suv_guy_19 Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I'm assuming they are NOT since I live in the fourth largest city in north America and have NOT seen a new Sable on the road to date... I was only in the US for a week in August and I saw 2 new Sables. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 (edited) I was only in the US for a week in August and I saw 2 new Sables. My condolenses. Regardless...they have NOT been popular in these parts. Most people who critique the Panthers haven't even ridden in one and if they have its probably a worn-out taxi or their grandmother's softly-sprung sedan. That's why its really pointless to argue. No different than judging a Taurus on how anemic the Five-Hundred was. Even fewer have driven a late-model Panther to even know what they're talking about. This really isn't about Ford loyalty, but model loyalty. There's another point, those that are the most vocally opposing the Panthers likely don't even drive a full-size sedan to begin with. You can't talk up the Taurus to a Panther owner and not back it up with ownership. Panther owners are loyal to the Ford that produces Mustangs, F-150s, and Panthers. There's the appreciation for rear wheel drive and eight-cylinder engines. Its about liking what works. Besides the old Taurus (not the 500 rename) what sedan has Ford produced long-term with success? Easy answer. Now why is that? If you want to talk about the Panther, at least have some seat time to critique it. If you haven't driven a P71 or HPP, you're riding in a base car with whatever options have been added. I'll bet you that very few Taurus owners would have the courage to push their cars in a turn like the Crown Vic builds confidence. They'd probably be riding the guard rail. The more performance-oriented Crown Vics and Grand Marquises are structurally tight, roomy, comfort, has good build quality, good power and handling and decent fuel economy. The D3, as good as it is, will probably have lived about 8 years max before its put out to pasture. The Panther will have lived for about 33 years before it ends. Good post again, Traveler. I've decided that I think I going to have prepared counterpoints saved in a Word file just so I don't have to keep typing this stuff. Either that or just leave it alone. That's alright, I've made the business case for the Panthers thru 2020 on more than one occasion to no avail...maybe I should just replace my sig with it.... Edited January 20, 2008 by Armada Master Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Armada Master, do you live in seniorsville, Florida? That's probably the only place in the US where GMs would outsell Sables. (excluding fleet sales) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Here's a Sable fleet Sable Antelope (Hippotragus niger niger) Sable are very aggressive and will defend themselves and their young against most predators such as lions and leopards. http://www.bushveld.co.za/animal-pictures-sable.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I had ONE of the sales guys tell me that whole "customer in a hurry" thing about the Sables...so take it for what you will. They all told me they can't give the Sables away while there's GMQs on the lot. They had quite a few new GMQs in stock they day we were shopping....slim pickens on TCs though, they had one granny package TC in the showroom with a rag top and a couple of more sitting around out front, and this was back around Sept./Oct or so. :shades: You ended up with a Grand Marquis or a Town Car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I'm assuming they are NOT since I live in the fourth largest city in north America and have NOT seen a new Sable on the road to date...and I think I've seen TWO Montegos since 2005. Plus, just for a "feeler", my last visit to the L/M dealer a few months back, I had a couple sales guys telling me they couldn't GIVE the Sable away but they can't keep TCs and GMQs in stock. In fact the only way they move ANY Sables is if they are out of GMQs and the customer is in a hurry. But I've seen plenty of 2006+ GMQs running around. So just going by what your little microcosm of where you live at is supposed to be the end all for the rest of North America? I see a few panthers in my area, but thats because where I live there are many retirement communities...but I don't see much in the way of Town Cars outside of Limos in the area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moby Vic Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Orlando is crawling with every kind of car imaginable, Panthers included, and Orlando is not a retirement area. I don't think I've seen a new Sable on the road yet, though, come to think of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 So just going by what your little microcosm of where you live at is supposed to be the end all for the rest of North America? YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Look at the God Damn sales numbers. 2007: 50,664 Grand Marquis sold to 10,366 Sables. Where are you getting confused?!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder2299of7839 Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I'm in SW Missouri, and GMs outnumber Montego/Sables 10 to 1 at the very least. my local ford Merc dealer has only the sables it must carry with its allotment. it still had 2 Montegos sitting there. they sell 3-4 GM s a month (its a small dealer) although they didnt have to keep CVs in stock, they had special ordered around one a month (mostly sports) until it went fleet. my old large ford dealer in California sold out their allotment of CVs early each year, and scavenged other dealers for remaining stock.(on top of good fleet sales) the larger L/M dealer in town has all its sables and its remaining Montego out back. there is a line of GMs and the escape-mercuries (the name escapes me) out front with TCs in the showroom. and jeeps out front too. (their other brand) I only see older sables on the road and one local Montego I know of. BTW I think despite good sales of the previous Sable, they should have kept the Montego name as it does have nostalgic value. obviously the switchback to Sable isn't working, but its too late to switch again. pity. the 500 should have been a Fairlane 500, then it would have been much, much more successful, but it was marketed as far as I could see as the end-all large car, when its obviously not a "big car" but more Fairlane sized in scope. the taurus could have been retired in glory, and not besmirched by the re-name fiasco. I also think the P71 should have been re-named the Custom 500 and a base P74 named Galaxie 500. with the loaded P74 and the long wheelbase version could be either CV or LTD. despite what metrosexual city dwellers may think, there is still tremendous name recognition in the older lines, and it would have sold much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traveler Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 You know, I still see quite a lot of Panthers on the roads...more than the D3s. Many of those I can tell are not that old either. Maybe its a regional thing. Maybe the Panthers are just more popular in the southern United States since weather is really a problem usually. I probably see 7 Crown Vics/Grand Marquises to every 1 Five Hundred/Taurus or Mercury variant. In this area, I think the Freestyle was more popular than any of the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder2299of7839 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 the mariner. I knew if I thought long and hard enough I'd remember it. (actually it was the mariner commercial that did it) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 (edited) :shades: You ended up with a Grand Marquis or a Town Car? I was actually there with my father who was shopping for a new car...we drove GMQs and he tried out Chargers...he liked the GMQs better but decided he wanted to wait a year to pay off some CCs before making the new car jump because he is nearing retirement age and this will most likely be his last new car. :reading: Edited January 21, 2008 by Armada Master Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 heres another...PC Vs Richard...mano a mano..........LOL! That'd be a good one. You could also broaden that to: Pscario & friends vs. RichardJensen & friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Wow. Very mature... You don't like arguments that are Euro Focus vs US Focus and Panthers...and yet YOU go and create ANOTHER thread FOR EACH. No, he doesn't like Euro Focus vs US Focus arguments on threads that are supposed to be about the Verve. And he doesn't like Panther arguments on threads that are about something else. If there is a thread devoted to those topics, he could care less, but when topics veer from their original meanings, that's when he doesn't like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 (edited) And what role are you playing? The instigator, of course. No thread would be complete without one. Edited January 21, 2008 by rmc523 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 So you believe, without reservation, that a modern uni-body RWD car is in no way suitable for fleet use? I believe his point was that the vehicle should not be put into fleets to destroy residual values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 That'd be a good one. You could also broaden that to: Pscario & friends vs. RichardJensen & friends. No, he doesn't like Euro Focus vs US Focus arguments on threads that are supposed to be about the Verve. And he doesn't like Panther arguments on threads that are about something else. If there is a thread devoted to those topics, he could care less, but when topics veer from their original meanings, that's when he doesn't like it. The instigator, of course. No thread would be complete without one. I believe his point was that the vehicle should not be put into fleets to destroy residual values. Jesus Christ. Post-Whore MUCH?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 (edited) You're also not going to produce any numbers to back your claim that all other Ford cars outhandle Panthers. I get it. You don't like the cars. But that doesn't give you the right to make up your own data on them. Every post you've made in this topic is an insult to anyone who owns a Panther, and for the simple reason that you don't like the cars. How mature is that? re read some prior postsMr Bi Polar...it WAS a great car...but it has BECOME antiquated, non profitable and HAS been put to pasture....I don't hate the car at all, but unlike SOME I can come to grips with its demise AND I don't IGNORE its shortcomings....if that comes across as insulting, apologies, not meant to be an insult, you however I question sanity......one dis-agreement and out comes the STFU.... Edited January 21, 2008 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 re read some prior postsMr Bi Polar...it WAS a great car...but it has BECOME antiquated, non profitable and HAS been put to pasture....I don't hate the car at all, but unlike SOME I can come to grips with its demise AND I don't IGNORE its shortcomings....if that comes across as insulting, apologies, not meant to be an insult, you however I question sanity......one dis-agreement and out comes the STFU.... I hope you aren't lumping me in with that crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 I hope you aren't lumping me in with that crowd. nah, some are passionate and stubborn to a Tee, as i have said before some just can;t get over the fact that technology has swept the panthers aside, shame in a way...absolutely BULLETPROOF, my bone is its the same that critique EVERY OTHER vehicle in the lineup that is superior in 99 % of what is considered important today yet the Panther gets a free ride....to some it is the perfect vehicle, everything else is just crappola....and when one points that out, they get hit questions of "maturity"and with the STFU bombs....little sensitive and insecure in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 nah, some are passionate and stubborn to a Tee, as i have said before some just can;t get over the fact that technology has swept the panthers aside, shame in a way...absolutely BULLETPROOF, my bone is its the same that critique EVERY OTHER vehicle in the lineup that is superior in 99 % of what is considered important today yet the Panther gets a free ride....to some it is the perfect vehicle, everything else is just crappola....and when one points that out, they get hit questions of "maturity"and with the STFU bombs....little sensitive and insecure in my opinion. I have said it before and I'll say it again: Retail wise, the Panthers are done...have been for many years. Fleet wise, they have a lot of life left and the markets prove that. Everything that makes the Panthers great for fleet use...make them a laughing stock for retail use. But if I needed a new car NOW, and had 15K to spend. I would much rather a loaded CV than a Cobalt. Wouldn't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 I have said it before and I'll say it again: Retail wise, the Panthers are done...have been for many years. Fleet wise, they have a lot of life left and the markets prove that. Everything that makes the Panthers great for fleet use...make them a laughing stock for retail use. But if I needed a new car NOW, and had 15K to spend. I would much rather a loaded CV than a Cobalt. Wouldn't you? that would be used correct? And yes given those two choices, but in reality I wouldn't probably look at either....just not my cuppa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 that would be used correct? And yes given those two choices, but in reality I wouldn't probably look at either....just not my cuppa If anyone can call 10K miles "used". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 If anyone can call 10K miles "used". flip side...if anyone could call $15k holding value.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 flip side...if anyone could call $15k holding value.............. No way. But again, thats part of the beauty. You can get a basically new car for HALF of what Ford wants for it. That doesn't make it a bad car...just a HUGE deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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