FordBuyer Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 With the UAW negotiations almost over with Ford being last, we can now see what the Domestics cost structure will be like for next four years. One negative though is that I have heard it could take at least two years to get health care liabilities off the books. Goodyear one year out still hasn't accomplished it since it has to go through court system and retirees are sure to sue further holding up the offloading of liabilities to the UAW. It will be awhile before the UAW gets that big chunk of money. With two tier wage structure, and only final assembly getting big money, it looks like the Domestics do get to reduce costs considerably. Many are saying that their costs will be similar to the transplants. That may be true, but Toyota and Honda still make another $15000 or so in profits/vehicle due to curreny manipulation. That can not be made up by the Domestics. So they still cannot offer equal content on vehicle and make equal profit. What do you guys think? Can the Domestics pull even with this contract or will it coninue to operated at cost disadvantage? The Domestics will be stuck with this contract for the next four years? Is it good enough to stay in business long term? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark8LSC CE0464 Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 I believe that number is $1,500.00 not $15,000.00 !!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 The Japanese will still have a competitive edge because of all the money they save by paying their top executives what they are actually worth, not what they think they are worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted October 12, 2007 Share Posted October 12, 2007 With the UAW negotiations almost over with Ford being last, we can now see what the Domestics cost structure will be like for next four years. One negative though is that I have heard it could take at least two years to get health care liabilities off the books. Goodyear one year out still hasn't accomplished it since it has to go through court system and retirees are sure to sue further holding up the offloading of liabilities to the UAW. It will be awhile before the UAW gets that big chunk of money. With two tier wage structure, and only final assembly getting big money, it looks like the Domestics do get to reduce costs considerably. Many are saying that their costs will be similar to the transplants. That may be true, but Toyota and Honda still make another $15000 or so in profits/vehicle due to curreny manipulation. That can not be made up by the Domestics. So they still cannot offer equal content on vehicle and make equal profit. What do you guys think? Can the Domestics pull even with this contract or will it coninue to operated at cost disadvantage? The Domestics will be stuck with this contract for the next four years? Is it good enough to stay in business long term? That is the one major concern I have. Trade imbalances due to protectionism. I generally fall pretty much on the side of no protectionism and no retaliation. However, the US auto industry is one place I wish the Unions were strong enough to push congress to enact some protections. Any country that gets itself into the auto mfg. industry has made a huge technological leap. That is all great for them. But I don't think it should be on the backs of American workers. I say treat these other countries and their VATs like other countries treated us when we went into Iraq. We can use the same exact argument. It is not right for you to have the VAT. It is not right for us to pay it. It is not fair to ask it of us. I say push hard on the Asian contries Japan particularly and also Germany. They have worked their angle till it has rubbed raw a wound that is close to never healing. But, congress likely never will. And at some point in the future we are going to look back and be able to point out the last possible moment when we could have done this, but let that point in time pass with out a word. Peace and Blessings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stentgraft95 Posted October 12, 2007 Share Posted October 12, 2007 That is the one major concern I have. Trade imbalances due to protectionism. I generally fall pretty much on the side of no protectionism and no retaliation. However, the US auto industry is one place I wish the Unions were strong enough to push congress to enact some protections. Any country that gets itself into the auto mfg. industry has made a huge technological leap. That is all great for them. But I don't think it should be on the backs of American workers. I say treat these other countries and their VATs like other countries treated us when we went into Iraq. We can use the same exact argument. It is not right for you to have the VAT. It is not right for us to pay it. It is not fair to ask it of us. I say push hard on the Asian contries Japan particularly and also Germany. They have worked their angle till it has rubbed raw a wound that is close to never healing. But, congress likely never will. And at some point in the future we are going to look back and be able to point out the last possible moment when we could have done this, but let that point in time pass with out a word. Peace and Blessings Pardon me for not knowing the VAT acronym but I can tell you I will never buy an Asian car and can't see me buying European either, why? Our idea of free and fair trad has never been free or FAIR. It's the last place I can support American workers. I am not employed by the auto industry nor is any member of my family. Plus, I'm not against protectionism as long as foriegn companys continue to play ball like this. I know the arguments that we allow it to happen (the unfair trading) and therefore I look at me buying American (Ford Products) soley as a grassroots movement. I don't care if the car I buy is made in Mexico either, at least it's an American company. Before the flaming starts, I've not yet bought a Ford that wasn't built almost entirely here in America. I might feel different if I bought a Ford that i thought was a piece of crap and felt like I really got burned but I've been very satisifed. To all the Ford emploees here---keep up the good work. The Lincoln LS will be paid off in a year and the wife once an Edge bad. I have a Shelby GT500 and a 93 F-250 and she currently drive a 96 Taurus wagon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted October 12, 2007 Share Posted October 12, 2007 I say treat these other countries and their VATs like other countries treated us when we went into Iraq. We can use the same exact argument. It is not right for you to have the VAT. It is not right for us to pay it. It is not fair to ask it of us. Peace and Blessings, what the hell are you raving about? What part about the Value Added Tax used by countries like Canada and the UK has you so upset? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Harbinger Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 The Japanese will still have a competitive edge because of all the money they save by paying their top executives what they are actually worth, not what they think they are worth. If it costs $2 million a year to hire someone capable of leading a corporation with revenues that would place it 39th amongst nations for GDP... then that's what he's worth. Maybe Jac Nasser will work for $100k/year? Bill Ford worked for free! Maybe Ford should make him CEO again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Pardon me for not knowing the VAT acronym but I can tell you I will never buy an Asian car and can't see me buying European either, why? Our idea of free and fair trad has never been free or FAIR. It's the last place I can support American workers. I am not employed by the auto industry nor is any member of my family. Plus, I'm not against protectionism as long as foriegn companys continue to play ball like this. I know the arguments that we allow it to happen (the unfair trading) and therefore I look at me buying American (Ford Products) soley as a grassroots movement. I don't care if the car I buy is made in Mexico either, at least it's an American company. Before the flaming starts, I've not yet bought a Ford that wasn't built almost entirely here in America. I might feel different if I bought a Ford that i thought was a piece of crap and felt like I really got burned but I've been very satisifed. To all the Ford emploees here---keep up the good work. The Lincoln LS will be paid off in a year and the wife once an Edge bad. I have a Shelby GT500 and a 93 F-250 and she currently drive a 96 Taurus wagon. Value Added Taxes. Country puts an added tax onto items made by their countries and sold in their countries. Then they remove that fee for the same home made product when it is shipped out and sold abroad. Then they put a tax on out side products coming into the country to boost the cost of the product so that their people buy home made not imported. That is why I buy Ford. Though, I have read that if you add up the things that make a company locally owned verses over seas owned GM is more American than Ford. Peace and Blessings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macattak1 Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Peace and Blessings, what the hell are you raving about? What part about the Value Added Tax used by countries like Canada and the UK has you so upset? I don't recall naming names and calling out Canada and the UK. And since I do not have not even a remote idea of what any particular countries do I am sure I did not name Canada and the UK. But actually the UK/England knows what side its bread is buttered on. Not always sure about Canada. You must be pretty aware of the Canadian VAT and other import tax challenges. Either that or your paranoid for some unknown reason. Can think of no other reason why you would jump down my post for imaginary things like you did. Maybe your just having a bad moment. Yes. Peace and Blessings Posting Peace and Blessings is as much for me as anyone else. It reminds me to keep civil. Kind of a personal checks and balance. Not perfect. Some times I take the bait. But works for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Bill Ford worked for free! Maybe Ford should make him CEO again! There ya go! Now you're getting it! Ford could have saved $36 Million dollars last year by that very decision alone! :happy feet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furious1Auto Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 (edited) There ya go! Now you're getting it! Ford could have saved $36 Million dollars last year by that very decision alone! :happy feet: From this point forward all CEO's have to close the wage gap between their selves and Bill Ford! This is the only true way to see that they get paid what their worth! I'm sorry but I feel nothing but contempt for people who can't take responsibility, and expect others to pay for their mistakes. Edited October 13, 2007 by Furious1Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 There ya go! Now you're getting it! Ford could have saved $36 Million dollars last year by that very decision alone! :happy feet: Didn't everyone in this site flame Bill Ford to hell? Now you guys finally changed your minds about him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 There ya go! Now you're getting it! Ford could have saved $36 Million dollars last year by that very decision alone! :happy feet: Bill Ford fired himself because he couldn't get the job done, senior staff were lying to him, protecting their own empires and acting against any changes. It took an outsider to dismantle the feifdoms and wring $5 billion recurring in internal savings. $28 million is chicken feed when compared to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suv_guy_19 Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Bill Ford fired himself because he couldn't get the job done, senior staff were lying to him,protecting their own empires and acting against any changes. It took an outsider to dismantle the feifdoms and wring $5 billion recurring in internal savings. $28 million is chicken feed when compared to that. Yes, what they don't seem to realize is that he has already been worth the money. The billions in savings, the unexpected profit that was managed, the positive cash flow He has already paid for himself several thousand times over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted October 13, 2007 Author Share Posted October 13, 2007 Yes, what they don't seem to realize is that he has already been worth the money. The billions in savings, the unexpected profit that was managed, the positive cash flow He has already paid for himself several thousand times over. By far, the best thing Mulally did was mortgage the company at a time when cheap money was plentiful and more importantly before the resulting credit crunch hit. The timing was perfect and with a softening economy and lower interest rates has a chance to refinance and save more billions of dollars. Mullaly saved the company over the short term by doing what he did. If he had waitied until this year to do the same, Ford wouldn't have the money it now has to fund VEBA and future product programs. How much is that worth? I guess to the UAW very little, but luckily they don't run the company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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