Taking a cab in NYC? You might not be in a Crown Vic much longer

[Anthony]

Full story on Motley Fool

 

The agency that regulates the city's taxi industry has adopted a new fuel efficiency rule that will require all cabs purchased after Oct. 1, 2008, to get at least 25 miles per gallon.

 

Those bought after the fall of 2009 will have to achieve 30 mpg.

 

The rule change, expected since last spring and adopted Tuesday, will lead to a dramatic overhaul in the composition of New York's storied taxi fleet.

 

Right now, a majority of the city's 13,000 cabs are Ford Crown Victorias. But the Crown Vic's V-8 engine currently gets around 14 mpg, well short of the standard set by the Taxi and Limousine Commission.

 

The new rule will mean that taxi fleet owners, who must replace their cabs every three to five years, will probably be forced to buy fuel-efficient hybrids, which run partly on electricity.

 

................

 

Ford spokesman Jim Cain said he couldn't comment on what the rule change would mean for the future of the Crown Victoria in New York, but he said the company has been working on a number of fuel efficiency initiatives.

 

"We have very loyal customers in the taxi industry, and we are committed to that business," he said.

 

According to Cain, Ford sells about 3,000 Crown Victorias each year for use as New York taxis.

[danup]

30 MPG? This sounds like a job for the Escape hybrid, if Ford can produce enough of them. Otherwise people are going to have to pack light for the back of that Prius.

[suv_guy_19]

30 MPG? This sounds like a job for the Escape hybrid, if Ford can produce enough of them. Otherwise people are going to have to pack light for the back of that Prius.

 

 

Actually, you can put a great deal in the back of a prius. They use them as cabs here, and I must admit that they work very well.

[danup]

I stand corrected. Anyway, Ford has an opportunity here to a) lessen dependence on the CV and B) gain mindshare about hybrid technology, so I hope they use their long-time taxi fleet ties to push the Escape.

[suv_guy_19]

I stand corrected. Anyway, Ford has an opportunity here to a) lessen dependence on the CV and B) gain mindshare about hybrid technology, so I hope they use their long-time taxi fleet ties to push the Escape.

 

 

Yeah, along with a few upcoming Fusion hybrids....but not too many...don't want to cheapen the image.

[jpd80]

Would a hybrid Taurus work as a Taxi?

 

or am I still dillusional?

Edited December 13, 2007 by jpd80

[armadamaster]

More environazi rules getting put into place. How dare those cab companies have a CHOICE in what vehicles they use. If Hybrids were the best thing sliced bread, they'd have already made the switch themselves.

Edited December 13, 2007 by Armada Master

[630land]

Oh well, looks like one more nail in the coffin. If the New Yorkers expect otehrs to save fule, they have to bone up and squeeze into Priuses. Maybe there will be some Natural Gas Powered Panthers suddenly appearing? That will be only way to 'save' the car line. Lose NYC taxis, its will be a domino effect.

 

The P Mafia will just have to deal with reality, gas ain't cheap, and that there will not be any 5.4 liter, 400 HP V8's coming in them soon as they predicted.

Edited December 13, 2007 by 630land

[Traveler]

I once read that one of the NYPD's qualifications for a police car was that it had to survive an 8 inch drop off of a curb without doing damage to the car in any way. One reason why The Vic has been in there so long. If the taxi drivers abuse their cars anything like the police, I wonder how well these fuel sippers will do when it comes to repair costs in suspension, steering, brakes and body work? Will the savings of the fuel be justified or will it be consumed by other expenses?

[taxman100]

Anyone want to bet cab fares will be going up to pay for all this new Nanny-state requirements?

 

Is it just me, or is the United States starting to feel like it did when Jimmy Carter was President - oppressive bureaucrats making every decision for you, along with terrible morale in the country.

Edited December 13, 2007 by taxman100

[suv_guy_19]

I once read that one of the NYPD's qualifications for a police car was that it had to survive an 8 inch drop off of a curb without doing damage to the car in any way. One reason why The Vic has been in there so long. If the taxi drivers abuse their cars anything like the police, I wonder how well these fuel sippers will do when it comes to repair costs in suspension, steering, brakes and body work? Will the savings of the fuel be justified or will it be consumed by other expenses?

 

 

IIRC, the NYPD uses all 3 cars, and the bulk of their fleet is made up of Impalas.

[armadamaster]

Heh....here's what the environazi's are going to legislate cabs to in a few years after the hybrids get realized for how unenvironmentally friendly they really are:

 

 

Don't ask where the catalytic converter is going to go.

Edited December 13, 2007 by Armada Master

[igor]

Yeah, along with a few upcoming Fusion hybrids....but not too many...don't want to cheapen the image.

did you read the number? 3,000 a year - not that many

 

Igor

[Anthony]

did you read the number? 3,000 a year - not that many

 

Igor

 

At current sales levels, thats around 5% of yearly sales. Not something to scoff at if they plan on keeping this thing in production much longer.

 

Amazing how 5% of all CV sales are concentrated in one city.

[Surgen]

At current sales levels, thats around 5% of yearly sales. Not something to scoff at if they plan on keeping this thing in production much longer.

 

Amazing how 5% of all CV sales are concentrated in one city.

 

Makes sense when the New York City Metro area has 18.8 million people out of 300 million - or about 6%.

[suv_guy_19]

did you read the number? 3,000 a year - not that many

 

Igor

 

 

Sorry, I missed the last line. That would be fine then.

[sonofford]

30 MPG? This sounds like a job for the Escape hybrid, if Ford can produce enough of them. Otherwise people are going to have to pack light for the back of that Prius.

 

Escape hybrids have been used in the NYC taxi fleet for a few years now. There are almost 300 of them on the streets of NY, and some in San Francisco also. Apparently they proved highly reliable and saved quite a bit on gas.

 

Story is online here: http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/05/23/fo...d-taxi-success/

[Traveler]

IIRC, the NYPD uses all 3 cars, and the bulk of their fleet is made up of Impalas.

 

I meant to imply that it was once a requirement. With the vast numbers of Impalas available, they can likely afford to use disposable cars. I honestly can't recall one LEO I've ever talked to say that the Impala could hold a candle to the Crown Vic in terms of durability or longevity. They are often more easily damaged and from what I understand, usually take longer to get back on the road. The Charger I'm not sure of and I imagine that the reason many departments are beginning to buy Tahoes are because of the immense pressure to buy from Chevy. The Impala can't hold up as well to abusive police work, so the Tahoe becomes the obvious choice. I do know from what I've read that the LX sedans were at one time, very easy to upset the wheel alignment requiring readjustment. That may have been fixed, however.

 

The larger cities may buy brand-new, but more often than not, I'd bet that most taxi companies buy used and most buy Crown Vics for the reputation they have. Many Ford taxis I see look to be old CVPIs or at least have the CVPI package.

[Anthony]

Makes sense when the New York City Metro area has 18.8 million people out of 300 million - or about 6%.

 

NYC proper (the 5 boros) has about 8 million (as of the '00 census). Generally, the main bulk of CV taxis are in Manhattan. Pop: 1.4 million.

 

Nevertheless, taxis are generally not used by people who live in the city anyhow. So population stats are irrelevant (also adding in the fact these are fleet sales).

Edited December 13, 2007 by Intrepidatious

[Fordowner]

Nevertheless, taxis are generally not used by people who live in the city anyhow. So population stats are irrelevant (also adding in the fact these are fleet sales).

 

True most who live in New York City proper or even Metro NY don't use cabs for most of their trips, they walk or use the subway or bus, but the wealthy residents and residents going out or in groups etc. use the cabs. Also metro population is relevant interms of the #'s who commute to the city daily on the trains & buses- which actually probably increases taxi demand vs other downtowns where most suburban commuters drive in. But true population stats are not the entire picture. Though I think Manhattan probably has more cabs per square inch than any area in the United States (excluding airport queing areas - ever seen NY's wow!)

 

Oh and those worried about the big bad regulations. Um taxi's are a highly regulated business, they rely on government roads, government infrastructure such as police and lights, there is a public safety concern, there is a tourist/image concern, and they pay out the nose in NYC for medallions to be able to operate, and in NYC space is at a premium so being allowed to operate a cab is a privilege since NYC probably has some cap on the # of cabs that can operate. In other words in NYC the taxi fleet is pretty close to being public transit. But don't worry, it works, and citizens have their freedom, probably more so cause they have a choice between driving, walking or taking several forms of transit, there is also a large limo fleet there, wonder how many towncars carey limo buys in NY. People mistakenly equate cars with freedom - but remember its a privilege not a right, and by accepting that privilege you accept the wrath of government.

 

Also in light of the fact that Manhattan has more pedestrians and cabs than anywhere I've been, I can't think of a bigger bang for the buck for peoples lungs than implementing regs that reduce the amount of gas being burned - assuming they generally are cleaner vehicles from an emmission point of view.

[SysEng]

Heh....here's what the environazi's are going to legislate cabs to in a few years after the hybrids get realized for how unenvironmentally friendly they really are:

 

 

Don't ask where the catalytic converter is going to go.

 

ROFL, Good One!

 

But I love to miff the ecofreaks. Guess what? Mercedes plans to introduce

a 44MPG S-Class ( normally 12 cylinders and as close to competition for a "panther"

as your gonna get ) in about 2 years. I figure if MB can do that Ford

should be able to at least clear 35mpg in a CV.

 

I can just see the ecofreaks going ballistic when Ford drops

a DOHC4V 4.6L V8 with VVT/VCT and a 6R80 tranny on those NYC roads.

 

I need a flight to NYC and my camera to get the look on their faces

[Deanh]

Heh....here's what the environazi's are going to legislate cabs to in a few years after the hybrids get realized for how unenvironmentally friendly they really are:

 

 

Don't ask where the catalytic converter is going to go.

thats Ovaltine.....alias Rick Shaw

[7Mary3]

Doesn't matter. The Crown Vic is dead anyway.

[taxman100]

Doesn't matter. The Crown Vic is dead anyway.

 

Did they stop building them yesterday or something?

[NLPRacing]

...I figure if MB can do that Ford

should be able to at least clear 35mpg in a CV.

 

They could, but who would buy it? To get 35 mpg, it would need to be diesel or hybrid. Who would buy a $35,000 Panther? Nobody...

 

Personally, I think it's a good idea for Ford to stop supplying taxi's and cop cars. People associate these with being cheap. Let Toyota or whoever else go for this losing market. How will the resale value of a Prius or Sienna be when there are a ton of used ex-taxi's on the market? Do you think anybody rides in a Taxi or better yet a police car and go "damn, this is a nice car, I should buy a Ford...". No they don't. They usually say "...this POS smells like curry, I'll never buy a Ford..." or in the case of the Ford police car ride "...I'm too drunk to care...".