Bob Rosadini Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 21 hours ago, Joe771476 said: Bob, my tree guy is indeed a Ford guy! Loves his F750 Powerstroke! He also has two mid-80's L9000 cranes w/Cummins and Detroit. Yeah Bob, I think you're right about the possible Mack demise, however I just read Mack Defense is testing trucks for US military use, so maybe to stay "American", they might keep it, for a while at least. I finally saw my dream TV ad! Ford bragging PROUDly about their leadership in supplying emergency vehicles! Now we need a C9000 tandem axle pumper/tanker! Always good to hear Joe when someone is having good experience with their Power Stroke in a 650/750. The skeptics still remain that it is a "pick up" motor. Is it a bucket/chipbox or a dedicated chip box? As a kid I remember that tree guys had "climbing spikes" and a lot of rope. Today it seems if a guy wants to compete he needs a crane. There are plenty of guys around here with big time stuff- Groves, Big Nationals on tri axle chassis etc. I should also add that every couple of weeks one of these guys doesn't read load charts or doesn't use pads under his out riggers and he makes the six o'clock news! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 Ford class 6 sales have recovered to pre-covid levels, so whatever Ford is doing is working Class 7 is only a few hundred. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 2 hours ago, jpd80 said: Ford class 6 sales have recovered to pre-covid levels, so whatever Ford is doing is working Class 7 is only a few hundred. Keep in mind Ford now has 2 class 6 models, that may count for some of the increase. What was the ratio between F-600 and F-650 sales? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 Good news on Class 6. Saw new dump today pulling a tag trailer. Judging by the body I would say it was a 6-8 yd so iot was probably 33,000 lb. 750. Also Roush announced the were building 7.3 750's with then propane package. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 3 hours ago, 7Mary3 said: Keep in mind Ford now has 2 class 6 models, that may count for some of the increase. What was the ratio between F-600 and F-650 sales? I have no break out on that, so hard to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 12 hours ago, 7Mary3 said: Keep in mind Ford now has 2 class 6 models, that may count for some of the increase. What was the ratio between F-600 and F-650 sales? For what its worth, the two truck rags that cover New England (one monthly, one bi weekly) have many dealer ads featuring their inventory, I have yet to see a dealer indicating any F-600 inventory. Not sure where JP gets his stats but I have always been confused as to how those numbers are compiled- dealer order to factory, or sale off dealer lot???? Ice Capades would probably know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 43 minutes ago, Bob Rosadini said: For what its worth, the two truck rags that cover New England (one monthly, one bi weekly) have many dealer ads featuring their inventory, I have yet to see a dealer indicating any F-600 inventory. Not sure where JP gets his stats but I have always been confused as to how those numbers are compiled- dealer order to factory, or sale off dealer lot???? Ice Capades would probably know. If you want to tag I.C., you need to put the "@" in front of his name like this... @ice-capades Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 25 minutes ago, twintornados said: If you want to tag I.C., you need to put the "@" in front of his name like this... @ice-capades thx TT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 2 hours ago, Bob Rosadini said: For what its worth, the two truck rags that cover New England (one monthly, one bi weekly) have many dealer ads featuring their inventory, I have yet to see a dealer indicating any F-600 inventory. Not sure where JP gets his stats but I have always been confused as to how those numbers are compiled- dealer order to factory, or sale off dealer lot???? Ice Capades would probably know. A quick look at Ford's Vehicle Locator shows (17) 2020 F-600 Chassis Cabs within the closest 300 dealerships, furthest being 180 miles away... 1 Retail Order, 2 Stock & 14 Fleet. Oldest unit manufactured 50 days ago. Some fleet units may have been ordered for specific fleet accounts but not to be delivered until a future date. There is no F-650 inventory showing in the same search area. OTD (Order-to-Delivery) for bodies, etc. to be installed can be a month or longer plus installation time. Inventory, regardless of order type, will show in Dealer's inventory until reported to Ford as sold and delivered. There's little reason for a dealership to advertise F-600 unless they're a large dealership and have extra inventory or inventory that was ordered for a customer that cancelled for some reason. Dealers cannot cancel inventory orders once they're scheduled. Hope this helps! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 6 hours ago, Bob Rosadini said: For what its worth, the two truck rags that cover New England (one monthly, one bi weekly) have many dealer ads featuring their inventory, I have yet to see a dealer indicating any F-600 inventory. Not sure where JP gets his stats but I have always been confused as to how those numbers are compiled- dealer order to factory, or sale off dealer lot???? Ice Capades would probably know. Bob, I have to be careful what I say these days, the info is commercially sensitive, even hinting at the source can be bad. F-600, F-650 & F-750 are normally built to order, not dealer stock. It looks like F-650 has recovered and F-600 is still small sales numbers maybe 10% of that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 3 hours ago, jpd80 said: Bob, I have to be careful what I say these days, the info is commercially sensitive, even hinting at the source can be bad. F-600, F-650 & F-750 are normally built to order, not dealer stock. It looks like F-650 has recovered and F-600 is still small sales numbers maybe 10% of that. Ice and JP- thx for responses- I'm still confused. I always thought a "fleet" order was a "done deal"... in other words the term "fleet" to me says it is a committed order with a customer name on it. I know my local dealer now has a 650 7.3 chassis, A 650 PS all set up with a 4-6 yd dump and a 750 V-10 set up with a dump. Plus there are at least 3 650's at other dealerships set up with dump bodies and another 650 chassis. There were also two 750 Dumps in one of the last "rags" but new edition indicates only one so one apparent sale of a stock truck. Sure do miss the monthly stats that HDT used to publish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 (edited) Manufacturers like Ford generally don't want that kind of sales data shared or broken down, you're lucky to get classes 4 to 7 break down but no split on vehicles ( eg F-450 vs E-450). A lot of that now considered commercially sensitive yet, GM has started splitting out it's 1500s from HD and MD. I was kind of hoping that Ford and Ram would follow that. Interesting that dealers near you have some MDs as floor stock, that is a little perculiar, maybe there were some loose trucks available with popular configurations... Edited October 25, 2020 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamweasel Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 11 minutes ago, jpd80 said: Manufacturers like Ford generally don't want that kind of sales data shared or broken down, you're lucky to get classes 4 to 7 break down but no split on vehicles ( eg F-450 vs E-450). A lot of that now considered commercially sensitive yet, GM has started splitting out it's 1500s from HD and MD. I was kind of hoping that Ford and Ram would follow that. Interesting that dealers near you have some MDs as floor stock, that is a little perculiar, maybe there were some loose trucks available with popular configurations... Curious why you think stock F600-F750's is such a rare thing. I have worked for and/or with many Ford dealers over the years and many of them stock a lot of F600-F750 trucks. Here are some examples: https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/195835213/2021-ford-f750-sd https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/197741581/2021-ford-f750 https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/194805915/2021-ford-f750 https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/196524707/2021-ford-f750 https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/28632733/2019-ford-f750-sd https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/190170903/2021-ford-f750 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, iamweasel said: Curious why you think stock F600-F750's is such a rare thing. I have worked for and/or with many Ford dealers over the years and many of them stock a lot of F600-F750 trucks. Here are some examples: Context. Each month, Ford sells between 1500 and 1900 class 6 trucks, class 7 is barely 200. Across 3,000 Ford dealers, that's not even one truck a month. In relative terms, you'd be lucky to find more than 200 examples of '21 F650/F750s around dealerships nation wide. Edited October 25, 2020 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 5 hours ago, jpd80 said: Context. Each month, Ford sells between 1500 and 1900 class 6 trucks, class 7 is barely 200. Across 3,000 Ford dealers, that's not even one truck a month. In relative terms, you'd be lucky to find more than 200 examples of '21 F650/F750s around dealerships nation wide. Forget there being 3,000 Ford dealers as the majority can't sell above a F-550. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theoldwizard Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 7 hours ago, jpd80 said: Context. Each month, Ford sells between 1500 and 1900 class 6 trucks, class 7 is barely 200. Across 3,000 Ford dealers, that's not even one truck a month. Is anyone else surprised that the new 7.3L gas has not increased sales significantly ? I thought for sure fleets would jump on this as the "total cost of ownership" is much less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 1 hour ago, ice-capades said: Forget there being 3,000 Ford dealers as the majority can't sell above a F-550. There are at least 6 dealers inside I-495 loop in eastern Ma that have 650/750's on floor. Five of them are traditional Ford dealers who are now "commercial " dealers and one is a heavy truck dealer that started as a Ford Heavy Truck store-I believe they were called "dealer development"- that transitioned to Sterling/Ford mediums, then when Sterling folded, they became Navistar/Ford. A family business that within the last year sold out to a multi location Navistar dealer. Their latest ad shows two 650's, plus 550s and a JV 19,500 International. Interesting if you open the TruckPaper ads 'Weasel posted, just look at inventory shots in background. That Cheseapeek Ford 750 dump is a well set up truck-right down to "coal" chute in gate. Amazes me that dummies around here will stock a dump without such a feature. Shows you these guys have never worked in construction?. Also if you scroll through pix of that truck note..It has a 25,999 plate-but a 12,000 front, 23,000 rear. I believe there is a "derate" option so I assume that is it... Save on the FET, but if you want to "run heavy and take your chances at the scale", have at it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 1 hour ago, theoldwizard said: Is anyone else surprised that the new 7.3L gas has not increased sales significantly ? I thought for sure fleets would jump on this as the "total cost of ownership" is much less. I have yet to see a 7.3L powered 650 or 750. Commercial truck sales are off a bit around here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamweasel Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 10 hours ago, jpd80 said: Context. Each month, Ford sells between 1500 and 1900 class 6 trucks, class 7 is barely 200. Across 3,000 Ford dealers, that's not even one truck a month. In relative terms, you'd be lucky to find more than 200 examples of '21 F650/F750s around dealerships nation wide. According to www.commercialtrucktrader.com there are 1,503 new F600-F750 trucks available for sale: F600 = 16 F650 = 689 F750 = 757 Now I get that a majority of Ford dealers are not real commercial truck dealers, but I do think these are stocked at dealers in fairly decent numbers nationwide. (Not to mention many "selling" body builders stock them for sale, too, so not all of the available inventory is sitting on a Ford dealer's lot.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamweasel Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 2 hours ago, theoldwizard said: Is anyone else surprised that the new 7.3L gas has not increased sales significantly ? I thought for sure fleets would jump on this as the "total cost of ownership" is much less. Are we sure that it hasn't increased their share? From what I understand, Ford's share increased significantly a year or two ago due to the gas motor. I know many Freightliner dealers are asking for a gas option for the M2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 2 hours ago, iamweasel said: According to www.commercialtrucktrader.com there are 1,503 new F600-F750 trucks available for sale: F600 = 16 F650 = 689 F750 = 757 Now I get that a majority of Ford dealers are not real commercial truck dealers, but I do think these are stocked at dealers in fairly decent numbers nationwide. (Not to mention many "selling" body builders stock them for sale, too, so not all of the available inventory is sitting on a Ford dealer's lot.) OK there's more than I expected but as '21s go, there's still under 500 F650s and 400 F750s. What I'd like to know is how long are they staying on dealers lots, I wonder if F750 sales are about to kick up... Clearly in the past month or so, dealers have gotten plenty of fresh 21 stock but the F600s are still light on the ground. The latest sales figures I have was for September and that was significantly up on August....good signs that Ford is getting out of the gloom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 2 hours ago, iamweasel said: Are we sure that it hasn't increased their share? From what I understand, Ford's share increased significantly a year or two ago due to the gas motor. I know many Freightliner dealers are asking for a gas option for the M2. Sales of F750s are in the low hundreds, even before the pandemic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 10 hours ago, theoldwizard said: Is anyone else surprised that the new 7.3L gas has not increased sales significantly ? I thought for sure fleets would jump on this as the "total cost of ownership" is much less. You my recall I posted pix of a 650 chassis that was at a local dealer that had a 7.3.. Looked like an 84" CA that would be typical for a dump application. I had stopped in as I was curious as to how a 7.3 looked from a serviceability question. I'm of same opinion as you and figure this motor will be a homerun with a large percentage of class 6/7 buyers. I mentioned this to the commercial sales guy and he said he had a guy drive buy the dealership- saw trucks on lot and stopped in. A true "cold call". Guy was a high end residential builder-around here that means north of a million. Dealer also had a 750 Power Stroke-ready to go with body. Long story short, after driving both, the guy paid $15,000 more for the 750. He liked the "diesel power"-as well as it had air brakes and was black, Alcoas and a lot of chrome.. Now this is a guy that IMO could really get by with a 7.3. A truck like that is more of a convenience rather then a front line unit that runs 8 hours a day. But again, money was no object. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 10 hours ago, iamweasel said: Are we sure that it hasn't increased their share? From what I understand, Ford's share increased significantly a year or two ago due to the gas motor. I know many Freightliner dealers are asking for a gas option for the M2. I guess the question is has the 7.3L been selling better than the 6.8L V-10. Hard to make an accurate comparison considering the economy at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 6 hours ago, 7Mary3 said: I guess the question is has the 7.3L been selling better than the 6.8L V-10. Hard to make an accurate comparison considering the economy at the moment. Last month's class 6 sales were greater than Sept 2019 but that's because people were waiting for the 7.3. So looking at Sept 2018, sales were down slightly but considering current circumstances, quite encouraging..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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