I'm not a fan of the CTS interior either, namely the center stack. The gold standard is still the outgoing A4 (B6 I believe). Edited March 24, 2009 by Michael Reynolds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 Have you sat in a G35 as of late? I love the car, but the interior is at best mid-pack in its class. Some of the comfort features in the MKZ aren't even available (would be nice to have cooled seats in SoCal), the leather is nothing to write home about, and honestly the interior doesn't look expensive either (then again neither does the interior of the new A4 nor does the C Class outside of special editions). I'm not a fan of the CTS interior either, namely the center stack. The gold standard is still the outgoing A4 (B6 I believe). i thought the g35 interior was tops, but that was about 4 years ago so i dont really know. you like the new mkz better then the new g35/37? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 i thought the g35 interior was tops, but that was about 4 years ago so i dont really know. you like the new mkz better then the new g35/37? Not really..... What the G35/37 lacks in overall refinement, it more than makes up for it in terms of performance. The car that best strikes a balance in this class is the 335i, decent interior, a reasonable amount of feature content.....just overpriced. And to answer your question, if I had to go buy a new car today in that price class it would be: 1. G37 Sport 2. 335i Sedan 3. CTS DI 3.6/MKZ AWD 4. C350 Sport 5. A4 2.0T 6. Saab 9-3 7. IS350 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 When the '10 MKZ starts at $34.5K; Doesn't it make more sense to spend the extra $5K and get an MKS? When the older Zephyr (MKZ) debuted in 2006 it started under 30K. It undercut the Lexus ES & Acura TL by at least $4K. What has Ford added to justify the $4K price increase? 1- Sync -- $400 option at most other Fords. 2- Cooled Seats??-- It is standard on '09 MKZ. Anyhow it was $495 option which included heated washer fluid. 3- Bigger engine-- Compared to the 3.0L in 2006; then yes. But the 2007 MKZ had it and it started just over $30K. I think the new '10 MKZ is $9-10K more than an equivalent '10 Ford Fusion V6 Sport which starts at $24K with Sync & leather seats. That in my mind is way too expensive. 2009 MKZ: $32.7k 2010 MKZ: $34.1k < 5% increase in price year over year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 When the '10 MKZ starts at $34.5K; Doesn't it make more sense to spend the extra $5K and get an MKS? Actually when I first read this I thought what? NO it doesn't make more sence. Their are a garden variety of reasons why not also. So lets run down a few for the folks playing at home: Size.. Yes size does matter, they built one smaller there so I could get bigger here. Money... $5K still means a lot to a few people I know. and my banker wishes I had a little more to lend him. Looks.... I'd rather take a slim woman out to dinner than someone wide in the hips and who's taller than me. Plates..... Some state tax you based on the MSRP. Every CPA will tell you to cut your tax liability this year vs. next year. Fuel...... Bigger appetite equals more strain on the old bed springs. So Johnny, tell them what he's won.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retro-man Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I was thinking the same thing: a $180 price advantage on the Lexus isn't going to pull over any converts, or stop cross-shopping from the undecided. Open it up to a couple thousand, and you might be able to make some inroads. Car itself looks nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 (edited) I was thinking the same thing: a $180 price advantage on the Lexus isn't going to pull over any converts, or stop cross-shopping from the undecided. Open it up to a couple thousand, and you might be able to make some inroads. Car itself looks nice. The flip side is that it might not be drawing cross-consideration with Lexus. Lincoln is asserted to be a brand for people who want to buy American. If Ford's research shows that the MKZ is most often cross-shopped with the CTS, well, they're still offering about a $2500 discount to the CTS I mean that's the thing about Cadillac & Lincoln. You can criticize Lincoln for being too conservative but at the same time, if Lincoln's buyers are demographically almost identical to Cadillac's, and Cadillac has thrown billions of dollars into building cars intended to skew their demographic younger, who's made the wiser choice? Edited March 24, 2009 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I was thinking the same thing: a $180 price advantage on the Lexus isn't going to pull over any converts, or stop cross-shopping from the undecided. Open it up to a couple thousand, and you might be able to make some inroads. Car itself looks nice. Is that price advantage b4 or after you've compared equipment levels on both vehicles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Is that price advantage b4 or after you've compared equipment levels on both vehicles? And quality of materials... I suspect you get better leather in the Lincoln. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I suspect you get better leather in the Lincoln. That sounds like a bridge to no weir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 That sounds like a bridge to no weir That would be the Platte Winner bridge. BTW: You might--if you listen closely--be able to hear 2005Explorer laugh when he reads that, and I doubt anyone else will get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 And quality of materials... I suspect you get better leather in the Lincoln. you also get a more cohesive design in the mkz. the ES comes with cloth standard vs the mkz which has heated and cooled leather standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 the mkz which has heated and cooled leather standard. HAS a discussion ever come up as to how they cool those seats? no one ever thought about that? I don't think I ever read anything about it, but I have an idea.. I mean, it's not like there is a puddle of condensation under the seats, that I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 HAS a discussion ever come up as to how they cool those seats? no one ever thought about that? I don't think I ever read anything about it, but I have an idea.. I mean, it's not like there is a puddle of condensation under the seats, that I've seen. route the a/c to the seats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 route the a/c to the seats? No their self contained units... plug and play so to speak. Or drop in, bolt down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 No their self contained units... plug and play so to speak. Or drop in, bolt down. hmm, i had no idea. you're right i have never had this conversation before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 When the '10 MKZ starts at $34.5K; Doesn't it make more sense to spend the extra $5K and get an MKS? Not if you don't want that large a vehicle... I think the new '10 MKZ is $9-10K more than an equivalent '10 Ford Fusion V6 Sport which starts at $24K with Sync & leather seats. That in my mind is way too expensive. I had the opportunity to drive an MKZ and I currently own a Fusion...similar dimensions, but the overall feel was like night and day...I cannot swing an MKZ just yet, and I am about 2 years out from a trade in point....guess I will be putting Mercury on my list. I really enjoy my Fusion, but I am getting to the point of desiring something "more". Mercury and Lincoln give me that in Milan and MKZ...the more upscale content is only part of it, then there is the "I see Fusions everywhere..." aspect.....with lower sales than the "bread and butter" of the Ford line up, I can have a car that is rock solid reliable yet, not see myself coming and going every time I drive down the road. The upscale accouterments that Milan has is the ice cream to my piece of cake.... In an MKZ?? Who wants whipped cream and a cherry with your ice cream? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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