silvrsvt Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 http://autos.aol.com/article/stick-shift-love-affair/ “With the teen drivers who attend our programs, their family car doesn’t have a manual transmission, so they don’t need to learn,” he explained. “We also find that parents are mainly concerned with the safety of their teen driver and a manual is one more thing to distract them from focusing on driving.” Find this comment a bit ironic...I drove my mom's Taurus wagon for a couple days (while learning to drive) then got thrown into my Dad's Escort GT, which was going to be my first car with a 5 Speed manual in it. Anyways, I always found that driving a stick on a car made you even more focused on driving and eliminated you from ever becoming a 2 foot driver because of the clutch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerM Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 My first car was a stick. Dad swore I'd get tired of it. 26 years later, I'm still driving a stick. I feel more connection with the car when I'm driving a manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Well when you're driving a stick it is much more difficult to text and hold the phone as well as drink or eat. So you would remained more focused on driving. I miss driving a stick, until I get stuck in traffic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 14, 2011 Author Share Posted February 14, 2011 it makes you more focused on the shifting whereas you can put all of your focus on the steering, accelerating, and braking if you don't have to work the clutch. hmm two of those fuctions you speak about are controlled by using a clutch :koolaid: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzach Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 it makes you more focused on the shifting whereas you can put all of your focus on the steering, accelerating, and braking if you don't have to work the clutch. i fail to see how driving "enthusiasts" think that clutching and shifting is somehow essential to the experience of driving. its not. its a compromise from an era when technology didn't offer better alternatives and its about to become extinct now lol Having to work the stick and clutch involves you in the entire driving experience, the steering, accelerating and breaking are all interrelated in the whole driving experience, and the stick is one more part of this experience. Driving a stick is not a distraction to driving it is very much a part of it and does keep you more focused on that job. Anyone saying it is a distraction does not drive a stick everyday and the statement is laughable. Driving a stick is in no way a compromise it is a choice for people who like to have greater control over their vehicle, it is not "essential" for most but it is for us "enthusiasts" which you use sarcastically, but should not, if you are really into driving and not just cars, you would find it "essential". If you do not want to drive a stick that is your choice and fine with me But remember automatic transmissions were invented so women could drive!! So enjoy your manual. I will keep driving sticks till I am dead or can't push the clutch. Oh and by the way being happy that sticks are going away because of all the lazy @ss drivers out there shows you are imature. Manuals are not better alternatives to the complete driving experience, just to those just looking for transportation! If these kids can't shift and drive mabe they should ride the bus! My son will start driving this year and he will learn to drive a stick, everyone should. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS Racing Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 If you do not want to drive a stick that is your choice and fine with me But remember automatic transmissions were invented so women could drive!! Now that is the most sexist statement I have heard in quite some time. You must not be from the Midwest farm country where many a women learned to drive Manual tranys in trucks or tractors. BTW my wife loves driving her 03 Mustang cobra. That many a MAN complained the clutch was too hard to depress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildosvt Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Now that is the most sexist statement I have heard in quite some time. You must not be from the Midwest farm country where many a women learned to drive Manual tranys in trucks or tractors. BTW my wife loves driving her 03 Mustang cobra. That many a MAN complained the clutch was too hard to depress. My wife prefered the '04 Cobra we had over the '01 Cobra, Now the '01 had a heavy clutch! She really likes the easy of the Shelbys clutch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 14, 2011 Author Share Posted February 14, 2011 The stick part of the experience was invented during a time when automated manuals were no good. there is no need for it, it does not enhance the driving experience. I guess you don't want to drive a Mustang GT500, a Ford GT, and so forth...all cars you can't get in an automatic...... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 women are better drivers than men anyways, just look at the insurance rates. The stick part of the experience was invented during a time when automated manuals were no good. there is no need for it, it does not enhance the driving experience. these days, all its good for those who enjoy stroking stick shaped objects. i don't even need to give any reasons why manuals are no good, they are going to be extinct anyways, so there is not much to argue about lol 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 It comes down to preference. Period. More people these days prefer automatics. Just the way it is. Of course, it seems every couple of years an article proclaiming the death of the manual transmission hits the presses. And every couple of years it turns out to be premature. Mark my words -- you will still be able to buy at least a handful of cars with manual transmissions well over a decade from now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 (edited) They may be becoming rare here in the states - but most of the rest of the world is a different story, where the manual transmission is still the widely accepted standard and automatics are a rare sight and usually only found in higher end brands/models. That being said, manuals will still be available in the states for years to come. There are still plenty of small cars and sports cars buyers who actually prefer the manual. As long as there is demand, there will be supply. I'm still mad about them taking away the manuals in the 1/2 to 1-ton trucks. I find a granny first gear and clutch very useful in many situations with a large load or heavy trailer - An automatic just does not give you the same control of the load at speeds less than 5 mph. I also prefer manuals in pretty much everything I drive, with large sedans being the exception, which I like better with a nice smooth automatic. Everything else though, from small cars to sports cars to any size truck or SUV, a manual transmission allows me more control and a better connection with the road and driving experience. It also forces you to pay more attention to the task of driving. Edited February 14, 2011 by Sevensecondsuv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzach Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Now that is the most sexist statement I have heard in quite some time. You must not be from the Midwest farm country where many a women learned to drive Manual tranys in trucks or tractors. BTW my wife loves driving her 03 Mustang cobra. That many a MAN complained the clutch was too hard to depress. It is not a sexist satement, it is a true statement. My wife can drive a stick, she learned on one and my sister-in-law will deive only sticks like me. I get worked up with the anti-stick crowd enjoying the decline in manual transmission percentage. The try to tell everyone that modern autos are better. But more efficient does not better make! Not wanting to drive a stick is fine but thier joy at our pain is annoying. Women are safer drivers, yes no doubt, better, some are some are not. Not the point. Sticks are for enjoying being part of the machine not for stroking. A little projection there I think. And sticks were not invented because autos were not good, there were sticks only because that is what was invented with the car, autos came later. You can have all the reasons you want that sticks are no good, they are your opinion and you are entitled to them but don't try and act like they are fact for everyone. I am sick of the auto crowd and there critcism of the stick because they feel inadequate. Get over it and like was said there will be sticks forever for us who want them, so take glee and shove it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 women are better drivers than men anyways, just look at the insurance rates. The stick part of the experience was invented during a time when automated manuals were no good. there is no need for it, it does not enhance the driving experience. these days, all its good for those who enjoy stroking stick shaped objects. i don't even need to give any reasons why manuals are no good, they are going to be extinct anyways, so there is not much to argue about lol Thank god for used and vintage vehicles. And the sports car experience sucks with an automatic even with those sucky paddles. Current Vehicles: 2002 Ford Taurus SES Sport 2002 Porsche Boxster with MANUAL Trans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 It comes down to preference. Period. More people these days prefer automatics. Just the way it is. Of course, it seems every couple of years an article proclaiming the death of the manual transmission hits the presses. And every couple of years it turns out to be premature. Mark my words -- you will still be able to buy at least a handful of cars with manual transmissions well over a decade from now. At least you can still get a Mustang, Focus, Fiesta, and Fusion with a manual if you want one. It certainly makes those four vehicles more fun to drive if you pick the manual version. The tach certainly becomes the most important gauge in vehicle and the visceral feel is so much better. That being said, I know automatics keep getting better, especially PDK with launch control. Current Vehicles: 2002 Ford Taurus SES Sport 2002 Porsche Boxster with MANUAL trans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 I have three girls, and their first car will not be an automatic. I want them concentrating on the road. That being said, they will learn how to drive a manual transmission. There are many different scenarios that could arise that they would need to know how, but it boils down to if that is the only type of vehicle available and she is in trouble, they will be able to get to where they need to go. I love my two manual Foci, but I bought them for two reasons. Mileage and simplicity. Nowadays the automatic will deliver better mileage, but until they can prove to me that it will last 200k miles, I will continue to get the manual when available. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have three girls, and their first car will not be an automatic. I want them concentrating on the road. That being said, they will learn how to drive a manual transmission. Did you mean their first car will not be a manual? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Nowadays the automatic will deliver better mileage, but until they can prove to me that it will last 200k miles, I will continue to get the manual when available. The automatics get better mileage in terms of EPA numbers (on some vehicles anyways, not all). This is largely because the automatic transmission is completely computer controlled and optimized for the EPA testing cycle. Out in the real world, gear-on-gear in a manual transmission is still a more efficient method of transmitting power than the torque converter, clutches and bands in an automatic transmission. Real world results continue to prove that a manual transmission will deliver the same or better mileage than an identical vehicle with an automatic. And I agree completely with the point about longevity. Clutches these days seem to last as long as the entire automatic transmission. I've removed more failed automatic transmissions in fewer miles than I've changed clutches in vehicles with a manual trans. A rebuilt automatic transmission is at least $1000, a new clutch kit with slave cylinder and throwout bearing is usually less than $200. Think about it - the automatic transmission is full of parts that work based on friction - of course they're going to wear out after enough miles! In contrast, a manual transmission is full of steel gears in a bath of oil - those take many, many, many more miles to wear out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esevans Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I admit I'm too lazy to drive a manual everyday. Can be fun. I don't see the point of having your child's first car be a manual though. The chances of someone having to drive a manual today is pretty limited, and a big majority of car buyers don't want them. That said, while laying in bed the other night, I thought to myself that I need to check ebay for an old truck with a three on the tree (My old man had a mid 70's Ford with a straight six we used to haul junk with). With that truck today, I bet you could park on the wrong side of town, and leave the engine running to go shopping and it wouldn't get stolen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 I love my two manual Foci, but I bought them for two reasons. Mileage and simplicity. Nowadays the automatic will deliver better mileage, but until they can prove to me that it will last 200k miles, I will continue to get the manual when available. Ford designs its powertrains to last at least 150K miles...and clutches are lucky to last that long, since its a wear item. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 At least you can still get a Mustang, Focus, Fiesta, and Fusion with a manual if you want one. Too bad outside of the Mustang, you can't get the stick in higher end models.... Did you mean their first car will not be a manual? If anything, driving a stick will make a person more engaged driving a car...after you master getting the car into first gear without stalling it, operating a stick is no harder then operating your turn signals...but then again it seems like most people have problems even doing that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 optimized for the EPA testing cycle. The EPA testing cycle lasts over an hour. I doubt very much that the transmission is pre-programmed to deliver superb mileage under the dozens of cruise and acceleration profiles on the EPA test. Manual transmission cars may be *handicapped* by the EPA test depending on whether or not the manufacturer submits a custom shift schedule for the test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT-Keith Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Having to work the stick and clutch involves you in the entire driving experience Driving a car with no power-assisted steering involves you with the experience as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT-Keith Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 The automatics get better mileage in terms of EPA numbers (on some vehicles anyways, not all). This is largely because the automatic transmission is completely computer controlled and optimized for the EPA testing cycle. Out in the real world, gear-on-gear in a manual transmission is still a more efficient method of transmitting power than the torque converter, clutches and bands in an automatic transmission. Real world results continue to prove that a manual transmission will deliver the same or better mileage than an identical vehicle with an automatic. And I agree completely with the point about longevity. Clutches these days seem to last as long as the entire automatic transmission. I've removed more failed automatic transmissions in fewer miles than I've changed clutches in vehicles with a manual trans. A rebuilt automatic transmission is at least $1000, a new clutch kit with slave cylinder and throwout bearing is usually less than $200. Think about it - the automatic transmission is full of parts that work based on friction - of course they're going to wear out after enough miles! In contrast, a manual transmission is full of steel gears in a bath of oil - those take many, many, many more miles to wear out! I would like to see some proof of your claims about mileage and longevity. It is much easier for a bad driver to wear out a clutch in a manual transmission than it is for that same drive to wear out an automated clutch or a torque converter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I would like to see some proof of your claims about mileage and longevity. It is much easier for a bad driver to wear out a clutch in a manual transmission than it is for that same drive to wear out an automated clutch or a torque converter. I would imagine most that buy a manual trans by choice nowadays really know how to use them and are very experienced. And of course if you use downshifting as braking can really maximize brake wear over time vs. an automatic trans. Light tapping of brake just before light is about all you need most of the time. I had a 1983 Mustang Convertible once upon a time with 5.0 V8 and 5 speed manual and when I sold it in 2000 it was on same brake pads and rotors with hardly any wear. Of course it had low miles as in under 45,000 miles as it was summer car only. But I doubt if brake pads would much more worn with even 80,000 miles on it. Didn't use the brakes much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerM Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 (edited) Driving a car with no power-assisted steering involves you with the experience as well. At this point, I don't know of any car that comes without power steering or brakes. And once the power-assist has failed, the leftover system isn't set up for proper unassisted function. The last car I drove without power steering or brakes (and was decent at it) was a 1971 Plymouth. And of course if you use downshifting as braking can really maximize brake wear over time vs. an automatic trans. I concluded a long time ago that brake pads are cheaper to replace than clutch disks, which is why I stopped using downshifts on anything other than snow/ice (and to limit speed going down long hills). Edited February 15, 2011 by RangerM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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