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Bronco and Bronco Sport World Premier July 13th!!

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16 minutes ago, passis said:

I thought Ford would not make Amaroks for North America.


For export not for sale in NA.  

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Could you imagine the panic right now with Bronco buyers if they didn’t have a reservation and we’instead trying to order through a dealer and having to worry about dealer allocation in addition to addendums, etc.

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2 hours ago, ice-capades said:

150K vs. 230K? Although it's nice to have the positive press about the public response, but a $100 reservation isn't a commitment for a lot of those looking for bragging rights with their friends, etc. and there are duplicate reservations to weed through too. And Ford rep's are contacting dealers daily pushing for results converting reservations to actual orders. All this for a vehicle that won't get delivered for nearly another year. Tired of the marathon of waiting and waiting and waiting for Bronco. Can't remember the last time it's taken so long to get a vehicle into production. Maybe I can feel more enthused when they actually start scheduling orders and we get to a Job #1 Date.   

 

I mean, doesn't it take this long normally?  We just normally don't know about it 3 years in advance.

 

15 minutes ago, akirby said:


For export not for sale in NA.  

 

They're producing them overseas, though.

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Cancelled reservations or not, it's safe to say that every Bronco that MAP can produce in 2021 is already sold.  Merrill Lynch/Bank of America have already said the MAP will be a one billion dollar profit plant in 2021.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

I mean, doesn't it take this long normally?  We just normally don't know about it 3 years in advance.

 

I think it is taking a little longer than normal, which is understandable if you look at the attention to detail and all the features available day one.   But it's also true that it was hyped by Fields WAY too early.

 

3 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

They're producing them overseas, though.

 

There was talk of being able to export them from Canada to central/latin/south america.

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Posted (edited)

Ford is in a unique position right now... if they put the same synergy into the next gen Ranger that they did in the Bronco, they have the opportunity to establish it as another long term market leader along with Bronco and F-Series.  Ranger is already doing well as a quick transplant, but it could handily blow the competition away if it incorporates many of the features and inovations from the Bronco and new F150.  If they play their cards right, I can see the need for an additional plant or dedicated Bronco and Ranger plants in the future. 

Edited by CoolScoop

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Reservations also gauge interest in colors, models and option packages which can be very important for production planning.

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26 minutes ago, akirby said:

Could you imagine the panic right now with Bronco buyers if they didn’t have a reservation and we’instead trying to order through a dealer and having to worry about dealer allocation in addition to addendums, etc.

Im still not convinced allocation wont come into play, and Im 100% certain some dealers WILL put addendums on their allotment...

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3 hours ago, akirby said:

I think it depends on how much fleet business they want to go after with Ranger and what's needed for Amarok production in North America.   Assuming  3 shifts could do 350K, I could see 200K Broncos and 150K Rangers sustained with mostly higher end retail sales.   If you went to another plant could they add another 100K of volume between the 2 and if you could would it be worth the investment to just run one shift in a 2nd plant?   Obviously if Bronco sales go through the roof and/or they need the extra capacity for Amarok and/or exports then it's an easier decision.

 

It would be a much easier decision if they could co-exist in somewhere like Oakville with other non-Ranger based products.

 

I think the calculation changes dramatically if you can build Ranger and F-150 on the same line... 

 

Right now, there is two dedicated F-150 lines, one Ranger/Bronco line, and one Superduty/Expedition line. If (and a big if) Ford thinks there is another combined 200k volume in BOF trucks, they may be inclined to convert one more plant to build it. Oakville will be a prime candidate. 

 

The scenario will necessary involve the following:

1. F-150 and Expedition becomes global and Ford actually tries to stitch together 40 or 50k volume from tiny markets all over the world the way Toyota does it with Land Cruiser. A lot of Ford international subsidiaries have been asking for F-150 but historically, it hasn't been profitable for Ford to do it. I think it is within reason to think with adequate support, you can grow F-150 (and Expedition to an extent) volume substantially in Australia, Southern Africa, China, and South America. RHD investment continues to really vex Ford though.

2. Maintain and grow F-Series (not just F-150) volume in the US. How much volume can the EV add? Does Ford go all in on PHEV for next gen? etc.

3. Bigger push to expand Ranger line up in the US and really try to conquest Tacoma sales rather than trying to grow the segment.

4. Introduce Everest to North America to really go after 4Runner and the upcoming new Land Cruiser which is supposedly downsizing and PHEV. 

5. Produce Amarok in North America.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Deanh said:

Im still not convinced allocation wont come into play,

 

Well it won't unless Ford is lying because they've said you can pick your dealer and Reservations will be built before dealer stock.  I don't see any wiggle room there.   I'm sure they'll make up for any shortfalls with specific dealers by giving them more dealer stock later or with other vehicles.

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3 minutes ago, bzcat said:

 

I think the calculation changes dramatically if you can build Ranger and F-150 on the same line... 

 

Right now, there is two dedicated F-150 lines, one Ranger/Bronco line, and one Superduty/Expedition line. If (and a big if) Ford thinks there is another combined 200k volume in BOF trucks, they may be inclined to convert one more plant to build it. Oakville will be a prime candidate. 

 

The scenario will necessary involve the following:

1. F-150 and Expedition becomes global and Ford actually tries to stitch together 40 or 50k volume from tiny markets all over the world the way Toyota does it with Land Cruiser. A lot of Ford international subsidiaries have been asking for F-150 but historically, it hasn't been profitable for Ford to do it. I think it is within reason to think with adequate support, you can grow F-150 (and Expedition to an extent) volume substantially in Australia, Southern Africa, China, and South America. RHD investment continues to really vex Ford though.

2. Maintain and grow F-Series (not just F-150) volume in the US. How much volume can the EV add? Does Ford go all in on PHEV for next gen? etc.

3. Bigger push to expand Ranger line up in the US and really try to conquest Tacoma sales rather than trying to grow the segment.

4. Introduce Everest to North America to really go after 4Runner and the upcoming new Land Cruiser which is supposedly downsizing and PHEV. 

5. Produce Amarok in North America.

 

 

 

Interesting concept.  Had not thought about Everest.   A third plant that could build F150/Superduty/Expy/Navi/Bronco/Ranger would be ideal if it's technically feasible.

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4 hours ago, akirby said:

I think it depends on how much fleet business they want to go after with Ranger and what's needed for Amarok production in North America.   Assuming  3 shifts could do 350K, I could see 200K Broncos and 150K Rangers sustained with mostly higher end retail sales.   If you went to another plant could they add another 100K of volume between the 2 and if you could would it be worth the investment to just run one shift in a 2nd plant?   Obviously if Bronco sales go through the roof and/or they need the extra capacity for Amarok and/or exports then it's an easier decision.

 

It would be a much easier decision if they could co-exist in somewhere like Oakville with other non-Ranger based products.


Amarok is not coming to North America. Ford made VW agree to that in their negotiations. 

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1 hour ago, Deanh said:

Ranger fleet business will increase substantially if Ford offers alternate ( read cheap naturally aspirated ) drivetrains

 


I that's happening with this generation. They’re just going to ride it out until the redesign. All focus is on Bronco right now. 

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1 hour ago, akirby said:


I’m talking about single cabs, flatbeds, cheaper engines, etc.  - targeted specifically to large fleets.  I don’t think they need to do it or even want to do it though.


Ford does offer Ranger in chassis cab (super cab only). I believe it's listed as box delete in the order guide. Haven't seen too many of them roll through but it does happen occasionally. Yet to see one in the wild. 

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7 minutes ago, fuzzymoomoo said:


Amarok is not coming to North America. Ford made VW agree to that in their negotiations. 


Export from Canada potentially not NA sales.

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31 minutes ago, akirby said:

 

Interesting concept.  Had not thought about Everest.   A third plant that could build F150/Superduty/Expy/Navi/Bronco/Ranger would be ideal if it's technically feasible.


You have Ohio that's pretty much a catch all truck plant. It would be weird as hell to see heavy trucks, super duty's and Rangers on the same line but that's where your overflow plant could be since the startup/retooling costs would be lowest. 

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2 minutes ago, akirby said:


Export from Canada potentially not NA sales.


If anything, export to Mexico. I don't think VW sells Amarok in Canada currently. I'm just not sure Ford wants to deal with that at any of their US plants. Been there done that with Mazda back when FRAP was Auto Alliance. 

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They must be able to build rivited aluminum body models on the same line as welded steel body models because Super Duty converted to aluminum for the 17 MY and Expy/Navi didn't convert until the 18 MY.

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1 hour ago, fuzzymoomoo said:


I that's happening with this generation. They’re just going to ride it out until the redesign. All focus is on Bronco right now. 

I don't expect anything till the re-design....trucks doing pretty well as is...but numbers would improve with powertrain ( trans ) choices...

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, akirby said:

 

Well it won't unless Ford is lying because they've said you can pick your dealer and Reservations will be built before dealer stock.  I don't see any wiggle room there.   I'm sure they'll make up for any shortfalls with specific dealers by giving them more dealer stock later or with other vehicles.

yep...they've ALWAYS stood by what they've stated...Raptor allocation based on turn and earn anyone ?...LMAO...FACT...they have had, and always will give preferential treatment to specific dealers....aka the ones that sell the most units...irrespective of any of the parameters they "enforce"...for example CSI etc ….so pardon my skepticism...

Edited by Deanh

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11 minutes ago, Deanh said:

I don't expect anything till the re-design....trucks doing pretty well as is...but numbers would improve with powertrain ( trans ) choices...


This is one of those rare times where Ford has a plan and actually sticks to it. 

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7 minutes ago, Deanh said:

yep...they've ALWAYS stood by what they've stated...Raptor allocation based on turn and earn anyone ?...LMAO...FACT...they have had, and always will give preferential treatment to specific dealers....aka the ones that sell the most units...irrespective of any of the parameters they "enforce"...for example CSI etc ….so pardon my skepticism...


Did you ever get that single cab work truck you ordered years ago? 😂

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2 hours ago, akirby said:

 

I think it is taking a little longer than normal, which is understandable if you look at the attention to detail and all the features available day one.   But it's also true that it was hyped by Fields WAY too early.

 

 

There was talk of being able to export them from Canada to central/latin/south america.

 

Right, it could have been a bit longer than normal.  My point was that we don't normally have them announced 3 years in advance (unless you're GM with the Camaro) - that's what's making it seem so long.  We'll be at 4 years by the time they actually show up.  If they hadn't done that and we only heard about it a year ago, it'd seem short - only 2 years.

 

2 hours ago, akirby said:

Reservations also gauge interest in colors, models and option packages which can be very important for production planning.

 

For Bronco, the only thing the reservations would help in that regard is models (and even that is guesstimated because reservation holders don't know what's available on what trim).   You weren't given the choice of color or any option packages with Bronco's reservation (unlike Mach-E).  It was pick a trim and dealer and pay.

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11 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

 

For Bronco, the only thing the reservations would help in that regard is models (and even that is guesstimated because reservation holders don't know what's available on what trim).   You weren't given the choice of color or any option packages with Bronco's reservation (unlike Mach-E).  It was pick a trim and dealer and pay.


I thought it was 2 door/4 door, series (first edition, badlands, etc) and color?

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Just now, akirby said:


I thought it was 2 door/4 door, series (first edition, badlands, etc) and color?


At least they can gauge interest in 2 doors and which trims even without color.  Color is pretty easy to change anyway.

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