Deanh Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Yeah. 130k Fusions, 130k Edges, 100k Five Hundreds, 75k Freestyles, 30k Milans, 30k MKZs, 20k Montegos, 30k MKSes, 30k MKXs INSTEAD OF 300k Tauruses, 50k Sables, 30k Continentals, and 100k Windstars, all to fleets. AND...to not do what they have constantly done before...start selling good numbers of product, sit back relax and gloat, then re-act to the fact that the imports have newer fresher inventory....Ford needs to continue to constantly develop and freshen if not totally re-vamp it's product every 3-4 years MAX! And NOT stop gaps like clear headlights and slightly different bumpers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 "Ford in the number four position for the first time since the model T. Thank you Bill jr." Isn't it amazing how history repeats? It is not history repeating. Ford has never been number 4 in sales since the Model T started production. Instead of fixating on Bill (it's done, already), try devoting more skull-time to figuring out how Ford gets there, from here. When Bill jr. quits Ford I will never mention his name again. The man has caused untold harm to the company and employees and doesn't even realize it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukemullen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Although the numbers certainly are not good, I am an optimist for the future. Although Ford is lacking the homerun car that has saved it in the past, the overall lineup is pretty good. The Fusion/Milan are continuing to gain sales, although slowly. I think the Edge/MKX will end up being solid hits, and the Five Hundred/Montego and Freestyle are the best cars in Ford's lineup no one knows about. Individually, none of these cars will save Ford. None of them are the Model A, '49 Ford, '65 Mustang, or '86 Taurus, but Ford would do well to not follow that same pattern. It is better to have a solid lineup than one great car and nothing else. Yes, more needs to be done. The Focus, although receiving a noteable upgrade, desperately needs a complete redesign. The Ranger isn't even a viable competitor anymore, and something must be done about Mercury. I feel this lineup, with regular updates and redesigns, is putting Ford on the right track. Maybe I'm naiive, but I have faith in Mulally and Fields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Isn't that what Ford is already doing with boring and uncompetitive products? Pretty much. Are you saying Ford needs to do more of that then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 This I agree on. With the current product Ford is producing, nobody is "demanding" to buy them. Fix the product, and the demand will for products will take care of itself, along with plant utilization. Everything I've seen suggests you want Ford to fully utilize its plants with a few 'hit' cars. Apparently, the full utilization of Ford's plants with a high number of model variants, is something you're against. At least that's what I've gotten from all of your posts on this thread. Building 4 models at OAC (Edge, MKX, "Fairlane", Lincoln "fairlane"), 4 models at Chicago (MKS, Freestyle, Five Hundred, Montego), and three models at Hermosillo (Fusion, Milan, MKZ) apparently is not as good as building two models at Chicago and Atlanta, and one model at OAP. At least that's what I've inferred from your previous posts. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Everything I've seen suggests you want Ford to fully utilize its plants with a few 'hit' cars. Apparently, the full utilization of Ford's plants with a high number of model variants, is something you're against. At least that's what I've gotten from all of your posts on this thread. Building 4 models at OAC (Edge, MKX, "Fairlane", Lincoln "fairlane"), 4 models at Chicago (MKS, Freestyle, Five Hundred, Montego), and three models at Hermosillo (Fusion, Milan, MKZ) apparently is not as good as building two models at Chicago and Atlanta, and one model at OAP. At least that's what I've inferred from your previous posts. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Yes, you're wrong again. Feel corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The Fusion is a sales flop, along with every other product Ford offers besides the Mustang and F-series. I always wonder why one car can be a flop "only" selling ~150,000 units a year, but the Mustang is a hit for selling the same amount. Sure, the Fusion's market is larger, but it also has many more competitors. I wouldn't want to see how the Mustang would do in a market crowded with a dozen other competitors either. Why does a midsize sedan necessarily need to sell 300,000 units to be considered a success? If they can pull a profit on it at ~150K units a year, what's the problem? Like I said before (and you completely ignored) is that no matter HOW GOOD the Fusion was it just would NOT sell that well. There's too much of a perceived quality gap with Ford's products for the mainstream market to consider them high on their lists. The Fusion has gotten overall positive reviews and has had stellar quality to date, but the public doesn't want to give Ford another chance yet. It's going to take YEARS of good product (the Fusion is good) to convince people to try them again en masse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The Fusion is a sales flop, See, this is where I have problems understanding what you're talking about. Ford programmed the Fusion for 130k or so units per year in the U.S. Therefore it is hard to see how it qualifies as a sales flop. The vehicle program was designed around these volumes. Which means it is exceptionally hard to take anything else you say seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 130k Fusion sales are probably respectable for the number 4 auto company im the USA. For the pre Bill Ford jr. company it would probably be considered a disaster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLemon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 See, this is where I have problems understanding what you're talking about. Ford programmed the Fusion for 130k or so units per year in the U.S. Therefore it is hard to see how it qualifies as a sales flop. The vehicle program was designed around these volumes. Which means it is exceptionally hard to take anything else you say seriously. Mister Jensen!!!! So tell me now! Are you happy with the way Ford is going right now??? Is it not true that all the FordLemon predictions have come true? Come on! I want to hear it from you! Honestly why don’t you say it once and for all: “Ford sucks but I still believe in that miserable company for no reasons” say it! It won’t hurt you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Lemon: Would you rather lose a leg, or die of gangrene? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 "hate to say it, but she's gonna bomb. Go ahead, flame me, but we can revisit this in six months." - bec5150 on the Ford Edge, Nov 2 2006, 06:40 PM BEC5150 is looking pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 "hate to say it, but she's gonna bomb. Go ahead, flame me, but we can revisit this in six months."- bec5150 on the Ford Edge, Nov 2 2006, 06:40 PM BEC5150 is looking pretty good. Wow calling the car a failure after being on the market for a just under a month and half? What is the definition of failure for the Edge? Whats going to happen is that the Edge will meet an expectation, but the people who want it to fail will say oh it didn't do X sales number or whatnot, thus its failure in their eyes, much like what people are saying about the Fusion :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sranger Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 I do not think that the Fusion is a flop, but it is not a hit either. That, of course, is the problem. Ford does not need GOOD cars right now, they need market leading or GREAT cars right now. The Fusion was well equiped to take on the 2006 Camry and Accord. However, that was 2006. The new Camry raised the bar again and simply out classed the Fusion. So, as usual, Ford will be playing catch up instead of playing leader. The ONLY way to win back customers is to produce exceptional vehicles and advertise them well. Even then it might take years for anyone to really notice. Constantly playing catchup is not going to get it done. So far, I have not seen anything from Ford that shows that they are willing to do what is necessary with the product line. The 2008 Escape/Mariner/Tribute show this clearly.. Ford had a good shot with the Edge. It's styling gave Ford a good chance at having a Hit car. However, right out of the gate it place more or less average in it's segment. It got good marks for accceleration and fell short on just about every other test that could be measured, especially braking. While Ford cannot design vehicles that appeal to the whims of automotive journalist's sence of style, they can make sure that the performance of their vehicles is second to none. They simple can't or wont do it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96 Pony Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The Crown Victoria is selling better than the Five Hundred! 4:1 !!!!!!!!!! And the Crown Vic have 28 years old Panther platform ( the 1979 LTD-Marquis) .Come on Ford , kill the Five Hundred-Motego and build the Interceptor NOW! Yea but talk about a Fleet Queen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Yea but talk about a Fleet Queen! Well the only good thing about the Panther, is that retail sales of it are so small and the fleet sales of the Panther are mostly to PDs, where they are made with very little in the way of options. Ford can build a shitload of Police Interceptors at a cheap price since they are nearly the same... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Crown Vic is not outselling the Five Hundred 4:1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 The new Camry raised the bar again and simply out classed the Fusion. Let me rephrase: The new Camry shifted the paradigms, and outdid the Fusion on the critical 'wow' factor. The new Camry blew the doors off the competition and handed the Fusion its hat The new Camry is a proactive entry that out maneuvers the Fusion. The new Camry takes the segment by storm and runs roughshod over the Fusion The new Camry takes it to the extreme, and leaves the Fusion paddling in its wake. The new Camry rocks tough and can hang with the best of 'em, and makes the Fusion look like a total poseur. The new Camry is an absolutely radical beast, the Fusion is dog turds. ------- There is a huge difference between making defensible statements and doing cheap imitations of sensationalist journalism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 "hate to say it, but she's gonna bomb. Go ahead, flame me, but we can revisit this in six months."- bec5150 on the Ford Edge, Nov 2 2006, 06:40 PM BEC5150 is looking pretty good. LOL that is f'n hillarious. Seriously where do you come up with this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGallun Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 calling the Edge a failure after 1 month... sweet, you guys are idiots, really you are.. also on the guy who said the 07 camry leaves fusion in dust.. well uh, guess you dont see them new commericals eh? here.. fusionchallege.com another dweeb.. why we have so many ford haters on this board.. ya, all isnt rosey, but they are working on it.. you guys who are all negative must lead some boring lives or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 LOL that is f'n hillarious. Seriously where do you come up with this? Can you remember nothing? That was BEC5150's prediction that SparkyOAC has on all his posts. 3 more months. 5k a month won't cut it. Sales for January may have been held up due to the botched launch.(lack of supply) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecon Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 calling the Edge a failure after 1 month... sweet, you guys are idiots, really you are.. also on the guy who said the 07 camry leaves fusion in dust.. well uh, guess you dont see them new commericals eh? here.. fusionchallege.com another dweeb.. why we have so many ford haters on this board.. ya, all isnt rosey, but they are working on it.. you guys who are all negative must lead some boring lives or something. Those are the commercials Ford paid Car and Driver for? i have not seen them once on TV in this area. Embarassing that the public knows the commercials are tainted. Quote Bec5150 again, "HAHAHAHA". RJ--Is it OK to call other posters dweebs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96 Pony Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Speaking of commercials - Why oh why are the ONLY commercials I see on t.v. for FOMOCO for the Mercury Milan? Is it because of the hot chick? Whatever the reason, IMHO, Ford should be advertising the hell out of the Edge right now. Has anyone else seen an Edge commercial? Or for that matter the 500. The 500 is a sales BOMB! But it has a lot of positives which Ford should be playing up in the media The Fusion is doing what it is supposed to and I think in another year or so it has the potential to really make a positive impact on Ford sales. I live in the Bay Area which is mostly populated by Jap cars but I am seeing a lot of Fusions running around. Without a bar code on them. :shades: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLLMTR Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Having seen the Edge at the dealer lots and long lines of Fusions, Ford is not going to do well this year. People here are finding the Edge interior dull. It's also priced too close to the Explorer. A lot of folks are simply waiting to see what GM is going to bring out in Spring. By delaying the launch of the Edge and advertising it so early in 2006, it has lost a lot of its buzz and has given the competition a chance to hone in on it and produce more interesting offerings. I have seen more Kia and Hyundai CUV's than I have seen Fusions. And I have yet to see an Edge on the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 "and has given the competition a chance to hone in on it and produce more interesting offerings." Like what? An opinion with no fact like your fatuous statement above is just a brain fart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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