NickF1011 Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 This is all well and good, but... What about Maserati and Ferrari? :poke: They're pretending not to know this company. "FiatChrysler who?" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted May 6, 2014 Author Share Posted May 6, 2014 And why is the next Charger being shown as a "new model" instead of a refresh, which it clearly is? Because that makes it slightly easier to lie about Dodge's future. Also, the Durango is set to get ANOTHER MCE in 2017, when the Grand Wagoneer comes online? Yeah, right. Also, SRT Journey? This is a joke, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 Also, the Durango is set to get ANOTHER MCE in 2017, when the Grand Wagoneer comes online? Yeah, right. That does make me wonder though, what the heck is going on with the Explorer? Sure, its sales are still strong now, but it's past due for a refresh. Makes me wonder if Ford is falling back into its old ways on some vehicles and just letting them ride while the getting is still good. Or have they cancelled the MCE and are just going to ride it out to get its replacement (and Lincoln sibling) out sooner to consolidate platforms? I don't believe I've seen any spy shots indicating anything either way. Sorry, back to topic! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted May 6, 2014 Author Share Posted May 6, 2014 That does make me wonder though, what the heck is going on with the Explorer? Sure, its sales are still strong now, but it's past due for a refresh. Makes me wonder if Ford is falling back into its old ways on some vehicles and just letting them ride while the getting is still good. Or have they cancelled the MCE and are just going to ride it out to get its replacement (and Lincoln sibling) out sooner to consolidate platforms? I don't believe I've seen any spy shots indicating anything either way. Sorry, back to topic! AFAIK the MCE should still be coming next year? I think it only has a 2 year lifespan before the new model. It's been a while since I've heard anything on the Explorer program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 The timing's a bit off on the Explorer. It and the Lincoln equivalent will be the second vehicles on CD4.2 or whatever they're calling the CUV variant that's underpinning the Edge and MKX. It means a longer than usual product run on the current platform, but that shouldn't hold going forward since combined volumes should pay for a steady upgrade cycle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 (edited) A couple of observations: B-segment Dodge won't arrive until 2018... but new Fiat Punto is scheduled for 2016 - this is likely a hedge against the fact that by 2018, there won't be a Dodge. Chrysler gets a new midsize CUV in 2016, same time as new Journey and Cherokee facelift - Um yea... 3 midsize CUVs launch in 2016? I don't think so. One of them is probably not happening and I'll let you guess which one. Chrysler gets a fullsize CUV, same time as Jeep Grand Cherokee/Wagoneer and another Durango refresh - rinse and repeat what I said about the midsize CUV. Dodge "returning to its roots" would mean it goes back to selling trucks, not pseudo performance models. But I digress... How many "do overs" does Sergio get on Alfa before it gets taken away from him? After 500X, there is another Fiat niche model scheduled for North America... probably some sort of 500 coupe like Mini coupe. Midsize Fiat (Ram) pickup = ? Edited May 6, 2014 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 That does make me wonder though, what the heck is going on with the Explorer? Sure, its sales are still strong now, but it's past due for a refresh. Makes me wonder if Ford is falling back into its old ways on some vehicles and just letting them ride while the getting is still good. Or have they cancelled the MCE and are just going to ride it out to get its replacement (and Lincoln sibling) out sooner to consolidate platforms? I don't believe I've seen any spy shots indicating anything either way. Sorry, back to topic! Um the Explorer didn't really hit the market till early 2011...I remember seeing the first models in December/January 2011...that was only 3 years ago or so. I'd expect a refresh for MY '16 with maybe a new model in CY '18 or so. The one thing that got me with these presentations is calling the Cherokee a D segment SUV? WTF? Its a C class at best...its not even as big as the Equinox or Edge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AR Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 I won't get into the analysis of the rebranding of FCA, but I did want to point out something kind of interesting. Notice on the Jeep slides that they point out the 75th Anniversary of Jeep, but for Dodge there is no mention of Dodge's 100th Anniversary for 2014. I don't know if it was simply overlooked or left off on purpose, but it is interesting nonetheless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 (edited) The one thing that got me with these presentations is calling the Cherokee a D segment SUV? WTF? Its a C class at best...its not even as big as the Equinox or Edge. Cherokee kind of splits the difference between Edge and Escape and there will be a new "C segment" SUV to replace the Patriot and Compass soon which will slot in between Renegade and Cherokee. But to your point, this is an example of using European vehicle size nomenclature to describe non-European vehicles... it doesn't always make sense. Ford Edge Wheelbase 111.2 in (2,824 mm) Length 184.2 in (4,679 mm) Width 76.0 in (1,930 mm) Height 67.0 in (1,702 mm) Ford Escape Wheelbase 105.9 in (2,690 mm) Length 178.1 in (4,524 mm) Width 72.4 in (1,839 mm) Height 66.3 in (1,684 mm) Jeep Cherokee Wheelbase 106 in (2,692 mm) Length 182 in (4,623 mm) Width 73.2 in (1,859 mm) (Sport, Latitude, and Limited models) or 74.9 in (1,902 mm) (Trailhawk model only) Height 66.2–67.8 in (1,681–1,722 mm) Edited May 6, 2014 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Notice on the Jeep slides that they point out the 75th Anniversary of Jeep BTW: Where are they going to celebrate that? The Pentagon or Ford HQ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fgts Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 A little bummed about the Caravan's death and no mid-size for Dodge, I read that the 6.4 is no longer a SRT only motor and the SRT 300 is being dropped. I wonder if a "special" 300 is in the works with 392 power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 If you squint hard enough, you can see the changes... They moved up to a '71 Challenger grille, so there's that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Kill Dodge and throwing six hundred engineers at Alfa Romeo? The sad part about all this is that Pete DeLorenzo's head probably exploded "Scanners" style halfway through the Fiat presentation, and now they'll have to have a closed casket funeral for him. Hell, they will just need a big baggie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Dodge is the New Plymouth. Of course that strategy didn't work out too well for the Old Plymouth. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 (edited) I'm not seeing the wisdom of euthanizing a brand that was selling almost a million units a year until the recession, and still moves over 500,000 vehicles annually (even after its biggest seller was taken away). Meanwhile, the company is resurrecting a brand that doesn't have a terrific reputation on its home continent, and left this country with its tail between its legs. I'm hoping that Fiat-Chrysler leadership really knows what it's doing. Edited May 7, 2014 by grbeck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 I'm not seeing the wisdom of euthanizing a brand that was selling almost a million units a year until the recession, and still moves over 500,000 vehicles annually (even after its biggest seller was taken away). Meanwhile, the company is resurrecting a brand that doesn't have a terrific reputation on its home continent, and left this country with its tail between its legs. I'm hoping that Fiat-Chrysler leadership really knows what it's doing. Well, let's get a reality check. Dodge is a fleet sale brand, like Pontiac before it was killed. Last year, 31% of Dodge went straight to rental fleets, and another 11% to non-rental fleets. On some models it is a lot higher (e.g. Avenger 58%; Caravan 63%). And keep in mind that all Dodge is passenger vehicles... Ram vans and trucks are excluded so the % of retail mix is terrible for Dodge. So there is really no point keeping it around if all it is going to do is erode retail profit margin on similar (or identical) Chrysler products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 The idea of a separate performance brand is ok in theory. But the problem is there really isn't enough volume to justify it as a stand alone brand even if it has good products. Pontiac was similar but with terrible products to boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Dodge doesn't have the cachet to be a stand-alone performance brand. They aren't Porshe or Ferrari. Having the SRT moniker on top of the Dodge brand makes more sense, not a separate brand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 They aren't Porshe or Ferrari. I can definitely vouch for that (on the racetrack at least)........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 I can definitely vouch for that (on the racetrack at least)........ Rubbing it in I see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Um the Explorer didn't really hit the market till early 2011...I remember seeing the first models in December/January 2011...that was only 3 years ago or so. I'd expect a refresh for MY '16 with maybe a new model in CY '18 or so. The one thing that got me with these presentations is calling the Cherokee a D segment SUV? WTF? Its a C class at best...its not even as big as the Equinox or Edge. New Explorer went on sale as a 2011 in the latter half of 2010, so it's soon heading into its 5th model year unchanged since then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Rubbing it in I see... Every chance....... If I was really rubbing it in I would post videos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 7, 2014 Share Posted May 7, 2014 Every chance....... If I was really rubbing it in I would post more videos. Please do, though. I loved watching the one you posted. My heart was racing just watching it from here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 Please do, though. I loved watching the one you posted. My heart was racing just watching it from here! Ok - here's one at the same track in a Ferrari F430 Scuderia being driven by one of the pros. The mustang is the pace car. That Scuderia had a racing exhaust and was loud as hell. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 8, 2014 Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Dude, you're in a Ferrari F430 Scuderia ride-along with a pro. Put the dam cell phone away and enjoy the show! OK, now he's getting video. I can live with that. Back to screwing with the phone. Edited May 8, 2014 by fordmantpw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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