Experts say GM bankruptcy almost certain

[silvrsvt]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090510/ap_on_...HBlcnRzc2F5Z20-

[TomServo92]

I'm not sure there was ever any real doubt....

[PREMiERdrum]

It doesn't take an expert.

 

I'd like to drive to Detroit for an experiment, though. It would go like this:

 

Stand outside Ren Center: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

Walk inside Ren Center: Suddenly, GM's in great shape

Walk back outside: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

[TomServo92]

It doesn't take an expert.

 

I'd like to drive to Detroit for an experiment, though. It would go like this:

 

Stand outside Ren Center: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

Walk inside Ren Center: Suddenly, GM's in great shape

Walk back outside: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

 

I have no doubt there's a completely different reality inside Ren Center than the rest of the world.

[Pioneer]

It doesn't take an expert.

 

I'd like to drive to Detroit for an experiment, though. It would go like this:

 

Stand outside Ren Center: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

Walk inside Ren Center: Suddenly, GM's in great shape

Walk back outside: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

 

Stay inside. You'll get mugged if you don't.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

GM's bland boring cars = Bankruptcy they have bored their buyers to death.

 

Gotta say how will they ever get out of Chapter 11 because they will still be stuck with the same boring bland dull line-up of cars that put them there in the first place.

 

Hope the US governments got a deep pocket coz they are going to need it with GM they might never emerge from bankruptcy

[TomServo92]

Stay inside. You'll get mugged if you don't.

 

[PREMiERdrum]

Stay inside. You'll get mugged if you don't.

 

Good advice!

[Mark B. Morrow]

It doesn't take an expert.

 

I'd like to drive to Detroit for an experiment, though. It would go like this:

 

Stand outside Ren Center: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

Walk inside Ren Center: Suddenly, GM's in great shape

Walk back outside: See GM's bankruptcy as inevitable

 

 

Maybe the Ren Cen's glass is mirrored on both sides. Those on the inside can't see the outside world.

[PREMiERdrum]

Maybe the Ren Cen's glass is mirrored on both sides. Those on the inside can't see the outside world.

 

Sounds like some bizarre social experiment.

[F250]

I've been in the car business since 1981 and I never thought I'd see GM bankrupt.

 

We are talking about a company that lead world wide auto sales for 77 consecutive years.

GM still sells more vehicles in America than any other company.

 

I mean when AMC went down it was understandable, they struggled for years as the #4 American car company.

 

But this is General Motors.

 

Sad times...

[RichardJensen]

We are talking about a company that lead world wide auto sales for 77 consecutive years.

GM still sells more vehicles in America than any other company.

But you know, you get the feeling that this is how GM has viewed itself for years... A sort of 'this is who we are' that is related to sales figures, not product itself.

[630land]

1981 was nearly 3 decades ago, and alot has happened since. So many talk as if the 1980s were 'just a few years ago', but they are not.

[jpd80]

But you know, you get the feeling that this is how GM has viewed itself for years... A sort of 'this is who we are' that is related to sales figures, not product itself.

All of GM's debts will be wiped away in stock releases and negative splits so what have they really learned?

 

All the downsizing and restructuring in the world is not really changing the root cause of GM's problems,

without a change in company philosophy GM are prone to repeating the mistakes over and over.

[NickF1011]

GM's bland boring cars = Bankruptcy they have bored their buyers to death.

 

Gotta say how will they ever get out of Chapter 11 because they will still be stuck with the same boring bland dull line-up of cars that put them there in the first place.

 

Hope the US governments got a deep pocket coz they are going to need it with GM they might never emerge from bankruptcy

 

Bland and boring isn't their problem. Toyota has done just fine with bland and boring. It's when you combine bland and boring with nothing else of substance that you run into trouble. Toyota at least has a reputation for quality that get people to overlook bland and boring. What does GM have to entice those buyers except bargain basement discount pricing? And that does nothing for your bottom line.

[stephenhawkings]

Stay inside. You'll get mugged if you don't.

I think you would have to venture a bit further to the less than commercially viable and less policed areas.

[Pioneer]

I think you would have to venture a bit further to the less than commercially viable and less policed areas.

 

 

You ever been to Detroit? It's a crapshoot wherever you go. Sometimes going to a wings game is scary, and the Joe is in the same neighborhood as the Ren Cen.

[97svtgoin05gt]

GM needs a three prong approach:

 

1) Stop making everything so boring and bland.

2) Find a way to screw stuff together better, people still believe that GM stands or radio knobs falling off and door handles breaking after 3 years

3) Get out from under the unbelievable pressure of union contracts and pensions. The world just doesn't support that kind of cost any longer.

[Pioneer]

3) Get out from under the unbelievable pressure of union contracts and pensions. The world just doesn't support that kind of cost any longer.

 

Unbelievable pressure of Union contracts?

 

You do realise that with the latest concessions that Union workers make the same amount as transplant workers, right?

 

Or that the average percentage of labor in a new cars price is about 6%, right?

 

Either you are a biased union hater, or you just don't have all the facts.

[mettech]

During last weeks "Autoline After Hours" John McElroy noted that the D3 still have a $2500 average disadvantage compared to the transplants and imports.

 

He was involved in a automobile industry study recently in regards to the current UAW concessions, but I am unable to find it right now.

[hoss96racing]

GM's bland boring cars = Bankruptcy they have bored their buyers to death.

 

 

hey I have a couple GM products and they don't bore me.. there is always somthing that I am busy fixing.... :unsure:

[Pioneer]

During last weeks "Autoline After Hours" John McElroy noted that the D3 still have a $2500 average disadvantage compared to the transplants and imports.

 

Didn't he play quarterback for the Denver Broncos?

[97svtgoin05gt]

I don't hate the unions, I just feel their time has come and gone. Economics just won't support their requirements any longer just like economics won't support a lot of things any longer.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

Bland and boring isn't their problem. Toyota has done just fine with bland and boring. It's when you combine bland and boring with nothing else of substance that you run into trouble. Toyota at least has a reputation for quality that get people to overlook bland and boring. What does GM have to entice those buyers except bargain basement discount pricing? And that does nothing for your bottom line.

 

Gotta agree with 100% Nick

 

GM don't have a lot going for them, and it's very sad to see what is happening to them. Gotta say l don't think their cars are that bad in Europe, it's not as if you see a pile of Vauxhalls broken down by the side of the roads these days they are not that bad.

 

If l owned a boring bland 3 year old Vauxhall there would be absolutely no reason l would want to trade it in for something new, why because a new Vauxhall offers nothing new or fresh just the same sort of car boring bland car you already got. If they made their cars just a little bit more interesting folk might turn a blind eye to fact they not as reliable or as well put together in JD power surveys, l have always fixed any snags or defects myself, so thats why if given the choice of a ultra reliable Toyota, a typical boring dull bland with nothing going for it GM Vauxhall with a big discount that they are selling at the moment or a more expensive GM Vauxhall with bags of mojo and a bit of classic styling with no discount l would pick the latter everytime.

[Ford Jellymoulds]

GM needs a three prong approach:

 

1) Stop making everything so boring and bland.

2) Find a way to screw stuff together better, people still believe that GM stands or radio knobs falling off and door handles breaking after 3 years

3) Get out from under the unbelievable pressure of union contracts and pensions. The world just doesn't support that kind of cost any longer.

 

Gotta say l hope GM can sort their problems out fast because this is sad to watch unfold, but they are still stuck with the same boring bland cars that you can't change over night, but GM are still selling very well in China (GM feels like a Toyota to most Chinese, compared to the SAIC and Dongfeng junk they produce) GM's Classic Silverado has always been a big winner for them so they should pull through but they will be a lot smaller company they will survive.

 

1, 2 & 3 sound very much like a the three factors that killed of British Leyland in their when their market share in the UK dropped from 50% in the late 60's to next to nothing in just over a decade latter. Ford plants in the UK used to be out on strike just as much as BL pants were but they raped BL's of its market share with some very good cars at the time.

 

Don't go telling the truth you will upset a lot of folk.

 

Gotta say l am glad the Mullaly & the unions sorted a lot of the problems out without to much trouble at Ford their has been a lotta pain involved along the road. Ford's position now is looking a lot brighter with new exciting product like the Fiesta, big improvements in quality & getting its cost under control. Lets hope of more of Ford's cars sold in the US are brought back to Detroit and built in house as a reward for unions helping to sort out these problems.

Edited May 11, 2009 by Ford Jellymoulds