jpd80 Posted December 18, 2010 Share Posted December 18, 2010 (edited) From what we've been told, the 6.2L can be enlarged to 7.0L. If true, that should be a good replacement for the 6.8L V10 down the road. I have a motorhome with the 2V V10 and 4 speed auto and it has really good power considering it's pushing an 8' wide, 12' tall, 35' long box down the road at 65 MPH while flat towing an Expedition EL. A 7.0L with similar torque, more horsepower and a 6 speed auto would be really nice too. The 6.2 is the 6.8 V10's replacement, it produces nearly as much torque and a lot more horsepower.. If you want a better towing engine, the SD 6.7 V8 diesel is hard to go past... Edited December 18, 2010 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-150 Posted December 19, 2010 Share Posted December 19, 2010 So long as the V10 is still there (regardless of fuel), it's not so bad. If they drop the V10 and only offer the 6.2 as the big engine, that's when they'll be in trouble. The 6.8 has a significantly stronger low end than the 6.2 both on paper and in the real world. For a pickup truck, it's not very noticable. But the bus/motor home conversions make a motor with a weaker low end very noticable. Now of course, buyers upgrading from a 5.4 to the 6.2 definitely won't have any complaints, but if Ford takes away the V10 in the E-series, look out! A 5.4 in a 1 ton van? Can you say "rebuild at 60k"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted December 19, 2010 Share Posted December 19, 2010 The 6.2 is the 6.8 V10's replacement, it produces nearly as much torque and a lot more horsepower.. If you want a better towing engine, the SD 6.7 V8 diesel is hard to go past... Ford doesn't offer a diesel in their class a motorhome chassis F53. If they did, that would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 ...There seems to be a lot of issues with the "One Ford" mandate as it applies to the Transit. Customer expectations are quite different across the pond. Wiz....I believe that "One Ford" and brand cache will go nose to nose when it comes to Econoline and Transit.....I see it as both will meld into "One Ford" and use common architecture for both Europe and abroad as well as the US market, but they will retain their respective name plates since both have years and years of positive imagery in their home markets....tossing a nameplate like Econoline aside in the US makes as little sense as getting rid of the Transit name in Europe.....Ford can use both and I predict they will continue to use both. I see down the road, that E150 will become a Transit based work truck/van (and maybe a FWD E100) and E250 on up will continue on with improvements to the chassis while using common body panels and become more closely linked visually to Transit, but all will continue with the Econoline name.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 The 6.2 is the 6.8 V10's replacement, it produces nearly as much torque and a lot more horsepower.. If you want a better towing engine, the SD 6.7 V8 diesel is hard to go past... Nah, the 6.2 is a poor excuse for a 6.8L V10 replacement. The 3 valve V10 makes about 40 more ft-lbs a lot sooner than the 6.2. The V10 has about a 1/2" of stroke and 2 more cylinders on the 6.2L. The variable cam timing on the 6.2L makes up for some of it, but the stroke advantage gives the V10 a noticably stronger low end. As we previously established, the 6.7L diesel is not available in the E-series. Ford's in trouble if the biggest E-series engine you can get is the 6.2L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 A 5.4 in a 1 ton van? Can you say "rebuild at 60k"? Why's that? I see old E-350s with the 300-six still running around just fine with 300,000+ miles on the clock. For a service van running tools from job to job, the old straight six, 5.8L Windsor V8 and the newer 5.4L make perfectly acceptable engines. Now if the van's use includes towing a large trailer frequently, the V10 or the diesel is a much better choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Huh, that's interesting.... I still see plenty of E-series driving around making the clack-clack-clack noise so I just assumed they were still available. It's really too bad that they aren't. I mean, what about the small bus conversions they make out of those things? You pretty much need the deisel for one of those things. My church has an 2009 with V10 and it does pretty good, but now that the V10 is history, does it mean that the [wimpy for a 30 passenger bus] 6.2L V8 will be the "big" engine option? What about the motor home conversions? They're stuck with an underpowered gasser too I guess. Too bad Ford ever quit making the good ole 7.3L. Ford reigned supreme in the diesel light truck market every year they offered that engine. Sad indeed! Who said the V10 is gone? It is still available in the E series as a 2V version, and will continue to be. It is still available in the motor home chassis, and the 3V V10 is still available F450/550 too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 A 5.4 in a 1 ton van? Can you say "rebuild at 60k"? You obviously never seen this: http://millionmilevan.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 (edited) The 6.2 is the 6.8 V10's replacement, it produces nearly as much torque and a lot more horsepower.. If you want a better towing engine, the SD 6.7 V8 diesel is hard to go past... The 6.2 is the 5.4's replacement. The V10 was only dropped from the pickups. V10's are still produced for every other vehicle that that used the V10's. My 2011 F550 V10 was just built, so they are still in production, just not in the pickups. Ford probably determined that for pickup drivers, the 6.2 would be enough. I wouldn't say a lot more horsepower, comparing both (V10 and 6.2) in super Duty's the difference is only 23HP. The V10 does make a lot more (52TQ) torque though! The SD 6.2 reaches it's max HP of 385 @ 5500 RPM. The 3V V10 reaches it's max HP of 362 @ 4750 RPM. 23 HP more, but at 750 more RPM. 6.5% more HP @ but 15% more RPM to get it, Pretty much a toss up. The 6.2 (using the F250 rating) reaches its max TQ of 405 @ 4500 RPM The 3V V10 Reaches it's max TQ of 457 @ 3250 RPM The 3V V10 has 90% of it's torque available by only 1600 RPM (more than the 6.2 puts out at any RPM) That's 52 TQ more, at 1250 RPM less, or about 38% less rpm to achieve 13% more TQ. Clearly a V10 win. That adds up to the V10 having a way more usable power range. Overall win in power goes to the the 3V V10. The 6.2 will get about 10% better fuel economy. I'm not saying the 6.2 is weak, only that the 3V V10 is better in power for those actually working them. Unloaded, the 6.2 should be just as quick because of the 6 speed auto trans (The V10 still only comes with a 5 speed auto) The 3V V10 will tow better. Edited December 20, 2010 by LSchicago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted December 20, 2010 Author Share Posted December 20, 2010 (edited) The 3V V10 is currently not available in the E Series The 6.2L gets MUCH better fuel economy than either the 2V or 3V V10. Switch to the F Series Super Duty 6 speed transmission and you will have no worries about torque. Edited December 20, 2010 by theoldwizard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 (edited) The 3V V10 is currently not available in the E Series The 6.2L gets MUCH better fuel economy than either the 2V or 3V V10. Switch to the F Series Super Duty 6 speed transmission and you will have no worries about torque. I never said the 3V is available in the E series, I said the 2V V10 is still offered in the E series. The 3V V10 was never available in the E series. The 6.2 is not available in the E series either. One extra overdrive will not help you torque wise while towing a heavy load on the highway. On a big hill, the V10 5 speed auto may down shift once, while the 6.2 will need to downshift 2 gears, and in no point in the RPM range will the 6.2 ever out tow a 3V V10 on the interstate. Around town or not towing a heavy load the 6.2 should scoot around pretty good. The extra gear will help it accelerate decently and get better mileage in those conditions. Sixth gear does not help simulate extra torque on the highway. The 6.2 gets about 10% better fuel economy than the 3V, mainly because of the 6 speed. The 6 speed auto will be installed behind some V10's in 2012. My truck in the following picture weighs 14,000# empty, The bus I'm towing weighed 15,500 (33' diesel F550 limo bus) I would not want a 6.2 to tow this at highway speeds. You truly would be missing the extra 52 TQ. The V10 in this truck makes more torque at 1600-3500 rpm than a 6.2 makes at it's 4,000 RPM peak. Edited December 21, 2010 by LSchicago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-150 Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 Why's that? I see old E-350s with the 300-six still running around just fine with 300,000+ miles on the clock. For a service van running tools from job to job, the old straight six, 5.8L Windsor V8 and the newer 5.4L make perfectly acceptable engines. Now if the van's use includes towing a large trailer frequently, the V10 or the diesel is a much better choice. Most companies that buy a 1ton van do so because the 3/4 needed too much front end work. Yeah, what a surprise. 1 ton van owners using them for work and working them hard. I have personally seen the 5.4s die and early death because the 1 ton they were in was being worked as a 1 ton. ANyone using a 300 in a 1 ton is obviously not working the van very hard because the 300 would not move a 1 ton van that has maxed out its payload capacity. Been there, done that. Saw it firsthand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 ANyone using a 300 in a 1 ton is obviously not working the van very hard because the 300 would not move a 1 ton van that has maxed out its payload capacity. Been there, done that. Saw it firsthand. I don't know about that. 300s will move (note that by move, I don't necessarily mean go highway speeds) some pretty insane loads. Personally, I've found them adequate for towing duties up to about a skid-steer on a 2-axle flatbed. All the 4.9Ls I've had would easily move a fully loaded E-350. By no means would it be ideal for towing the max trailer on a highway, but a fully loaded (no trailer) van would not be a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLPRacing Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 Nah, the 6.2 is a poor excuse for a 6.8L V10 replacement. The 3 valve V10 makes about 40 more ft-lbs a lot sooner than the 6.2. The V10 has about a 1/2" of stroke and 2 more cylinders on the 6.2L. The variable cam timing on the 6.2L makes up for some of it, but the stroke advantage gives the V10 a noticably stronger low end. As we previously established, the 6.7L diesel is not available in the E-series. Ford's in trouble if the biggest E-series engine you can get is the 6.2L. The 6.2 is the 5.4's replacement. The V10 was only dropped from the pickups. V10's are still produced for every other vehicle that that used the V10's. My 2011 F550 V10 was just built, so they are still in production, just not in the pickups. Ford probably determined that for pickup drivers, the 6.2 would be enough. I wouldn't say a lot more horsepower, comparing both (V10 and 6.2) in super Duty's the difference is only 23HP. The V10 does make a lot more (52TQ) torque though! The SD 6.2 reaches it's max HP of 385 @ 5500 RPM. The 3V V10 reaches it's max HP of 362 @ 4750 RPM. 23 HP more, but at 750 more RPM. 6.5% more HP @ but 15% more RPM to get it, Pretty much a toss up. The 6.2 (using the F250 rating) reaches its max TQ of 405 @ 4500 RPM The 3V V10 Reaches it's max TQ of 457 @ 3250 RPM The 3V V10 has 90% of it's torque available by only 1600 RPM (more than the 6.2 puts out at any RPM) That's 52 TQ more, at 1250 RPM less, or about 38% less rpm to achieve 13% more TQ. Clearly a V10 win. That adds up to the V10 having a way more usable power range. Overall win in power goes to the the 3V V10. The 6.2 will get about 10% better fuel economy. I'm not saying the 6.2 is weak, only that the 3V V10 is better in power for those actually working them. Unloaded, the 6.2 should be just as quick because of the 6 speed auto trans (The V10 still only comes with a 5 speed auto) The 3V V10 will tow better. I do really like the V10. I've driven Excursions, F250's and my motorhome all with the V10 in them and it gives you big block like low end torque but revs like a small block. I would love to have seen what a tuned 3V V10 would of been like in an F150. The only negative is the exhaust note. It just sounds nasty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 (edited) I don't know about that. 300s will move (note that by move, I don't necessarily mean go highway speeds) some pretty insane loads. Personally, I've found them adequate for towing duties up to about a skid-steer on a 2-axle flatbed. All the 4.9Ls I've had would easily move a fully loaded E-350. By no means would it be ideal for towing the max trailer on a highway, but a fully loaded (no trailer) van would not be a problem. 18 years ago, before I started towing I worked for a small trucking company. The old POS I drove was a 1970 F600 14' straight truck with a 300 6 cylinder. It weighed 13,000 pounds empty, and hauled 10,000 plus daily (usually poultry products). Once I had 18,000 pounds of copper wire in the box. Granted, it had no power with loads like that (taking the full green light just to cross the intersection, LOL), but it did 10K# everyday, and never blew up. It was one of only a couple trucks that never needed major engine work while I was there. It only had a 4 speed, and would reach a top speed of 50 MPH with the engine screaming at WOT. Believe me, every driver drove that truck with their foot flat on the floor, But no one could kill it. It was faithful and durable engine! Edited December 21, 2010 by LSchicago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 18 years ago, before I started towing I worked for a small trucking company. The old POS I drove was a 1970 F600 14' straight truck with a 300 6 cylinder. It weighed 13,000 pounds empty, and hauled 10,000 plus daily (usually poultry products). Once I had 18,000 pounds of copper wire in the box. Granted, it had no power with loads like that (taking the full green light just to cross the intersection, LOL), but it did 10K# everyday, and never blew up. It was one of only a couple trucks that never needed major engine work while I was there. It only had a 4 speed, and would reach a top speed of 50 MPH with the engine screaming at WOT. Believe me, every driver drove that truck with their foot flat on the floor, But no one could kill it. It was faithful and durable engine! Yep! That's the same good 'ole 300/4.9 I always knew! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted December 22, 2010 Share Posted December 22, 2010 (edited) Who said the V10 is gone? It is still available in the E series as a 2V version, and will continue to be. It is still available in the motor home chassis, and the 3V V10 is still available F450/550 too. Triton V10 is also available in NABI transit buses with gasoline hybrid powertrain. I believe they use the 3V version. It has a long life ahead... http://www.cptdb.ca/wiki/index.php?title=North_American_Bus_Industries_42-BRT Here is a good photo of the engine Edited December 22, 2010 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGolden Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 The 3V V10 will tow better. Having experience with a fleet containing both this isnt entirely true. WIth ~1500 lb of tools in the bed and a 4500# bumper tow generator they are nearly equal for ~100-200 feet. After that the 6.2L will walk the v10. This of course is due to the 6 speed vs 5 speed., but none the less its what it is. THe 6.2l is a beast. I hope it is as durable and can make it to 300k miles like the v10. It would make a great van engine along with the 5.0L for light van. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 Having experience with a fleet containing both this isnt entirely true. WIth ~1500 lb of tools in the bed and a 4500# bumper tow generator they are nearly equal for ~100-200 feet. After that the 6.2L will walk the v10. This of course is due to the 6 speed vs 5 speed., but none the less its what it is. THe 6.2l is a beast. I hope it is as durable and can make it to 300k miles like the v10. It would make a great van engine along with the 5.0L for light van. That's not what I call towing. I'm talking 25-30K gross at highway speeds not accelerating from a stop. The 6.2 has a big gearing advantage from a stop, but that will not help it maintain speed on a hill at 65-75 mph with 15-20K pounds in tow. That is what I'm talking about. My empty F550 V10 probably weighs more than your "towing" weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSchicago Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 Triton V10 is also available in NABI transit buses with gasoline hybrid powertrain. I believe they use the 3V version. It has a long life ahead... http://www.cptdb.ca/wiki/index.php?title=North_American_Bus_Industries_42-BRT Here is a good photo of the engine Looks like a 2V. I hear about lots of V10's being used as generators. I never heard of these buses before though. Thanks for posting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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