SVT_MAN Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 (edited) what is so hard to understand ?!?! If you knew Leno, you would understand he is not the kind of idiot that would drive a Super Duty to work every day - he believes in purpose built cars. He once openly laughed at people who commute in super cars, Porsches and Ferraris and complain that the clutch is too hard!!! He is the kind of guy that would NOT be ashamed to drive a minivan if his situation demanded it - BECAUSE the minivan is the best suited car for his meed at the moment... then he would wipe out his Ford GT or a Bentley for a night out in town with his wife, and later, on Sunday, he would pull out an Elise or something for an afternoon alone carving curves in the mountains. it makes PERFECT sense for him to understand, admire and promote the advantages of Plug in hybrids as commuter mobiles - if all of us commuted by PHEV's we would eliminate a giant chunk of out oil consumption.... but I know you will come up with some stupid reason this all has to be a PR BS .... I just know you will ... idiots like you always get furious when they face a logical "in your face" truth .... PS: if you do not believe in global warming, believe in our dependency on Middle Eastern Oil - either way - hybrids are a win .. no matter how you slice it. Igor Kind of interesting that he mentioned the Porsche / Ferrari thing considering that he drives a Ford GT to work a lot. I realize the Ford GT's clutch is rather light, but not super light. Also, I don't think either of you (Igor or P71) are completely wrong. I think Leno has more incentive to do this because of NBC's ownership, and the fact that being "green" is a fad right now that is earning companies revenue. (I mean Cisco is saying that buying their teleconferencing software makes you green because you aren't commuting somewhere ... !) On the other hand, Leno loves technology, and he loves technology that improves things. These green technologies have the potential to improve things. The biggest problem with hybrids, IMO, is their useful life. Those batteries don't last forever. There are other problems, too, like you can't leave the Prius sitting for too long or the batteries will drain .... We can speculate all we want, but I don't think there will be a one-stop-shop solutoin when it comes to improving our efficiency. It will likely be a combination of private efforts and interests. Farmers are pushing for ethanol because it drives corn prices up. Perhaps battery makers are going to push for hybrids. There are several different interests in this game - not just the car companies and the oil companies. Edited April 28, 2008 by SVT_MAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 (edited) Ethanol is is a huge scam, otherwise we wouldn't be using it. I wonder if somebody could point me out to a website that has info about the Global Warming "hoax"? I just knew those icebergs were under Al gore's control!! Here is good website with lots of info. http://icecap.us/index.php Gotta say l am with Igor on this one l don't believe in Global Warrming but would like to get off reliance on using Arab oil it not helping our trade deficit. US oil trade deficit http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/03/11/business/11trade.php Edited April 28, 2008 by Ford Jellymoulds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 I just knew those icebergs were under Al gore's control!! Seems like a perfect opportunity for this one again: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 PS: if you do not believe in global warming, believe in our dependency on Middle Eastern Oil - either way - hybrids are a win .. no matter how you slice it. No they're not. My 10 year-old waverunner is very close to the silly Escape Hybrids towing capacity. Can't even tow a 16' fishing boat...completely useless. And...the U.S is using.buying.hooked on foreign oil BY CHOICE. We have more oil here in the US than anywhere else in the world...but because of the environazis...we can't get it. This country could be off of foreign oil TOMORROW...if we wanted to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 No they're not. My 10 year-old waverunner is very close to the silly Escape Hybrids towing capacity. Can't even tow a 16' fishing boat...completely useless. And...the U.S is using.buying.hooked on foreign oil BY CHOICE. We have more oil here in the US than anywhere else in the world...but because of the environazis...we can't get it. This country could be off of foreign oil TOMORROW...if we wanted to. oh ok ... yes you are napoleon ...... w/e ..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoMoCobra Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 what is so hard to understand ?!?! If you knew Leno, you would understand he is not the kind of idiot that would drive a Super Duty to work every day - he believes in purpose built cars. He once openly laughed at people who commute in super cars, Porsches and Ferraris and complain that the clutch is too hard!!! He is the kind of guy that would NOT be ashamed to drive a minivan if his situation demanded it - BECAUSE the minivan is the best suited car for his meed at the moment... then he would wipe out his Ford GT or a Bentley for a night out in town with his wife, and later, on Sunday, he would pull out an Elise or something for an afternoon alone carving curves in the mountains. it makes PERFECT sense for him to understand, admire and promote the advantages of Plug in hybrids as commuter mobiles - if all of us commuted by PHEV's we would eliminate a giant chunk of out oil consumption.... but I know you will come up with some stupid reason this all has to be a PR BS .... I just know you will ... idiots like you always get furious when they face a logical "in your face" truth .... PS: if you do not believe in global warming, believe in our dependency on Middle Eastern Oil - either way - hybrids are a win .. no matter how you slice it. Igor Igor you make a great point. It pretty much comes down to this (IMO): If Americans want to own a car that gets terrible MPG's then it should be used as a leisure vehicle. The car that is driven on a daily basis should be fuel efficient whether it is a hybrid or a civic worth 3 grand. We should all do this for our own financial good and the good of the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 No they're not. My 10 year-old waverunner is very close to the silly Escape Hybrids towing capacity. Can't even tow a 16' fishing boat...completely useless. And...the U.S is using.buying.hooked on foreign oil BY CHOICE. We have more oil here in the US than anywhere else in the world...but because of the environazis...we can't get it. This country could be off of foreign oil TOMORROW...if we wanted to. You can't even tow that much with a friggin regular Escape, and I doubt that's why people go out and purchase those vehicles to begin with. Ditto that when it comes to a lot of SUVs. And sorry you just don't decide hey lets start drilling for oil here. People need to learn how to conserve, if not for the environment but in keeping with the simple fact that natural resources are not finite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustang_sallad Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Getting back on topic here....but with all this talk of plug in hybrids....does anyone know how much your electric bill will go up recharging the batteries vs using gas to do more or less the same thing (without the Plug in Hybird engine?) I work on a car that gives you a 45 mile range on about 9kWh of charging. A kWh can go for anywhere from about 5¢ to 15¢ or even higher in some places I'm sure. So call it 90¢ for 45 miles. That's in a pretty small car though, but even if you double the cost, you get the idea that electricity is a much cheaper way to move your car around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 I work on a car that gives you a 45 mile range on about 9kWh of charging. A kWh can go for anywhere from about 5¢ to 15¢ or even higher in some places I'm sure. So call it 90¢ for 45 miles. That's in a pretty small car though, but even if you double the cost, you get the idea that electricity is a much cheaper way to move your car around. Cheaper...for now. If suddenly everybody was using an electric car, don't you think that might have just a slight influence on the cost of electricity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extreme4x4 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Well of course not................ because according to some zealots, the "only" time people would need to charge them would be overnight............... when there is plenty of extra capacity on the grid. You know, because EVERYONE works 9-5, and sleeps at night. :rolleyes: Zealots, of any color, disgust me. However, choice is a good thing........... whether it is 500hp 2-seaters, or plug-in hybrids. If many someones are willing to spend their money on something, then it is the responsibility of manufacturing to supply it. Because, if you don't, someone else will. That said, to badmouth Leno because he enjoys the vehicles that he owns, and talks about them.............. is narrow minded. He is a motorhead of the purist sort, and an American Automaker enthusiast supreme. We should herald him as such............... instead of berating him because he likes something that we don't. I have personally heard him talk about many of his vehicles, on the show, and at car shows/auctions. He is truly passionate, and is willing and happy to talk to anyone. When he talks about cars, he is a car guy.............. and not a celebrity. Just go to any event that he goes to, and you will see. Hell, if you don't do that, just post on his web site forums. He frequently goes in there and posts himself. He is never condescending......... but is always the everyman. Unlike some here, who truly believe that the only truth is the one that they choose to spew out of their pie hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Well of course not................ because according to some zealots, the "only" time people would need to charge them would be overnight............... when there is plenty of extra capacity on the grid. You know, because EVERYONE works 9-5, and sleeps at night. :rolleyes: Capacity of the grid isn't even my concern. The time of day they are being charged doesn't mean they consume any less energy to do so. As consumption increases, so does the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 You can't even tow that much with a friggin regular Escape... Yes you can... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Yes you can... 3500 lbs w/ a Class II hitch. Umm right what a whopping towing capacity. And again, who buys an Escape to tow with (hybrid or not)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critic Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 3500 lbs w/ a Class II hitch. Umm right what a whopping towing capacity. And again, who buys an Escape to tow with (hybrid or not)? Hybrid rated to Tow only 1000 lbs and you can not get a hitch installed from the factory. Not everyone tries to tow a deep sea boat behind a vehicle.. some just want to tow a yard tracter to their folks place or so. But the hybrid is not the vehicle to tow with, for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscalzo Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Based on the fact that our local Ford dealer can't give away the F-150's and up, Explorers and Expeditions, I think the public has already voted. People just don't want to pay $150 to fill the tank unless they can write it off as a business expense. Even then they are not happy with paying that amount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 Hybrid rated to Tow only 1000 lbs and you can not get a hitch installed from the factory. Not everyone tries to tow a deep sea boat behind a vehicle.. some just want to tow a yard tracter to their folks place or so. But the hybrid is not the vehicle to tow with, for sure. Fully aware of that, and that's not my issue with his above statement. Not my point. My point is that who really goes out with the thought of towing on a regular basis, and thinks gee I should get one of those Escapes. I'd be willing to bet very few. I honestly can't even recall if I've ever come across someone towing in an Escape at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 (edited) 3500 lbs w/ a Class II hitch. Umm right what a whopping towing capacity. And again, who buys an Escape to tow with (hybrid or not)? What are you...4? First you say that you can't even tow 1K pounds with a regular Escape...then...when you are WRONG, you try to play off a 3500 tow rating in a (weak) V6, FWD automobile as 'nothing special'. My grandma's 19'5" Bayliner comes in well under 3500 pounds...trailer and all. Edited April 29, 2008 by P71_CrownVic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueblood Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Here is good website with lots of info.http://icecap.us/index.php Gotta say l am with Igor on this one l don't believe in Global Warrming but would like to get off reliance on using Arab oil it not helping our trade deficit. US oil trade deficit http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/03/11/business/11trade.php Sorry, "icecap" is another oil-soaked shill website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 What are you...4? First you say that you can't even tow 1K pounds with a regular Escape...then...when you are WRONG, you try to play off a 3500 tow rating in a (weak) V6, FWD automobile as 'nothing special'. My grandma's 19'5" Bayliner comes in well under 3500 pounds...trailer and all. Where did I mention that a V-6 Escape could only tow 1000lbs? Go right ahead and back up your grandmother's bayliner up to a boat ramp and pull the boat out of the water, and let me know how well the underpowered D30 worked out for you. Just because it is capable, per a spec sheet, doesn't mean you should do it. But because you are an expert I'm sure you've launched a boat many of times. Once again you prove your ignorance. Learn how to read and comprehend before attacking me with your absurd replies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Where did I mention that a V-6 Escape could only tow 1000lbs? ...you don't even know what you said... I said that you could only tow 1000 pounds with a Hybrid Escape. YOU said that 'You can't even tow that much with a friggin regular Escape...' Well, being able to tow 3055 pounds with a 'regular' Escape means that you are WRONG. :hysterical. Clearly you CAN tow 1000+ pounds with a regular Escape. But, keep digging yourself deeper. Just because it is capable, per a spec sheet, doesn't mean you should do it. Really, so Ford is lying? So the Escape really CAN'T tow 3500 pounds? I wonder if the F-150 can really tow 11K pounds. Does Ford not have the first clue as to how much their vehicles can tow??? But because you are an expert I'm sure you've launched a boat many of times. I have launched boats more times than you can count. Once again you prove your ignorance. Learn how to read and comprehend before attacking me with your absurd replies. Are you for real??? My replies are absurd...yet...you have no idea what the tow rating is on an Escape. Go back to your playpen...the adults are talking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 ...you don't even know what you said... I said that you could only tow 1000 pounds with a Hybrid Escape. YOU said that 'You can't even tow that much with a friggin regular Escape...' Well, being able to tow 3055 pounds with a 'regular' Escape means that you are WRONG. :hysterical. Clearly you CAN tow 1000+ pounds with a regular Escape. But, keep digging yourself deeper. Really, so Ford is lying? So the Escape really CAN'T tow 3500 pounds? I wonder if the F-150 can really tow 11K pounds. Does Ford not have the first clue as to how much their vehicles can tow??? I have launched boats more times than you can count. Are you for real??? My replies are absurd...yet...you have no idea what the tow rating is on an Escape. Go back to your playpen...the adults are talking. Again reading comprehension is not your friend..... I quoted and responded to your post, where you pointed out the measly tow rating of a Hybrid Escape. Commenting that you can't even tow that much with a regular Escape. Meaning that the towing capacity of regular V-6 gasser isn't that high. So let's set that straight. Second off I did not indicate that Ford doesn't know nor comprehend how to rate a tow rating, I would hope that their engineers would know a lot more than me. Having said that the powertrain and braking that the the Escape currently offers is barely enough to motivate an unladen vehicle let alone one towing something at the max tow rating. Learn how to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 And another thing go find something that achieves the fuel economy of the Escape Hybrid and higher, that has the ability to tow a great deal more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P71_CrownVic Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 (edited) Again reading comprehension is not your friend..... Keep digging... Commenting that you can't even tow that much with a regular Escape. Meaning that the towing capacity of regular V-6 gasser isn't that high. So let's set that straight. Yeah, let's set it straight...and read VERY SLOWLY...use your finger if you have to: 3500 pounds is MORE WEIGHT than 1000 pounds. Do you understand that? Second off I did not indicate that Ford doesn't know nor comprehend how to rate a tow rating, I would hope that their engineers would know a lot more than me. Having said that the powertrain and braking that the the Escape currently offers is barely enough to motivate an unladen vehicle let alone one towing something at the max tow rating. I don't think I have ever seen someone contradict something themselves...in their VERY NEXT SENTENCE. And another thing go find something that achieves the fuel economy of the Escape Hybrid and higher, that has the ability to tow a great deal more. Jeep Liberty Diesel. 20MPG city and 30MPG on the highway...and the last gen could tow 5000 pounds (which is MORE than 3500 pounds...) Edited April 29, 2008 by P71_CrownVic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Jeep Liberty Diesel. 20MPG city and 30MPG on the highway Nice to see your fuding your numbers.... According to Fueleconomy.gov the Liberty Diesel gets 19 City 21 Combined 23 Hwy and Escape Hybrid 28 City 27 Combined 26 Hwy keep in mind that this using the new metrix that dropped most Hybrids MPG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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