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42 minutes ago, jcartwright99 said:

Are people still bitching about 75 Mach E’s in customer hands being recalled?

 

Here: https://jalopnik.com/kia-tells-owners-of-nearly-380-000-recalled-cars-to-par-1846438300

 

proof that this doesn’t just happen to Ford


Just to clear a few points up:

 

-The Mustang Mach E is an electric vehicle designed and built by the Ford Motor Company. 


-This area of the forum is for discussing things related to the Ford Motor Company.  
 

-Ford issued a recall of the Ford designed and built Mustang Mach E.

 

-Why would we discuss a Kia recall in a thread about the Ford designed and built Mustang Mach E in a forum where people discuss Ford Motor Company?

 

-Nobody, not a single person, in the history of this forum or any forum on the internet has ever said that recalls only happen to Ford Motor.  
 

-The last person to bring up the Mach E recall was you.  Prior to that you have to scroll up about 12 posts to fine the last one to talk about the Mach E recall. 
 

 

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I own a 3.5 L Ecoboost SHO with 68K + miles. Never an engine problem. Have a 2.3 L in a Mustang with 25K miles, again no problems. Unfortunately know folks with 1.5 L and 2.0 L in Escape with problems. All I know were covered. But it is a damage to Ford's reputation. 

 

Water leaks are taken very seriously. Windshield prep, sealant, installation are done by robots. No, that doesn't make it perfect. I can think of more than a handful of critical or significant characteristics related to windshield install and retention. Probably more, since I retired and am relying on memory. Spent more than a few times locked in a trunk, or crawling in parts of the vehicle I hope you never see. Mostly new models, doing verification that water isn't intruding or some revision corrects an issue in an early build before the 1st customer sees it.

 

Once again, observations during my career. Not speaking for Ford Motor Company.

 

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2 hours ago, FR739 said:


Just to clear a few points up:

 

-The Mustang Mach E is an electric vehicle designed and built by the Ford Motor Company. 


-This area of the forum is for discussing things related to the Ford Motor Company.  
 

-Ford issued a recall of the Ford designed and built Mustang Mach E.

 

-Why would we discuss a Kia recall in a thread about the Ford designed and built Mustang Mach E in a forum where people discuss Ford Motor Company?

 

-Nobody, not a single person, in the history of this forum or any forum on the internet has ever said that recalls only happen to Ford Motor.  
 

-The last person to bring up the Mach E recall was you.  Prior to that you have to scroll up about 12 posts to fine the last one to talk about the Mach E recall. 
 

 

I’m fully aware of the forum and how it operates. No need to act holier than than thou.

 

However, the topic on this thread is the Mach E, is it not? I can’t help this has devolved into bringing up other Ford recalls. Whether you want to pretend that the underlying thought from some in this thread is to shame Ford for having recalls isn’t happening is entirely up to you. I don’t think you are as daft as that but it’s possible.

 

The specific reason I brought up the Kia recall is perspective. Lots of bitching and moaning about a hundreds/thousands here and there recalls from Ford in a vacuum. Completely dismissing that this happens to EVERY auto manufacturer. Yes perfection would be nice, but no manufacturer is perfect. You claim nobody is saying that but a few rusty axles and suspension pieces sure has some here rattled.

 

You can share your feelings all you want but if you want to play dumb on what’s going on in this thread and don’t want to read between the lines,  maybe you need to go back to the children’s table.

 

Also, I’m glad you can speak for the all of Internet. We are so privileged to have you here.

 

 

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2 hours ago, jcartwright99 said:

However, the topic on this thread is the Mach E, is it not? I can’t help this has devolved into bringing up other Ford recalls.


I think it’s entirely reasonable to be frustrated with the lack of quality seen in Ford vehicles and talk about that when a new recall or quality drops seemingly every week.  Their warranty costs are $2 billion dollars higher than GM and Farley has stated it’s a priority of his to get that fixed and bring those costs down.  Again nobody has dismissed that this happens to other manufacturers.  Not a single person. 
 

To use a sports analogy, when your team sucks or has a bad season, do you just ignore it and attack anyone that points it out?  Do you go on and on about how 4 other teams were just as bad or worse or how the same thing happened to them?  Is it MORE frustrating when it’s your team?  No you talk about the issues because it’s relevant.  
 

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford.  Lastly if you don’t like the topic just move on. 
 

 

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6 hours ago, FR739 said:


I think it’s entirely reasonable to be frustrated with the lack of quality seen in Ford vehicles and talk about that when a new recall or quality drops seemingly every week.  Their warranty costs are $2 billion dollars higher than GM and Farley has stated it’s a priority of his to get that fixed and bring those costs down.  Again nobody has dismissed that this happens to other manufacturers.  Not a single person. 
 

To use a sports analogy, when your team sucks or has a bad season, do you just ignore it and attack anyone that points it out?  Do you go on and on about how 4 other teams were just as bad or worse or how the same thing happened to them?  Is it MORE frustrating when it’s your team?  No you talk about the issues because it’s relevant.  
 

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford.  Lastly if you don’t like the topic just move on. 
 

 

 

 

You made some excellent points.

 

 

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8 hours ago, FR739 said:


I think it’s entirely reasonable to be frustrated with the lack of quality seen in Ford vehicles and talk about that when a new recall or quality drops seemingly every week.  Their warranty costs are $2 billion dollars higher than GM and Farley has stated it’s a priority of his to get that fixed and bring those costs down.  Again nobody has dismissed that this happens to other manufacturers.  Not a single person. 
 

To use a sports analogy, when your team sucks or has a bad season, do you just ignore it and attack anyone that points it out?  Do you go on and on about how 4 other teams were just as bad or worse or how the same thing happened to them?  Is it MORE frustrating when it’s your team?  No you talk about the issues because it’s relevant.  
 

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford.  Lastly if you don’t like the topic just move on. 
 

 

 

The problem is that in this case Ford is actually doing things the right way.  They identified a potential problem very quickly and voluntarily issued a recall when they could have handled it via a service program or ignored it.   This seems to be a change for the good. 

 

Instead they're accused of "passing the buck" and "not taking responsibility" or that the recall wasn't voluntary.   That's the part that isn't right or fair.

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8 hours ago, FR739 said:


I think it’s entirely reasonable to be frustrated with the lack of quality seen in Ford vehicles and talk about that when a new recall or quality drops seemingly every week.  Their warranty costs are $2 billion dollars higher than GM and Farley has stated it’s a priority of his to get that fixed and bring those costs down.  Again nobody has dismissed that this happens to other manufacturers.  Not a single person. 
 

To use a sports analogy, when your team sucks or has a bad season, do you just ignore it and attack anyone that points it out?  Do you go on and on about how 4 other teams were just as bad or worse or how the same thing happened to them?  Is it MORE frustrating when it’s your team?  No you talk about the issues because it’s relevant.  
 

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford.  Lastly if you don’t like the topic just move on. 
 

 

 

As a LONG suffering Lions fans, I totally get the sports analogy. I am not saying dismiss the quality issues at all. How Ford handled the Focus/Fiesta trans was about as wrong as you could get. The Explorer launch was botched. The Chicago plant and possibly engineering can't seem to solve the Explorer puzzle right now which is absolutely frustrating.

 

However it appears the Mach E, Bronco Sport, and F-150 fall into different approach from the Ford end. As Akirby has pointed out, they are being aggressive in addressing these. I'd much rather have them address immediately than sit on it until it grows into a much larger problem. I think this represents a change in approach that we haven't seen from Ford. Not sure if this has to do with Farley or not.

 

Other manufactures may not issue a recall for these small amounts of vehicles with this issues. Just rectify the issue on vehicles going forward and deal with the ones that come in (fix or legal). Doing this keeps their recalls low and name out of the press. Ford has taken the opposite approach as of late. Which means their name is in the news and but in the long term they should be in a better place.

 

Ideally, Ford should do everything they can to prevent these issues from happening (knowing that there will inevitably be some that pop up). Are they doing that? Are they beating their suppliers up so much on price quality is suffering? I don't have those answer. What I can say is, I don't like recalls but I do appreciate the pro active approach they are taking when an issue gets discovered. Ultimately, I believe this pro active approach will help Ford out in the long term.

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1 hour ago, jcartwright99 said:

Ideally, Ford should do everything they can to prevent these issues from happening (knowing that there will inevitably be some that pop up). Are they doing that? Are they beating their suppliers up so much on price quality is suffering? I don't have those answer. What I can say is, I don't like recalls but I do appreciate the pro active approach they are taking when an issue gets discovered. Ultimately, I believe this pro active approach will help Ford out in the long term.


First my sympathies on your suffering.  But hey you stick with em right?  You proved my point 😁

 

I think the root issue here isn’t that there’s a recall.  It’s easy to play semantics and get caught in the weeds about TSBs, voluntary versus involuntary, how many units were affected, etc. The real issue is why are these things occurring so frequently at Ford?  More specifically, why are they happening to vehicle lines that typically don’t see issues like this?  To me that proves there is a culture of cost cutting within Ford and as JPD put it in another thread, they are trying to cut their way to profitability.  That’s never a path to success.  And that’s why it’s frustrating.  Why spend money on a folding shifter when you could have thrown your suppliers a few pennies to properly coat underbody components and simply see one of your existing rotary shifters that takes up far less space? (disclaimer for those who need it that is one of many hypothetical situations resulting in the F150 rust issue. Please don’t attack me for not supporting my claim with documents and the results of my own analysis of all affected F150s).  

 

3 hours ago, 1999 White C5 Coupe said:

 

 

You made some excellent points.

 

 

 
Thank you!

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, FR739 said:


I think it’s entirely reasonable to be frustrated with the lack of quality seen in Ford vehicles and talk about that when a new recall or quality drops seemingly every week.  Their warranty costs are $2 billion dollars higher than GM and Farley has stated it’s a priority of his to get that fixed and bring those costs down.  Again nobody has dismissed that this happens to other manufacturers.  Not a single person. 
 

To use a sports analogy, when your team sucks or has a bad season, do you just ignore it and attack anyone that points it out?  Do you go on and on about how 4 other teams were just as bad or worse or how the same thing happened to them?  Is it MORE frustrating when it’s your team?  No you talk about the issues because it’s relevant.  
 

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford.  Lastly if you don’t like the topic just move on. 
 

 

 

Clearly you're not a sports fan.......that's exactly what you do!   😛 😛 😛 :hysterical:

Edited by rmc523

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41 minutes ago, FR739 said:


First my sympathies on your suffering.  But hey you stick with em right?  You proved my point 😁

 

I think the root issue here isn’t that there’s a recall.  It’s easy to play semantics and get caught in the weeds about TSBs, voluntary versus involuntary, how many units were affected, etc. The real issue is why are these things occurring so frequently at Ford?  More specifically, why are they happening to vehicle lines that typically don’t see issues like this?  To me that proves there is a culture of cost cutting within Ford and as JPD put it in another thread, they are trying to cut their way to profitability.  That’s never a path to success.  And that’s why it’s frustrating.  Why spend money on a folding shifter when you could have thrown your suppliers a few pennies to properly coat underbody components and simply see one of your existing rotary shifters that takes up far less space? (disclaimer for those who need it that is one of many hypothetical situations resulting in the F150 rust issue. Please don’t attack me for not supporting my claim with documents and the results of my own analysis of all affected F150s).  

 

 
Thank you!

 

Reality is, there's clearly an issue, as Farley pointed it out as a point to focus on to reduce warranty costs.

 

It's also true that any recalls occurring now have been part of previous "orders" of parts before Farley's efforts, and we can only hope that going forward he'll spend more on the front end (suppliers) to save on the back end (warranty costs, recalls, etc).

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Posted (edited)
On 3/8/2021 at 12:29 PM, 92merc said:

Tesla had been CR darling for reliability.  Some of us on BON had been calling that BS.  CR is finally agreeing.

 

Tesla isn't and has never been "CR darling for reliability"; the brand has always rated average or below average in CR's reliability survey. There's no "BS" for members of this forum to call on this.

Edited by rperez817

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50 minutes ago, rmc523 said:

 

Clearly you're not a sports fan.......that's exactly what you do!   😛 😛 😛 :hysterical:


So you’re sayin Denial is not just a river in Egypt? 😉

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25 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

Tesla isn't and has never been "CR darling for reliability"; the brand has always rated average or below average in CR's reliability survey. There's no "BS" for members of this forum to call on this.

 

I just have a hard time putting much faith in information provided by an outfit that rated a car 103 out of 100 on their own scale.

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1 hour ago, rmc523 said:

 

I just have a hard time putting much faith in information provided by an outfit that rated a car 103 out of 100 on their own scale.

 

Especially when they simultaneously dinged the Explorer for having too many functions on the touch screen.

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1 hour ago, rmc523 said:

I just have a hard time putting much faith in information provided by an outfit that rated a car 103 out of 100 on their own scale.

 

That was the Consumer Reports road test score achieved by Tesla Model S P85D in 2013, not reliability rating. The road score rating has since been recalibrated. CR's road test score for Model S now is 97, and the overall rating is 70 (due to below average reliability).

 

Explanation. How Did Consumer Reports Score the Tesla Model S P85D? - Consumer Reports

 

 

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13 hours ago, FR739 said:

Ford has a lot of good going for it.  The BS, the Bronco, most of the F150, the Mach E, and Lincoln builds some very nice vehicles these days.  But Ford is also having a lot of quality issues and it’s ok to talk about it.  It doesn’t mean that people think only Ford has issues or that people’s only intent is to shame Ford. 

 

Excellent post FR739 sir. You are correct on all counts. Speaking of good things for Ford, they have relatively high owner loyalty. In fact IHS Markit gave Ford brand the "Overall Loyalty to Make" award for 2020. That means that even though Ford products have lots of quality problems, they also provide customers with other things they appreciate such as styling, performance, U.S. domestic company, etc. Or it could mean that Ford has a lot of "sheeple" customers like me who will buy a vehicle simply because it has the blue oval on it.

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44 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

That was the Consumer Reports road test score achieved by Tesla Model S P85D in 2013, not reliability rating. The road score rating has since been recalibrated. CR's road test score for Model S now is 97, and the overall rating is 70 (due to below average reliability).

 

Explanation. How Did Consumer Reports Score the Tesla Model S P85D? - Consumer Reports

 

 

 

Missing The Point Of EdTech | There is no box

 

I know exactly what it was, and that they "fixed" it.

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It's been pointed out that too many topics are getting off topic lately, so I'm closing this one.  All on topic points have been made several times already.

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