blksn8k2 Posted June 16, 2023 Author Share Posted June 16, 2023 17 minutes ago, tbone said: Apparently I’m blind and missed that one on their website. I don’t disagree with you that it is a nice turnkey package, but I can be a cheap ass and like to maximize my dollars, and I think this truck could be done a lot cheaper if you chose to do so with the base Tremor. The one downside is they use the base Tremor, which doesn’t have the 4A setting for 4x4, based on Ford’s build and price. In order to get that you have to add the High Package which is $7500 and if you add the trailer tow, sunroof, and tailgate step, your sticker will be $73,665, instead of $62955 they started with. I would also like more details on their Rough Country lift. There could be a fair amount of money involved in that pending on the lift type. Whether it has coilovers or if it’s a basic leveling kit, would need to be known to understand the value. I could get the high package truck for invoice at my dealer have them install the Ford Performance or Roush supercharger, and then get the 37” wheels and tires, a lift kit, and the flares and hood scoop, for very close to that price. There is a lot of interior fluff in that package I could do without. The suspension system is where you could go crazy and either spend a lot of money or go basic. I’m curious if you could get a Ford factory extended warranty on the motor since it is a Ford installed product. That would be sweet but I’m guessing it isn’t available on Ford Performance aftermarket items beyond the 3/36. I'm with you and already considered the 4A issue. I've been corresponding with that dealer today and have asked them to quote a Tremor with the factory options I mentioned before and then the same truck with their "R" package. I also gave them photos, mileage and VIN for my current truck. I realize it's probably an exorcise in futility but what the heck. I also wonder if they start with the base Tremor because adding the 4A setting might be problematic with that much power? Does the Raptor R use the AWD transfer case? Let's see... which would I rather have, AWD or 705hp? Hmmmmm? ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 25 minutes ago, blksn8k2 said: I'm with you and already considered the 4A issue. I've been corresponding with that dealer today and have asked them to quote a Tremor with the factory options I mentioned before and then the same truck with their "R" package. I also gave them photos, mileage and VIN for my current truck. I realize it's probably an exorcise in futility but what the heck. I also wonder if they start with the base Tremor because adding the 4A setting might be problematic with that much power? Does the Raptor R use the AWD transfer case? Let's see... which would I rather have, AWD or 705hp? Hmmmmm? ? My Raptor has 4A and as far as I know, the R has it as well so you should’t have to compromise. I’ll be curious to know what they come back at your with. If you find out more about the suspension can you pass it on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 19, 2023 Author Share Posted June 19, 2023 What I would really like to do is order a Tremor with the High (402A?) package and the other options I want and then have whatever dealer I buy it from install just the Ford Performance Whipple supercharger kit. I'm not really interested in all the other stuff that comes with the FP700 package like the wheels, Borla exhaust, decals, etc. As tbone mentioned earlier the supercharger kit itself sells for $9500 + installation. If they can do that and still offer the factory 3/36 warranty that would be the way to go. If I decide I want different wheels, tires, suspension and exhaust I can do that later and probably for less than I would pay for that Tremor R package from Long McArthur. As tbone and fuzzy also mentioned, another option might be to go with the Roush '21-'23 5.0L supercharger kit which uses an Eaton TVS 2.65L blower and is the blower used by Long McArthur. That might be a little less expensive than the FP kit and it comes with the Roush 3/36 warranty. Ironically, adding a supercharger kit would most likely force me into running premium fuel which was one of my concerns with the Ranger Raptor. Turns out that was incorrect but the major difference here would be the 36 gal tank on the Tremor. I have to drive to the same larger towns anyway for groceries as I would for premium fuel but the larger tank would mean fewer trips. I've pretty much ruled out the RR anyway. All I would be gaining would be a slightly smaller footprint and a suspension I don't need that can't haul or tow what I do need a truck for. I might also take another run at the demo truck the local dealer has. If I can convince them to order and install the parts to add the tailgate step and Torsen front differential for the same deal they have already offered me I would have the truck I'm looking for. It's even the right color (Carbonized Gray Metallic). I could then add the SC, etc. as time and finances permit. That truck does not have the 2.0kW Pro-Power Onboard option but I don't think you can add a supercharger if you have the extra alternator, or at least that's what the Roush kit states. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 14 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: What I would really like to do is order a Tremor with the High (402A?) package and the other options I want and then have whatever dealer I buy it from install just the Ford Performance Whipple supercharger kit. I think this is your best bet. You get exactly what you want and not all the extra fluff that runs up the price. The Tremor suspension is nice so you very well may be satisfied with it. If not, you can do the upgrades and not have all that dealer profit built into it. When yo talked to Long McArthur did they give you any more specific info on their upgrades. I was just trying to understand the quality of product they built into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 19, 2023 Author Share Posted June 19, 2023 Well, the local dealer didn't bite on adding anything to their demo. However, they did offer me another $1000 for my trade and they lowered the price of their demo truck from $73,000 to $71,500. When you factor in the decrease in sales tax that you pay on the difference it works out to almost $2650 lower than their initial deal. But, it's still a used truck. My next option will probably be to have them give me a quote on ordering a Tremor High with the moonroof, towing package, Torsen front diff, and the bed utility package in lieu of the Pro-Power Onboard. The price for either of those last two is the same ($995) and you can't add the blower if you have the Pro-Power. I priced the tailgate step at Tasca Ford and the step assembly alone is more than the cost of the Bed Utility Package. Hopefully, they will keep my trade-in value the same as their last offer. I will probably then take that offer to the dealer I actually purchased my '18 from and see if they can beat it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 7 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: Well, the local dealer didn't bite on adding anything to their demo. However, they did offer me another $1000 for my trade and they lowered the price of their demo truck from $73,000 to $71,500. When you factor in the decrease in sales tax that you pay on the difference it works out to almost $2650 lower than their initial deal. But, it's still a used truck. My next option will probably be to have them give me a quote on ordering a Tremor High with the moonroof, towing package, Torsen front diff, and the bed utility package in lieu of the Pro-Power Onboard. The price for either of those last two is the same ($995) and you can't add the blower if you have the Pro-Power. I priced the tailgate step at Tasca Ford and the step assembly alone is more than the cost of the Bed Utility Package. Hopefully, they will keep my trade-in value the same as their last offer. I will probably then take that offer to the dealer I actually purchased my '18 from and see if they can beat it. If nobody wants to work with you and you wouldn’t mind a trip to eastern Iowa, my dealer will hook you up with a fantastic deal, which would likely be invoice on the truck and a very good trade. I have never been disappointed with any of my transactions there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 22, 2023 Author Share Posted June 22, 2023 On 6/19/2023 at 9:06 PM, tbone said: If nobody wants to work with you and you wouldn’t mind a trip to eastern Iowa, my dealer will hook you up with a fantastic deal, which would likely be invoice on the truck and a very good trade. I have never been disappointed with any of my transactions there. Thanks tbone. I'll definitely keep that in mind. I just spoke to a dealer that has a 402A Tremor in stock that was a customer order that did not sell. As a matter of fact, it just arrived on their lot last night. It has all of the options I want plus a couple more that I can live with. This is also a Roush dealer that can do either the Roush or the Whipple supercharger. They sell vehicles like that for MSRP plus the cost of the blower and installation. No markups. The MSRP on this one is $74,590 so with the cost of the Roush adding approximately $12k installed that would put the final price in the $87-88k range or slightly below the white Tremor R at Long McArthur in Kansas. Again this one has the $7525 402A package, moonroof, front axle Torsen diff, trailer tow package, interior work space, special order paint and the bed utility package which includes the tailgate step, but not L-M's suspension and wheel/tire upgrades. And it would have the smaller factory Tremor decals, not the gaudy L-M Tremor R stuff. I sent them photos of my '18 F-150 along with the current mileage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice-capades Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 12 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: Thanks tbone. I'll definitely keep that in mind. I just spoke to a dealer that has a 402A Tremor in stock that was a customer order that did not sell. As a matter of fact, it just arrived on their lot last night. It has all of the options I want plus a couple more that I can live with. This is also a Roush dealer that can do either the Roush or the Whipple supercharger. They sell vehicles like that for MSRP plus the cost of the blower and installation. No markups. The MSRP on this one is $74,590 so with the cost of the Roush adding approximately $12k installed that would put the final price in the $87-88k range or slightly below the white Tremor R at Long McArthur in Kansas. Again this one has the $7525 402A package, moonroof, front axle Torsen diff, trailer tow package, interior work space, special order paint and the bed utility package which includes the tailgate step, but not L-M's suspension and wheel/tire upgrades. And it would have the smaller factory Tremor decals, not the gaudy L-M Tremor R stuff. I sent them photos of my '18 F-150 along with the current mileage. There is no "special order paint" option for customer retail orders or stock orders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotRunrGuy Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 4 hours ago, ice-capades said: There is no "special order paint" option for customer retail orders or stock orders. Maybe he's referring to the $795 Azure Gray option? Which is kind of funny, since it's $995 on the MY24 Ranger B&P. HRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 23, 2023 Author Share Posted June 23, 2023 58 minutes ago, HotRunrGuy said: Maybe he's referring to the $795 Azure Gray option? Which is kind of funny, since it's $995 on the MY24 Ranger B&P. HRG This particular truck was supposedly a retail order that did not sell and was ordered in Star White Metallic Tricoat which is shown as a $795 option on the window sticker. Sorry if I used the wrong terminology. I'm not a car salesman. LOL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, blksn8k2 said: This particular truck was supposedly a retail order that did not sell and was ordered in Star White Metallic Tricoat which is shown as a $795 option on the window sticker. Sorry if I used the wrong terminology. I'm not a car salesman. LOL Special order implies custom paint which Ford doesn’t do. They just charge extra for some colors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 28, 2023 Author Share Posted June 28, 2023 Not really getting too much in the way of response from dealers. If I fill out an on-line inquiry on a dealer's website they might message and/or call me and ask what I'm looking for and then say "if you have any questions call me". Some have gone a little farther and asked me to send them info and photos of my potential trade (low mileage, loaded '18 F-150 XLT Supercrew 4x4) and I basically get no further response. I assume that's because I didn't drive 500 miles and walk in only to have them take my keys hostage for a couple of hours. I'm not too concerned about all that just yet though. It might actually be a good thing. I'm more than willing to wait and see what changes are coming for the '24 F-150. If I like what I see then I would probably order a '24. If not then there should still be a decent selection of '23 Tremors to choose from. Most larger dealers have more than one on hand right now and very few are including markups. Some are already offering discounts. I doubt it will ever be like the good old days when you could find some exceptional end of model year deals like I did when I bought the '18 but it can't hurt to wait and see how things shake out. It's not as if I need a new truck right this minute. With the overall crappy economy and high interest rates that could begin to put pressure on dealers to move unsold inventory. Those same issues could also convince me to just keep what I have and be happy that I won't have a car payment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 28, 2023 Share Posted June 28, 2023 5 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: Not really getting too much in the way of response from dealers. If I fill out an on-line inquiry on a dealer's website they might message and/or call me and ask what I'm looking for and then say "if you have any questions call me". Some have gone a little farther and asked me to send them info and photos of my potential trade (low mileage, loaded '18 F-150 XLT Supercrew 4x4) and I basically get no further response. I assume that's because I didn't drive 500 miles and walk in only to have them take my keys hostage for a couple of hours. I'm not too concerned about all that just yet though. It might actually be a good thing. I'm more than willing to wait and see what changes are coming for the '24 F-150. If I like what I see then I would probably order a '24. If not then there should still be a decent selection of '23 Tremors to choose from. Most larger dealers have more than one on hand right now and very few are including markups. Some are already offering discounts. I doubt it will ever be like the good old days when you could find some exceptional end of model year deals like I did when I bought the '18 but it can't hurt to wait and see how things shake out. It's not as if I need a new truck right this minute. With the overall crappy economy and high interest rates that could begin to put pressure on dealers to move unsold inventory. Those same issues could also convince me to just keep what I have and be happy that I won't have a car payment. Well PM me if you want to talk to my guy. It will be a no BS deal. However, I can understand waiting to see more details on the 24. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted June 28, 2023 Author Share Posted June 28, 2023 16 hours ago, tbone said: Well PM me if you want to talk to my guy. It will be a no BS deal. However, I can understand waiting to see more details on the 24. What I'm hearing is that '23 F-150 production will end sometime in Nov which means that '24 order banks should open about two months prior to that which would be sometime in Sep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted June 29, 2023 Share Posted June 29, 2023 8 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: What I'm hearing is that '23 F-150 production will end sometime in Nov which means that '24 order banks should open about two months prior to that which would be sometime in Sep. I’m looking forward to seeing the changes to the 2024. I think they may be worthwhile to wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted July 6, 2023 Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 On 6/29/2023 at 2:16 AM, tbone said: I’m looking forward to seeing the changes to the 2024. I think they may be worthwhile to wait. Agreed. From what I am seeing as far as dealer inventories of the '23s are concerned it probably makes sense to wait for the '24 reveal. If I'm not that impressed with the '24 there should still be a decent number of '23s to choose from and perhaps at a discount. Not holding my breath on that last part though. I finally got a callback today from the dealer with the '23 Star White Tremor. The main thing I was interested in was their installed cost of the Roush supercharger which they quoted as $13,500. That price seems high since you can buy that same F-150 kit at Summit Racing for $8649.99. $4850 sounds a bit ridiculous for installation. The Ford Performance guy at Carlisle said you should expect to pay around $1400 for installation of their Whipple kit at a Ford dealership and that kit includes a helluva lot more than just the supercharger. Even if his numbers were a little low that's still a huge difference from what this particular Roush dealer quoted. I then contacted Beechmont Ford in Ohio which is another Roush dealer who quoted installed prices of $11,450 for the Roush kit and $12,200 for the Ford Performance kit. That sounds a little more realistic. The dealer with the Star White truck also gave me a ballpark trade-in value for my '18 which is based on a national average that most dealers use and I already knew the MSRP of the '23 from the window sticker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 Speaking of '24 F-150 changes, this article on Ford Authority has probably been posted elsewhere already but it does have Tremor specific spy photos. I like the new front bumper better but I will need to see the new grille design in a more finished and fully painted form before passing judgement on that. https://fordauthority.com/2023/07/2024-ford-f-150-tremor-shows-off-new-grille-and-front-bumper/ One possible interior change that I have seen mentioned for '24 is the switch to a "portrait" style infotainment screen. I'm not sure what other changes to the instrument panel would be included with that but I am not in favor of putting all of the audio and HVAC controls on a touch screen. I prefer physical knobs simply because they are less of a distraction than having to take your eyes off the road to adjust things like heating or AC settings on a touch screen. Most audio controls are already on the steering wheel so that wouldn't bother me as much if the manual dash mounted controls went away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 54 minutes ago, blksn8k2 said: Speaking of '24 F-150 changes, this article on Ford Authority has probably been posted elsewhere already but it does have Tremor specific spy photos. I like the new front bumper better but I will need to see the new grille design in a more finished and fully painted form before passing judgement on that. https://fordauthority.com/2023/07/2024-ford-f-150-tremor-shows-off-new-grille-and-front-bumper/ One possible interior change that I have seen mentioned for '24 is the switch to a "portrait" style infotainment screen. I'm not sure what other changes to the instrument panel would be included with that but I am not in favor of putting all of the audio and HVAC controls on a touch screen. I prefer physical knobs simply because they are less of a distraction than having to take your eyes off the road to adjust things like heating or AC settings on a touch screen. Most audio controls are already on the steering wheel so that wouldn't bother me as much if the manual dash mounted controls went away. https://blueovalforums.com/forums/index.php?/topic/75326-2024-f-150-tremor-with-no-camo/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 18 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: I finally got a callback today from the dealer with the '23 Star White Tremor. The main thing I was interested in was their installed cost of the Roush supercharger which they quoted as $13,500. I then contacted Beechmont Ford in Ohio which is another Roush dealer who quoted installed prices of $11,450 for the Roush kit and $12,200 for the Ford Performance kit. That sounds a little more realistic. Apparently the Star White dealer was looking to make some money on you with their pricing, which is a red flag since their pricing was out of the norm. The Beechmont prices seem more realistic. Do you know why a person would choose one kit over another? Have you seen any comparisons? I would be inclined to buy the Ford kit, since it’s a Ford product, and so they couldn’t use the kit for warranty refusal purposes. Perhaps it doesn’t matter though since Roush is an authorized aftermarket manufacturer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 2 hours ago, blksn8k2 said: Speaking of '24 F-150 changes, this article on Ford Authority has probably been posted elsewhere already but it does have Tremor specific spy photos. I like the new front bumper better but I will need to see the new grille design in a more finished and fully painted form before passing judgement on that. https://fordauthority.com/2023/07/2024-ford-f-150-tremor-shows-off-new-grille-and-front-bumper/ One possible interior change that I have seen mentioned for '24 is the switch to a "portrait" style infotainment screen. I'm not sure what other changes to the instrument panel would be included with that but I am not in favor of putting all of the audio and HVAC controls on a touch screen. I prefer physical knobs simply because they are less of a distraction than having to take your eyes off the road to adjust things like heating or AC settings on a touch screen. Most audio controls are already on the steering wheel so that wouldn't bother me as much if the manual dash mounted controls went away. I also like what I’m seeing so far with the new Tremor grill, but I want to see it painted for final judgment. I’m also interested to see if they come out with a multifunction tailgate. I really like the tailgate step, but I would also like to see what other functionality they can come up with. I’m not sure what to think about portrait style screens. I would not want to give up physical buttons either. I have the horizontal screen in my truck and I think it is very functional, more so than the vertical one in our Explorer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 2 hours ago, tbone said: I also like what I’m seeing so far with the new Tremor grill, but I want to see it painted for final judgment. I’m also interested to see if they come out with a multifunction tailgate. I really like the tailgate step, but I would also like to see what other functionality they can come up with. I’m not sure what to think about portrait style screens. I would not want to give up physical buttons either. I have the horizontal screen in my truck and I think it is very functional, more so than the vertical one in our Explorer. I'm fine with the current tailgate step. It works and is simple to use. My hope would be that if they do go to a portrait orientation that they do something similar to what the new Ranger Raptor has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, tbone said: Apparently the Star White dealer was looking to make some money on you with their pricing, which is a red flag since their pricing was out of the norm. The Beechmont prices seem more realistic. Do you know why a person would choose one kit over another? Have you seen any comparisons? I would be inclined to buy the Ford kit, since it’s a Ford product, and so they couldn’t use the kit for warranty refusal purposes. Perhaps it doesn’t matter though since Roush is an authorized aftermarket manufacturer. I just got off the phone with the Ford Performance rep at Beechmont. Really nice guy and he was able to answer most of my questions. The main difference between the two SC kits is the fact that Roush uses the Eaton TVS R2650 (2.65L) blower while Ford uses the Whipple 3.0L blower. Even though the Roush has less displacement it is tuned to provide more horsepower (705 vs 700) and more torque (635 lb ft vs 590 lb ft). I'm not sure if Ford does their warranty the same way or not but Roush gives you a 3/36 warranty on the powertrain which cancels the factory 5/60 powertrain warranty. I haven't researched which kit is considered better nor have I seen any comparisons but that is something I plan to do. Although this doesn't effect the '21 and up gen IV Coyote, which uses a belt driven oil pump, the guy at Beechmont also told me that if you change the oil pump gears on a pre gen IV Coyote that will void your Roush warranty. He also claimed they have never had any issues with the factory oil pump gears. Right....? Another interesting thing I just discovered is that Ford Performance offers two different F-150 kits for the '21 and up, one for trucks with Pro Power Onboard and another for trucks without that option. That could play a part for me as I would like to have Pro Power Onboard but was under the false impression that you couldn't install a blower on a truck with two alternators. Assuming Roush doesn't offer that option, that could sway my decision in favor of FP. This is getting better all the time. ? https://accessories.ford.com/products/2021-22-f150-5-0l-supercharger-kit-w-pro-power-onboard Edited July 7, 2023 by blksn8k2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 Interesting stuff! Keep us posted on your experiences with this. You can’t be the only one with questions on these high horsepower kits with warranties. I’m curious if you lose the warranty on the FP kit as well. I also wondered if you could get the extended warranty since it was a Ford product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksn8k2 Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 Paid off the '18 F-150 today. Decided to save myself some interest. Had seven months remaining on the loan had I continued making payments. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbone Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 I know this isn’t the type of vehicle you are planning to put a supercharger on, but I found this article entertaining: https://www.theautopian.com/i-drove-the-absurd-base-f-150-with-a-warrantied-700-horsepower-supercharged-v8/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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