kyle Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 On 11/15/2020 at 1:53 PM, jpd80 said: One thing is for sure, Ford doesn't reverse a decision like this without already feeling some financial hurt from missing out on hybrid/ PHEV sales. They're probably already banging up hard against supply limits that underestimated actual demand. Not the first time this has happened by the way, lesson not learned. I think this comes only with a change in leadership. Not sure This happens with Hackett still in charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rperez817 Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, bzcat said: BYD is the only car company in the world that makes batteries 100% in house, which makes sense because it started as a battery company. They started making ICE cars themselves 15 years ago to support its nascent EV car and bus business. Toyota announced a joint venture with BYD for BEV R&D earlier this year. Toyota is behind all the other incumbent automakers with BEV development right now, so BYD's expertise will be very beneficial for Toyota. https://global.toyota/en/newsroom/corporate/32126024.html Edited November 17, 2020 by rperez817 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 2 hours ago, kyle said: I think this comes only with a change in leadership. Not sure This happens with Hackett still in charge. Yeah, sometimes the chief is so preoccupied with channeling efforts in one direction, he loses sight of the finer details that can paint Ford into a corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurgeh Posted December 9, 2020 Share Posted December 9, 2020 Here's why Hackett originally wanted to stick for now with purchasing batteries from third parties. The technology is advancing so fast it is hard to know where exactly to invest in inhouse production (or joint venturing). It is a tough choice, but for a while it will probably be more risky depending solely on purchasing from other manufacturers than on making the wrong technology bet. Look how fast QuantumScape thinks they will be bringing this to market: 2024. ----------------- QuantumScape, a San Jose-based startup backed by Volkswagen and Bill Gates, is finally breaking its silence. In a virtual “battery day” event for investors, the recently public company announced that its “solid state” batteries for electric vehicles will charge faster, hold more power, and last longer than traditional EV batteries... QuantumScape says its solid-state batteries will represent a significant improvement over conventional lithium-ion batteries, enabling electric vehicles that can travel 80 percent further than an electric vehicle with a traditional battery. There are other advantages too. They retain more than 80 percent of their capacity after 800 charging cycles. They’re noncombustible. And they’ll have volumetric energy density of more than 1,000 watt-hours per liter at the cell level, which is nearly double the density of top-rate commercial lithium-ion packs... QuantumScape says its batteries last a real long time, perhaps “hundreds of thousands of miles of driving,” by eliminating the “side reaction” between the liquid electrolyte and the carbon in the anode of the conventional lithium-ion cells. And the batteries will charge at a much faster rate too, up to 80 percent capacity in just 15 minutes, an amount that typically takes 40 minutes or longer... QuantumScape, which was spun out from Stanford University in 2010, has formed a joint venture with VW to produce solid-state battery cells for the German automaker’s electric vehicles, and eventually for other carmakers. The deal isn’t exclusive: VW’s recently released ID 4 electric SUV will initially use batteries made by South Korea’s LG Chem, before eventually shifting to ones produced by SK Innovation... Singh said he’s aware that his competition will be fierce. But there’s no reason why QuantumScape’s current rivals won’t become future customers. “Tesla, probably even more than any other company, is completely opportunistic,” Singh said. “If this battery works, they’re gonna want to use it.” https://www.theverge.com/2020/12/8/22158573/quantumscape-solid-state-battery-ev-range-charge-vw?fbclid=IwAR1U0CFZVdcgxvvyt6uZnJdsXRcNLGSuHWy7-Q7avdnQa52OKlbhw9EIVVY 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted December 10, 2020 Author Share Posted December 10, 2020 I don't know enough about battery construction one way or the other, but isn't it possible that existing battery plants can be adapted to manufacture technology like this (assuming it's not locked up by patents)? Otherwise, all of the battery plants already built and being constructed become obsolete overnight - well, in 4 years if their time line plays out. Does that make any business sense for the battery companies - to invest billion$ in new plants that will be obsoleted? That doesn't make sense to me (although as noted at the beginning of this post - what do I know?). It seems more likely to me that the existing plants could be adapted, much in the same way that auto plants undergo changes for new models - sometimes those changeovers happen over a weekend when the model update is minor, sometimes the plant is gutted and totally new equipment is purchased and brought in and the change takes months. I would think that car companies, because of their familiarity with this type of change, would be more comfortable with the idea of updating/upgrading their battery construction should technology or the market dictate the need. Otherwise, Ford will still be building Model A or T's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 Battery plants?????...look to the epa.....the problem is at times the political situation in the congo (cobalt - lithium).....standard lead battery for auto of which only 2 manufacturers remain (johnson controls and exide).....lead smelters of which there may not be one left in the usa (yea, epa again - cost to everything)....nothing grows free on trees....there is always ramifications for replacement technology as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurgeh Posted December 11, 2020 Share Posted December 11, 2020 Now Toyota says their solid state battery will also be on the street in the next few years, with a prototype out in 2021. https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Technology/Toyota-s-game-changing-solid-state-battery-en-route-for-2021-debut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Lover Posted December 11, 2020 Author Share Posted December 11, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, Gurgeh said: Now Toyota says their solid state battery will also be on the street in the next few years, with a prototype out in 2021. https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Technology/Toyota-s-game-changing-solid-state-battery-en-route-for-2021-debut QuantumScape claim to be right on their heels, hopefully one of these ops come through with a true breakthrough product that can be commercialized. Toyota has been working on their version for several years. Edited December 11, 2020 by Harley Lover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.