mlhm5 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 First this car is large compared to any others getting anywhere near this mpg. Secondly, diesel beats gas by a respectable margin. Using $3.75 per gallon and 28 MPG for a gas car, the cost per mile is $0.13. Using $4.15 per gallon and 40 MPG, the CPM is $0.10. Using gas you pay 30% more per mile, even accounting for the higher cost of diesel. BTW, it is well known that diesels out-perform EPA ratings 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Those fuel consumption figures are exemplary for a U.S. market D-segment car. Does this new Passat TDI require DEF to meet emission standards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Using gas you pay 30% more per mile, even accounting for the higher cost of diesel. Driving a Volkswagen, you pay 480% more repairing electrical problems, so it balances out. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 The combined mpg is only 35 for the passat TDI. The combined mpg for a $28K Fusion Hybrid is 39 and it uses less expensive gasoline instead of diesel. I'm also sure it has more standard equipment. And the new one will be even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
69scode Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Driving a Volkswagen, you pay 480% more repairing electrical problems, so it balances out. You guys keep talking about the electrical and mechanical problems with VW. My experience has been nothing like that. I have owned three diesel VW's: 1980 Dasher wagon - 1981-1990, 1990 Jetta - 1990-2004, 2004 Jetta - 2004 to present. I have had to replace one headlight in each of the Jetta's and one backup light bulb in the '04. That is it. I had 150,000 miles on the 1980 Dasher and I averaged 48 mpg. My 1990 Jetta had 165,000 miles on it when I sold it to a friend. Last I heard it was still running with 210,000 on it. The current Jetta has 105,000 miles on it and runs perfect and I average 44 mpg and have seen 50 on trips. My 2002 Explorer has been pretty reliable if you don't count the transfer case solenoid replacement and right rear window motor replacement. So based on my experience VW has it over Ford. My new job requires a lot of travel, so I will look at the new Passat in a couple of months. I like Ford, but they won't build what I want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 You guys keep talking about the electrical and mechanical problems with VW. My experience has been nothing like that. I have owned three diesel VW's: 1980 Dasher wagon - 1981-1990, 1990 Jetta - 1990-2004, 2004 Jetta - 2004 to present. I have had to replace one headlight in each of the Jetta's and one backup light bulb in the '04. That is it. I had 150,000 miles on the 1980 Dasher and I averaged 48 mpg. My 1990 Jetta had 165,000 miles on it when I sold it to a friend. Last I heard it was still running with 210,000 on it. The current Jetta has 105,000 miles on it and runs perfect and I average 44 mpg and have seen 50 on trips. My 2002 Explorer has been pretty reliable if you don't count the transfer case solenoid replacement and right rear window motor replacement. So based on my experience VW has it over Ford. My new job requires a lot of travel, so I will look at the new Passat in a couple of months. I like Ford, but they won't build what I want. You are one of the lucky ones. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 VW 1.6 Diesel in Europe that you don't get in the US returns an average 74 MPG that is much better than the new Toyota Prius. VW 1.6 TDI Bluemotion NOx emissions are 0.00129 compared to the dirty polluting Prius NOx emissions 0.006. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97svtgoin05gt Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Sounds good on paper, but I'm with Nick on this one. You can't get behind a VW on the road that doesn't have at least 1 tail lamp blown out. Its not my imagination either, this is real stuff. That doesn't take into consideration what "idiot" lights are on on the dash. Those always seem to go on and off quite well on their own as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Sounds good on paper, but I'm with Nick on this one. You can't get behind a VW on the road that doesn't have at least 1 tail lamp blown out. Its not my imagination either, this is real stuff. That doesn't take into consideration what "idiot" lights are on on the dash. Those always seem to go on and off quite well on their own as well. Friend of mine recently traded in a '04 Jetta 1.8T on a Toyota Avalon precisely because of its electrical gremlins (and the entire interior was falling apart -- what happened to this supposed German "coffin-like" interior engineering?). Odd that he went back to Toyota though. He previously had an '88 Celica and '96 Camry that both died from engine failure. The only vehicle he ever owned that he didn't get rid of because of something mechanical/electrical was his '87 F-150 that his brother ran into a tree. But nah...those domestics can't be trusted. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97svtgoin05gt Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Friend of mine recently traded in a '04 Jetta 1.8T on a Toyota Avalon precisely because of its electrical gremlins (and the entire interior was falling apart -- what happened to this supposed German "coffin-like" interior engineering?). Odd that he went back to Toyota though. He previously had an '88 Celica and '96 Camry that both died from engine failure. The only vehicle he ever owned that he didn't get rid of because of something mechanical/electrical was his '87 F-150 that his brother ran into a tree. But nah...those domestics can't be trusted. I'm no Toyota fan but honestly am a little surprised by those 88 and 96 engine failures. Toyotas back then were the ones that were practically bullet proof. I remember my sister had like I believe and '81 or something Celica GT that she regularly ran without oil and that thing just kept coming back for more. I swore it was indestrutable. It had like 90hp of course so perhaps its all relative. Anyway, no VW or Toyotas of today for me, no thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 I'm no Toyota fan but honestly am a little surprised by those 88 and 96 engine failures. Toyotas back then were the ones that were practically bullet proof. I remember my sister had like I believe and '81 or something Celica GT that she regularly ran without oil and that thing just kept coming back for more. I swore it was indestrutable. It had like 90hp of course so perhaps its all relative. Anyway, no VW or Toyotas of today for me, no thanks. Well, the '88 can probably be chalked up to it being an abused high school car. The '96 though I can't explain. Only had just over 100K miles on it too if I recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Friend of mine recently traded in a '04 Jetta 1.8T on a Toyota Avalon... If Toyota offered an Americanized version of the 2.2L 2AD-FHV diesel engine in the Camry and Avalon, and Ford offered its 2.2L TDCi diesel in the Taurus, they could both give VW some real competition for the new Passat TDI. Oh well, that's not going to happen. :reading: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 If Toyota offered an Americanized version of the 2.2L 2AD-FHV diesel engine in the Camry and Avalon, and Ford offered its 2.2L TDCi diesel in the Taurus, they could both give VW some real competition for the new Passat TDI. Oh well, that's not going to happen. :reading: When the market starts demanding it, they'll offer them. VW banks on being the only player in the low-priced diesel segment in order to justify their existence here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 IMO, automakers can no longer afford to ignore diesel. Volkswagen sales were up by 28%, again led by its TDI which now accounts for >20% of all sales. Same for Audi where sales of the A3 are up more than 30% with the diesel getting more than half of the sales. Same for Q7. Cummins is developing a four-cylinder diesel engine aimed at giving full-sized, light-duty pickups the power of a small V-8 and overall fuel economy of 28 mpg. As far as Ford, in spite of the hype, no "Ecoboost" engine achieves fuel efficiency remotely resembling diesel engines. The only real alternative to diesel are hybrids and after about 100,000 miles, you have to cough up $4,000 for new batteries. Contrast that to a well-maintained diesel engine which has a lifespan two to three times longer than an equivalent gasoline engine and that reduces cost per mile ownership. There is another reason also. if diesel vehicles could make up 30 percent of the U.S. market share by 2020, the U.S. could save 350,000 barrels of oil a day. My suggestion to buy platinum now before the price goes to $4K an ounce. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Car Examiner Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 "As far as Ford, in spite of the hype, no "Ecoboost" engine achieves fuel efficiency remotely resembling diesel engines. The only real alternative to diesel are hybrids and after about 100,000 miles, you have to cough up $4,000 for new batteries." That's been disproven by hundreds of thousands of hybrids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydro Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 mlhm is forgetting diesels require fuel filter changes at 10,000 miles, DPF replacement at 100,000 or so miles ($3k on a f250, not sure about cars), regeneration of the DPF (which guzzles fuel) and will lower your combined mileage. Not sure if they require DEF because I haven't looked into them, but thats another small cost, More frequent air filter changes because of a forced induction motor. They just flat out cost more to maintain. The 3 cents/mile figure will definetly get cut down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Guys, why are you still replying to him? He's a tool, who pops up here to shill his diesel gospel, damnnear gets a riot going, and then disappears for a few months. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 IMO And your opinions have been proven wrong time after time after time. Remember the one from a couple of years ago about Ford being bankrupt in 6 months? Now bugger off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Brady will not get sacked! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 Guys, why are you still replying to him? He's a tool, who pops up here to shill his diesel gospel, damnnear gets a riot going, and then disappears for a few months. What's the matter, no information to dispute what I posted? You cannot dispute it because it is all facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mlhm5 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 (edited) "As far as Ford, in spite of the hype, no "Ecoboost" engine achieves fuel efficiency remotely resembling diesel engines. The only real alternative to diesel are hybrids and after about 100,000 miles, you have to cough up $4,000 for new batteries." That's been disproven by hundreds of thousands of hybrids. Even without the batteries, the average useful life of a well-maintained diesel engine is about two to three times longer than an equivalent gasoline engine and is doubling the efficiency of some cars in its class. It's clearly a great option for the American driver. Edited June 15, 2011 by mlhm5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 What's the matter, no information to dispute what I posted? You cannot dispute it because it is all facts. No, it's because you don't deserve a better response. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 No, it's because you don't deserve a better response. We have a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 "As far as Ford, in spite of the hype, no "Ecoboost" engine achieves fuel efficiency remotely resembling diesel engines. The only real alternative to diesel are hybrids and after about 100,000 miles, you have to cough up $4,000 for new batteries." That's been disproven by hundreds of thousands of hybrids. bingo, and in the meantime the TDI owner has replaced how many high Pressure fuel Pumps?....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Even without the batteries, the average useful life of a well-maintained diesel engine is about two to three times longer than an equivalent gasoline engine and is doubling the efficiency of some cars in its class. It's clearly a great option for the American driver. and thats pure speculation...i have one customer with a fleet of Econolines alll nearing 800k per unit......and how bout them Escape Hybrid taxis in NY?..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.