Global Ford CEO backs Aussie Falcon but it may be FWD

[Deanh]

Introducing the Ford Cake.

 

 

The car for complainers who want to have it and eat it too.

and buy it used

[Edstock]

Introducing the Ford Cake.

Looks like Uriah's Heap. Don't forget to Mott the Hoople.

[Deanh]

Looks like Uriah's Heap. Don't forget to Mott the Hoople.

dammit Ed, you just cost me 99c....Itunes...Uriah Heap "stealin".....

[jpd80]

OK, here's my take:

Kuzak and Mulally are asking should a big sedan be FWD or RWD?

From the firewall back, the Falcon is a brilliant car and its internal space makes it a big winner.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mulally has said to FoA how hard is it to do a FWD version of your Falcon?

Not too hard at all if they borrow suspensions and powertrains from CD3, EUCD or D3.

 

So given that the Falcon platform can be delivered as FWD/AWD and RWD, the possibilities are limitless.

 

One platform that can deliver everything from an I-4 FWD through to a RWD V8 has to be noticed....

Edited August 26, 2008 by jpd80

[atomaro]

If they are going to do anything to the Falcon...it should be keep it RWD or make it AWD.

[NickF1011]

If they are going to do anything to the Falcon...it should be keep it RWD or make it AWD.

 

:yup: FWD Falcon would be as outrageous as their attempt to FWD the Mustang in the late 80's. It would probably be received about as well too.

[Extreme4x4]

Seeing as how Bill Ford Jr is a huge Mustang fan, I doubt that mistake will happen again............... just like I doubt that Ford would make the mistake of making the Falcon FWD/AWD.

[Deanh]

:yup: FWD Falcon would be as outrageous as their attempt to FWD the Mustang in the late 80's. It would probably be received about as well too.

Probe anyone? I vividly remember the reaction to it being rumoured to be the Stangs replacement......

Edited August 26, 2008 by Deanh

[RichardJensen]

1) Falcon can probably share a lot of components with a large FWD vehicle, apart from the floorpan and suspension bits--brakes, wiring harnesses, seat frames, accessories, maybe even the radiator.

 

2) I have serious reservations about compromising the Mustang by sharing suspension bits, floor pan, etc. with the Falcon. Ford's Mustang has a 400-500lb weight advantage over the Camaro & Challenger in no small part because it is not based on a larger car.

 

3) Ford's sales in Europe have been replaced, by and large, by FWD vehicles. The ONLY RWD vehicle that has displaced Ford is the 3-Series. Ford JM is, IMO, much more like our old friend HemiSBC--stuck in the past. TStag is the British mlhm5, etc.

Edited August 26, 2008 by RichardJensen

[taxman100]

Sounds to me like corporate politics - he is lobbying for work for Ford of Australia.

 

If Ford decides not to build a new RWD sedan, there is no reason to have a factory in Austrailia anymore, nor most of Ford of Austrailia's operations.

 

They will fall victim to the "one size fits all" mentality of Ford of shoehorning everything globally onto just a few products, which just happens to coincide with being the cheapest way short term as well.

[Deanh]

1) Falcon can probably share a lot of components with a large FWD vehicle, apart from the floorpan and suspension bits--brakes, wiring harnesses, seat frames, accessories, maybe even the radiator.

 

2) I have serious reservations about compromising the Mustang by sharing suspension bits, floor pan, etc. with the Falcon. Ford's Mustang has a 400-500lb weight advantage over the Camaro & Challenger in no small part because it is not based on a larger car.

 

3) Ford's sales in Europe have been replaced, by and large, by FWD vehicles. The ONLY RWD vehicle that has displaced Ford is the 3-Series. Ford JM is, IMO, much more like our old friend HemiSBC--stuck in the past. TStag is the British mlhm5, etc.

Mustang would even be better SMALLER than what it is, IMO it has gotten TOO big and tubby , so a shortened GRWD platform complete with control blade probably would NOT penalise weight too much, I remember jpd80 commenting the penalty there was but 100lbs....pipe dream I suppose, but sure would be nice to silence the IRS worshippers to have a world class rear end.....

[focus05]

I think this entire debate would be answered by understanding: 1) Does the GRWD still exist? and 2) What vehicles is it set to underpin?

 

The suggestion was that it does still exist, but that it may be limited to the Mustang and some Lincoln vehicles. However, depending on where Lincoln where be sold, the Falcon may remain with RWD.

 

Frankly, if the Falcon's RWD platform can be efficient, then I say keep it - it can underpin the Mustang and future Lincolns in NA and globally as well as the Falcon. I think it would be important to have a RWD platform at Ford's disposal.

[AGR]

Rather than share a platform with a bigger sedan, why wouldn't the Mustang share with the Miata and RX-8. That would seem to make the most sense to me.

I am a long time lurker, finally registered.

[Deanh]

Rather than share a platform with a bigger sedan, why wouldn't the Mustang share with the Miata and RX-8. That would seem to make the most sense to me.

I am a long time lurker, finally registered.

welcome out of the closet....not sure either of those chassis could handle a V8 up front...don't rightfully know....but theres that IRS again........

[chiefstang]

Truth on M nde 500 sales hurt a bit Nick in Post 11 touched a nerve, no doubt Ford will choose a sales winning platform based on loser.

Jesus Christ, Jelly! Shut up. You're like a broken record. Nobody on this forum gives a crap about the Mondeo, or the Cortina... At all. Most of the people here are from North America, and we would appreciate having somebody from across the pond fill us in about the goings on in Europe from a consumers point of view, but instead we get you. Non- stop about the same thing, no matter what the thread is about. And you just ramble, and spend ALL DAY talking about the same thing. Nobody cares anymore. This could have been one thread, six months ago, and over. Instead, it's been one six month rant across every thread. If someone posts about the new lugnuts on the Hybrid, you'll start about the lugnuts on the Cortina, and about how THAT'S the reason they outsold the Mondeo. Dead Horse. Stop.... There, now I bashed you. Are you happy. Damn...

[silvrsvt]

Mustang would even be better SMALLER than what it is, IMO it has gotten TOO big and tubby

 

This is what I dont get...I had a SN95 and now a S197 Mustang, How fucking small do you want the damn car?!?! You still can't fit anyone in the back seat worth a damn in the new Mustang, but yet seating in the front is worlds better then the old car. Its not that much bigger then the SN95 Mustang, just looks that way because the styling is more upright and the belt line is higher on the car. Where it did grow was mostly in width then overall length.

 

Also the Sn95 Mustang felt like I was driving around in my 86 Escort GT, not a good thing considering the mustang was 12 years newer.

 

I seriously don't think a Focus sized Mustang would sell at all.

[Deanh]

This is what I dont get...I had a SN95 and now a S197 Mustang, How fucking small do you want the damn car?!?! You still can't fit anyone in the back seat worth a damn in the new Mustang, but yet seating in the front is worlds better then the old car. Its not that much bigger then the SN95 Mustang, just looks that way because the styling is more upright and the belt line is higher on the car. Where it did grow was mostly in width then overall length.

 

Also the Sn95 Mustang felt like I was driving around in my 86 Escort GT, not a good thing considering the mustang was 12 years newer.

 

I seriously don't think a Focus sized Mustang would sell at all.

take a deep breath...step back from the ledge...had an 88 myself, car was a LOT lighter on its feet...NOTICEABLE, when i sit in the latest iteration car feels huge and cramped at the same time...back seat is token to be sure...just seems the car is a LOT larger than is really necessary...especially for a 2 plus 2....thats all....not saying Focus size at all....just a foot/ 8 inches or so....a little smaller than the Fusion?....case in point fusion is a 4 passenger and damn near the same dimensions as the 2 plus MIDGET Stang,,,granted the argument could be FWD vs RWD...but does seem the packaging of the horse is NOT efficient.

[chiefstang]

Rather than share a platform with a bigger sedan, why wouldn't the Mustang share with the Miata and RX-8. That would seem to make the most sense to me.

I am a long time lurker, finally registered.

WELCOME! :shades:

[Blueblood]

Wow, Ford continually amazes! Why not just build everything off the D3 chassis? I'm sure that will save them development money, but it won't help sales..

 

A FWD Falcon is as ridiculous as a FWD Mustang, it wouldn't be a Falcon anymore, it would be just another boring FWD Camry clone.

 

This is almost as bad as making the Explorer a FWD D3 based sled..

 

If Ford does this, they really do deserve to go under, If I wanted a Toyota I'd buy one, obviously Mulally isn't the genius we all thought he was if he thinks Ford needs to turn everything into a FWD sled. FWD doesn't automatically = good gas mileage either, he should know this considering his engineering background, and AWD cars get much worse mileage than RWD or FWD.

 

Ford is becoming nothing but the option for those who want the excitement and dynamics of a Toyota, but still want to buy American, no thanks..

 

Those 2 door 3 series are looking better and better all the time, and they get better gas mileage than Ford heavy FWD sleds!!!

[Extreme4x4]

You are just still pissed that they cancelled the Hurricane in the Mustang. LOL

 

Noone has said that is going to happen. I have a feeling that alot is being taken out of context.

 

PS, Bill Ford Jr would never let the Mustang go FWD.............. ain't gonna happen. That is his passion, and his baby.

[Blueblood]

You are just still pissed that they cancelled the Hurricane in the Mustang. LOL

 

WTF??????? it was never going into the Mustang, get your facts straight before you spout off once again. I never said ANYTHING about the Hurricane going into the Mustang. It was about the F-150, why must you lie?

 

Noone has said that is going to happen. I have a feeling that alot is being taken out of context.

 

 

I expect nothing less from Ford who has abandoned anyone who prefers a car that isn't just another appliance, I really wouldn't be surprised to learn that the next gen Mustang in 2014 goes to a version of the FWD/AWD D3 chassis.

 

PS, Bill Ford Jr would never let the Mustang go FWD.............. ain't gonna happen. That is his passion, and his baby.

 

I thought the same about the Explorer, or that they would never let the bean counters and the marketing bozo's dictate how to build their bread and butter, obviously all the cuts Mulally made to engineering and PD didn't make it to the departments that needed it most.

[armadamaster]

Oh I completely agree. I'd definitely like to see the return of a RWD Ford flagship sedan (sorry folks, the CV isn't a flagship in anyone's book anymore) with in-your-face American looks with a kiss-my-bumper engine under the hood. There's room for it in the lineup I think, so long as they develop it with limited sales in mind and don't expect it to replace the midsize sedan.

 

 

Oh yes, I do love all this "superior" RWD unibody chassis blather. Yes Ford, please bring us a better RWD platform than the Panther that will last longer than 300K-400K miles, exceed the current unmatched 75+ MPH rear end collision tests, while providing an as unyet matched ride quality without aliening law enforcement and their needs. Make sure it comes with a trunk monkey while you're at it.

 

New Panther please.

[lfeg]

Oh yes, I do love all this "superior" RWD unibody chassis blather. Yes Ford, please bring us a better RWD platform than the Panther that will last longer than 300K-400K miles, exceed the current unmatched 75+ MPH rear end collision tests, while providing an as unyet matched ride quality without aliening law enforcement and their needs. Make sure it comes with a trunk monkey while you're at it.

 

New Panther please.

 

??? Since when is it in an auto company's best interest to build a car that will last over 20 years for the average driver? They make money selling NEW CARS.

 

On the Falcon, RWD, FWD, or AWD will probably be decided on which way the local market goes. The enthusiast market is relatively small, so the bulk of cars sold today is to the "Just get me from here to there" crowd. Catching their attention will get the best results. Will there be a mainstream FWD sedan the size of the Falcon (possibly called the Falcon) and a more niche type RWD sedan on a platform that can be shared with Mustang and other specialty cars?

[old_fairmont_wagon]

Falcon? Merge with Fusion/Mondeo? You do realize you're talking about two COMPLETELY different sized vehicles here right? Maybe going forward, Ford will merge the Expedition platform with the Escape too. :rolleyes:

 

Whoops, of course you're right. I got my size classes mixed up for a moment. Though, the implication there is that there are two other platforms of similar size in use, which I guess means the Panther and the the D3.2. With the Panther slated to die, that leaves the real competition between D3x and Falcon. Given that D3 is already AWD capable, the only modification that it would need vs. the Falcon platform to make it RWD is to massage the engine bay to allow for both longitudinal and transverse mounting of engines, which would likely result in the return of an engine subframe for the engine bay.

[old_fairmont_wagon]

Rather than share a platform with a bigger sedan, why wouldn't the Mustang share with the Miata and RX-8. That would seem to make the most sense to me.

I am a long time lurker, finally registered.

 

Well, judging by the mega-miata projects that I've seen in the past (think souped up 5.0L from early 90s mustang crammed into miata engine bay) the miata platform can, in a pinch, be made to swallow a v8. The RX8 is already a stretch of the miata platform which means that it may not have much more room to stretch further. There are likely other issues with those platforms as well.