Surgen Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Most small cars like the Fiat 500 Fiesta etc are 5 star rated in Europe and some of the models you sell in the US that are sold here are not. http://www.euroncap.com/viewcomparison.aspx The IIHS did some crash tests between sub-compacts and midsize vehicles: http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr041409.html Suggest watching the video that is linked on the right. I would not want to be in the Smart Car that is hit head-on by a C-Class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpvbs Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Not sure that will be so easy. Here is the list that currently meet the requirement: Brand/Model Highway MPG Toyota Prius 45 Honda Civic Hybrid 45 Smart car 41 Volkswagen Jetta Diesel 41 Mini Cooper 37 Mini Clubman 37 Pontiac G5 XFE 37 Chevy Cobalt XFE 37 Ford Fusion Hybrid 36 Honda Civic CNG 36 Toyota Yaris 36 :reading: Is this an accurate list? EPA rates the Cobalt XFE at 30 combined. Is that all it takes to meet this new standard? Presuming that this is correct, I don't think the new standard should be too difficicult. The Cobalt, while certainly not a class leader, it isn't exactly a spartan, carbon fiber, Aveo either. It isn't really applying anything particularly hi-tech to achieve that goal - in fact, it seems to go out of its way to be the opposite of hi-tech. The 4 cyl '10 Fusion is rated as high as a combined 27, and the Focus 28. Given another 6 years (and all new models due out before anyway), picking up a few more MPG with the planned ecoboost 4cyls and automated manual transmissions it would appear to be already in the bag. Throw in some high mileage Fiestas, hydrids, and full electrics and there should be plenty of room for bigger vehicles under the average. And it fuel prices spike again, you won't have to force people to buy them either. Again, this is based on the assumption that the above vehicles are actually meeting the future criteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpvbs Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 The fuel economy requirements for light trucks will be much lower than the 42 mpg requirement for cars. The MKT is classified as a light truck. If I recall, that milage only needs to increase to an average of somewhere around 27 MPG. So basically: If new CAFE kills the MKT, it'll also kill the F-150. And don't forget, in the next few years we will be seeing a focus based crossover (and other crossovers) and transit connects (some electric ones too) that will most likely be considered trucks for CAFE purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Greene Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Mullaly just announced on National TV Ford can meet the new standards manufacturing small, medium, and large size vehicles the buying public wants. That Ford can primarily do it with fuel saving from direct injection and turbo charging smaller engines. It also probably goes without saying, some new small cars will probably be figured in the mix as well. I think exciting times are ahead.....for performance vehicles as well as people mover and work vehicles. I bet the most exciting times for performance vehicles lies ahead. (although maybe an electric motor for each driving wheel,,,,who knows?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 two positives aside from the obvious....I see Lighter weights and maybe 8 speed autos/ manuals.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 maybe 8 speed autos/ manuals.... I think thats a bit out there..the price vs performance improvement (in MPG) isn't there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 I think thats a bit out there..the price vs performance improvement (in MPG) isn't there. trust me...when rules as ludicrous as this become mandated manufacturers will have no choice...and sticker prices will take a huge hike..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford Jellymoulds Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 The IIHS did some crash tests between sub-compacts and midsize vehicles: http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr041409.html Suggest watching the video that is linked on the right. I would not want to be in the Smart Car that is hit head-on by a C-Class. Gotta say l am not a big fan of the smart car but all you can say to that is a smart car has a future and big cars are dead because Hummers of this world won't be around to be crash tested in 2016 the will become an dinosaur fossil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 trust me...when rules as ludicrous as this become mandated manufacturers will have no choice...and sticker prices will take a huge hike..... I heard on the news it would add $1200 per car. In the long term it will be good for us on several levels: chiefly less dependence on foreign oil......that alone will affect many things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 I heard on the news it would add $1200 per car. In the long term it will be good for us on several levels: chiefly less dependence on foreign oil......that alone will affect many things. It will be more than $1200, beleive me...ESPECIALLY to reach 45mpgs with ANY sort of get up and go....I agree it will be good, but guess what, the less foreign oil we buy, the less $ they make...then how do they counter...yep...you got it, RAISE THE PRICE PER Gallon ( not even mentioning the low sulphur gas soon to be mandated as well ), so, now we have more expensive cars and more expensive gas.....any advantage?.... LOST...oh, not to mention sky rocketing Insurance prices as the cost to repair exotic lighter weight materials gos thru the roof, and the propensity of most vehicles just being written off.....Elecric the answer???/, great for the coal companies, and once the electric companies see increased demand, then guess wht???? higher electricity costs due to grid upgrades to negate possible blackouts....not to mention just pure greed.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 The IIHS did some crash tests between sub-compacts and midsize vehicles: http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr041409.html Suggest watching the video that is linked on the right. I would not want to be in the Smart Car that is hit head-on by a C-Class. Really, how many of you have been in head on collisions or T-boned? Other than a couple of bumper/fender accidents I've had 0, and I'm 53 YO. By that rational we all need to buy ever escalating sized Hummers, Expeditions, etc. to be the safety "KING" Dinosaur. Whenever there is a higher standard the Chicken Littles come out: The sky is falling, the sky is falling! I call it opportunity. In this case I think Ford is ready for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Folks the 2010 Fusion S meets this standard (c. 37MPG per CAFE methodology). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Folks the 2010 Fusion S meets this standard (c. 37MPG per CAFE methodology). Fusion is but ONE part of the puzzle...how about Flex's, taurus, pickups of any type etc etc...sure, the noose may be looser on certain vehicles, but this is a pretty huge expectation to be burdened on the manufacturers..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Fusion is but ONE part of the puzzle...how about Flex's, taurus, pickups of any type etc etc...sure, the noose may be looser on certain vehicles, but this is a pretty huge expectation to be burdened on the manufacturers..... My reason for mentioning the Fusion was to correct the misinformation flying around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) My reason for mentioning the Fusion was to correct the misinformation flying around. thats ok...quite a few are laying the blame at the state of Californias feet....hilarious..... Edited May 19, 2009 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/12/18/it...-cafe-standard/ Note the date of this 35 MPG bill: 2007. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalepsy Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) Most people don't think bigger is better. The conclusion is that small cars are unsafe in an impact against anything larger. Most people have no problems with mid size cars, and modern mid size hold up well in crash test. There are a lot of options that you can pick from in between the extremes of SUVs & sub-compacts. Really, how many of you have been in head on collisions or T-boned? Other than a couple of bumper/fender accidents I've had 0, and I'm 53 YO. By that rational we all need to buy ever escalating sized Hummers, Expeditions, etc. to be the safety "KING" Dinosaur. Whenever there is a higher standard the Chicken Littles come out: The sky is falling, the sky is falling! I call it opportunity. In this case I think Ford is ready for it. Edited May 19, 2009 by Catalepsy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Well, frankly, it IS California's fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sixt9coug Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Really, how many of you have been in head on collisions or T-boned? Other than a couple of bumper/fender accidents I've had 0, and I'm 53 YO. By that rational we all need to buy ever escalating sized Hummers, Expeditions, etc. to be the safety "KING" Dinosaur. Whenever there is a higher standard the Chicken Littles come out: The sky is falling, the sky is falling! I call it opportunity. In this case I think Ford is ready for it. i wrecked a Mustang pretty bad into the back of a Silverado a few years back but thats the extent of my own personal bad accidents. i sure dont want anymore. i also mentioned the unfortunate story of my former neighbors in my other post in this thread. that was about as worst case as you can get without the other vehicle being a truck or suv. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 ...... the less foreign oil we buy, the less $ they make...then how do they counter...yep...you got it, RAISE THE PRICE PER Gallon That's counter intuitive. If demand falls, price falls. Remember $4.50 gas???? We reduced oil/gas consumption and prices dropped as fast as they went up. Hell, maybe they'll had out green stamps again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 Gotta say l am not a big fan of the smart car but all you can say to that is a smart car has a future and big cars are dead because Hummers of this world won't be around to be crash tested in 2016 the will become an dinosaur fossil As long as things need to be built and repaired in the world, there will be large vehicles in the form of pickup trucks and vans for as far into the future any of us can see. F-series will outsell Fiesta in the U.S. for years, if not decades. Care to make a wager? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Greene Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) Really, how many of you have been in head on collisions or T-boned? Other than a couple of bumper/fender accidents I've had 0, and I'm 53 YO. By that rational we all need to buy ever escalating sized Hummers, Expeditions, etc. to be the safety "KING" Dinosaur. Whenever there is a higher standard the Chicken Littles come out: The sky is falling, the sky is falling! I call it opportunity. In this case I think Ford is ready for it. That's how I see it also. Opportunity for some. Ford especially. Also....Better vehicles with more modern lighter materials. Longer lasting vehicles. Vehicles with better residual values. I personally see this as a big plus for the auto industry and the consumer. I'm beginning to think oil prices aren't going back up much. The US may be forced into a leadership position in hi volume auto manufacturing....for a change. Edited May 19, 2009 by Ralph Greene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 That's counter intuitive. If demand falls, price falls. Remember $4.50 gas???? We reduced oil/gas consumption and prices dropped as fast as they went up. Hell, maybe they'll had out green stamps again just my prediction tim, guiness wager?...oil companies will lower production to keep prices up, reality is when they see their profits lower they will use some excuse to counter....right around the corner is lower sulphur...and guess what...it WON"T be cheaper....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) Well, frankly, it IS California's fault. how, they may lobby and house fruitcake special interest groups, but they DON"T run the country..... Edited May 19, 2009 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 i wrecked a Mustang pretty bad into the back of a Silverado a few years back but thats the extent of my own personal bad accidents. i sure dont want anymore. i also mentioned the unfortunate story of my former neighbors in my other post in this thread. that was about as worst case as you can get without the other vehicle being a truck or suv. While it's a sad and unfortunate story, but driver error is still the biggest cause of serious accidents. Should we be forced to drive HUGE vehicles because of safety fears? People don't want to be told what to drive because of MPG requirements, but being cohered into what to drive out of fear is, well, even scarier. While on the subject, I think large trucks/SUVs over 5000-6000 lbs should be held to higher driving standard and licensing requirements. If they can cause that much death and destruction their owners need special instructions on handling/braking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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