Langston Hughes Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I have no idea who those guys are. Whitman was the Univeristy of Texas shooter, Ashbrooke shot up a church and Hennard was a seriously deranged individual who drove his pickup into a Kileen, Texas Luby's and started shooting customers. He killed around 20 and wounded about the same i believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 So how close are you to Baltimore, home of "Homicide, Life on the Streets?" Take your pick....Philadelphia, Chicago, Oakland, L.A., and on and on. Gunshot victims galore and morgues overfilling with corpses that met very unhappy endings. David Simon, former reporter for Baltimore Sun, could tell you a lot about life on the streets of Baltimore. Right up there with good old Detroit. I'm about a half hour from Baltimore. Get there quite often. It's not nearly as depressing a hole in the wall as you make it out to be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langston Hughes Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I wondered how James Holmes could afford his arsenal within such a short period of time considering he was unemployed and collecting unemployment from the government. Usually those monies only cover a few basics a person needs to live on. Considering the cost of just one assault rifle between $1000 to $2000 depending upon the model, how did he do it? And then there is this student without any prior problems, extremely intelligent and does this abrupt flip-flop. Well the news has a report today that James received a $26,000 stipend from the federal government. So either way the Feds paid for James' massacre. "The swell of emotion comes as new information about the suspect emerges. 9 News has learned that James Holmes was awarded a prestigious grant from the National Institutes of Health. It gave the graduate student a $26,000 stipend and paid his tuition for the highly competitive program in neuroscience at the University of Colorado in Denver. " http://www.wusa9.com...uition-From-NIH But the sudden flip-flop does peak my interest. Was our future 'brain doctor' exposed to an experiment that backfired? Most on here don't have a clue what our government does behind our backs. MK-ULTRA was real and experiments conducted by the CIA trying to produce the 'Manchurian Candidate'. http://science.disco...mkultra-02.html The program was reported to have ended back in the 1970's. But would the CIA really tell you the truth about their activities? Using the veil of national security, hell no. The CIA is always looking for the perfect assassin. Was James involved with something like this? We will never know for sure. But something doesn't smell right with this story. The worst part of your conspiracy theories is that the truth is out there and you made absolutely no attempt to find it. Now if we could for a moment leave the potential conspiracies aside, lets talk about what really happened.The NIH awarded the University of Colorado a "Neuroscience Training Grant" which totaled $179,000 of which James Holmes received 26,000 as decided by the University not the NIH. http://www.genengnews.com/gen-news-highlights/update-nih-funding-helped-support-esteemed-university-of-colorado-denver-neuroscience-team/81247091/ http://www.latimes.com/news/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-the-nih-did-not-give-money-directly-20120724,0,4358097.story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinter Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 The worst part of your conspiracy theories is that the truth is out there and you made absolutely no attempt to find it. Now if we could for a moment leave the potential conspiracies aside, lets talk about what really happened.The NIH awarded the University of Colorado a "Neuroscience Training Grant" which totaled $179,000 of which James Holmes received 26,000 as decided by the University not the NIH. http://www.genengnew...-team/81247091/ http://www.latimes.c...0,4358097.story I stand corrected on the funding not coming directly from the government. However are you implying MKULTRA is a conspiracy theory? And are you naive enough to think this stopped back in the 70's? Watch this ABC special about it and found out how the CIA used innocent people as guinea pigs in their experiments. http://govtslaves.info/1979-abc-news-special-mission-mind-control/ And just how convenient that another mass shooting occurred right before more gun control legislation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langston Hughes Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I stand corrected on the funding not coming directly from the government. However are you implying MKULTRA is a conspiracy theory? And are you naive enough to think this stopped back in the 70's? Watch this ABC special about it and found out how the CIA used innocent people as guinea pigs in their experiments. http://govtslaves.info/1979-abc-news-special-mission-mind-control/ And just how convenient that another mass shooting occurred right before more gun control legislation. I was only dealing with conspiracies connected to James Holmes. I'm sorry if i wasn't clear but there were two of them, one yours and another GoingBroke's. And may i ask what gun control legislation you are referring to so i may know exactly how convenient it is or more to the point how you think it is? I don't follow every single piece of gun control legislation out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I'm about a half hour from Baltimore. Get there quite often. It's not nearly as depressing a hole in the wall as you make it out to be. At least they aren't abandoning whole sections of the city to get reclaimed by nature like they are doing in Detroit.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 At least they aren't abandoning whole sections of the city to get reclaimed by nature like they are doing in Detroit.... I believe we were talking about MURDER rates, and Baltimore is right up there with the best of them. Mostly drug related, but not always. I'm sure Baltimore detectives are just as busy as Detroit detectives trying to keep up with it all. Murder is national problem, not something endemic to Detroit only. That was my point, but as usual the parameters change. And I'm a David Simon fan and his nonfiction stories of Baltimore crime. Btw, I've been to Baltimore and love the city as danger can be beautiful in a strange way. Just as Detroit, lots of creative talent has come out of both over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinter Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I was only dealing with conspiracies connected to James Holmes. I'm sorry if i wasn't clear but there were two of them, one yours and another GoingBroke's. And may i ask what gun control legislation you are referring to so i may know exactly how convenient it is or more to the point how you think it is? I don't follow every single piece of gun control legislation out there. There is the united nation arms treaty which the Obama and the democrats want to implement. Also there is the assault weapons ban and large capacity magazine ban lying dormant in congress. Well until now. http://townhall.com/columnists/briandarling/2012/07/23/un_arms_trade_treaty_potential_assault_on_2nd_amendment Finally a main stream media reporter not afraid to ask the tough questions in his Reality Check: http://www.infowars.com/fox-news-channel-questions-narrative-of-batman-massacre/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Was I wrong that it has happened in Texas or not? I provided three names of mass shooters who all killed multiple people in Texas in what is a narrow discussion, whether of not it would happen in Texas. I don't believe I suggested that concealed carry doesn't stop crime, only that its erroneous to believe that it can't happen in states with less gun restrictions such as Texas. The Luby's cafeteria killer held the grizzly distinction of most deaths during a mass shooting in modern times for almost 20 years. I'm not the one who said it wouldn't happen. My point is that CC is a deterrence to crime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 I read a story the other day where Chicago (which has highly restrictive gun laws) had 6 shootings with one fatal in a span of 15 minutes. None were related. I guess the criminals didn't know they weren't supposed to have guns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal50 Posted July 25, 2012 Share Posted July 25, 2012 Regulations -- not all out bans. This was pretty much a ban but is in the process of "shall issue" http://fwd4.me/16Z2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) I read a story the other day where Chicago (which has highly restrictive gun laws) had 6 shootings with one fatal in a span of 15 minutes. None were related. I guess the criminals didn't know they weren't supposed to have guns! That's nothing, we see at least that many every weekend.http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/ They do know where to go where it is highly likely there victim don't have a gun. Edited July 26, 2012 by fmccap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
partsisparts Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Then of course there is New York City where strict gun laws are partly the reason for the drastic reduction in crime there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal50 Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Then of course there is New York City where strict gun laws are partly the reason for the drastic reduction in crime there. Yea, strict gun laws worked so well in DC & Chicago..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron W. Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) Oh for Petes sake ( whoever Pete is ) the gun control debate has been going on for decades. The old bumper sticker said it well, when guns are oulawed only outlaws will have guns. This I'm sorry to say is the truth. Edited July 26, 2012 by Ron W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Then of course there is New York City where strict gun laws are partly the reason for the drastic reduction in crime there. Homicides of all types are down in NYC. You can't ascribe that to gun restrictions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napfirst Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Then of course there is New York City where strict gun laws are partly the reason for the drastic reduction in crime there. The reason that crime is down on NYC is because of what is known as "stop and frisk"....the police go to high crime area and stop and frisk suspicious people and many tmes finding illegal weapons....apears to be working... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langston Hughes Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 There is the united nation arms treaty which the Obama and the democrats want to implement. Also there is the assault weapons ban and large capacity magazine ban lying dormant in congress. Well until now. http://townhall.com/...n_2nd_amendment Finally a main stream media reporter not afraid to ask the tough questions in his Reality Check: http://www.infowars....atman-massacre/ May i suggest that before you go taking an international treaty designed to stop the flow of weapons into third world countries as the end of our rights, that you calm down and look at it logically. I've have been receiving pro gun anti-Obama emails from some group that purchased my email address off of the Ron Paul 2008 campaign since after the 2008 election. A majority of the hysterical any minute now Obama will take our guns away theories never even got introduced or where some analyst's feelings about what Obama might do. Then you add in that the supreme court has already ruled that Intentional treaties do not supercede the Constitution in Reid V. Covert so that eliminates that angle. And finally just like with Edstock's contention that Republicans willfully let people starve to death, I don't believe that Obama nor anyone in his administration would let this tragedy happen for political opportunities. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langston Hughes Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 I'm not the one who said it wouldn't happen. My point is that CC is a deterrence to crime. Okay, well that's different than what he said. While I'm not sure that your right, I see no reason to not allow concealed carry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Yea, strict gun laws worked so well in DC & Chicago..... Wherever you have lots of illegal drug use, you are going to have lots of crime and homicide. Also might add rape as rape crimes are exploding in this country. And of course often the rape victim is beaten and even murdered. Life has become so cheap that these monsters leave no witnesses and that includes any children present that could identify them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
partsisparts Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 The reason that crime is down on NYC is because of what is known as "stop and frisk"....the police go to high crime area and stop and frisk suspicious people and many tmes finding illegal weapons....apears to be working... As I said in my post, strict gun laws are part of the reason. Another part is "stop and frisk", another part is "quality of life" crime enforcement, more cops on the street instead of on desk duty ..etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 As I said in my post, strict gun laws are part of the reason. Another part is "stop and frisk", another part is "quality of life" crime enforcement, more cops on the street instead of on desk duty ..etc. If the strict guns laws worked as the anti-gun groups claim, there wouldn't be a need for "stop and frisk". It just proves that gun bans don't work as advertised. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmccap Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langston Hughes Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I wanted to offer up this point in the discussion on clip size and see if it has an effect on the discussion. During the Tucson shooting last year a elderly woman helped wrestle a clip away from the shooter which left him unable to fire anymore. Now the shooter was being engaged by others at the time so it's not all on her, but that action did potentially keep Jared Loughner from attempting to shoot those he struggled with. Does the idea that a shooter having to reload make action against him more likely and also potentially more likely to succeed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Comparing gun related deaths to motor vehicle deaths is just plain stupid. Moror vehicle deaths are overwhelmingly accidental (there may be a miniscule number of intentional homicides by vehicle). The statistic you cited for crime related gun deaths omits accidental gun related deaths.Moreover guns are still the leading factor in criminal homicides. The purpose of a motor vehicle is transportation. The purpose of a firearm is to launch a projectile into a target. When that target is a human being the result is often death. You might as well say we don't need gun control because more people die from cancer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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