silvrsvt Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Although the message in the media may be that Ford dodged its first nationwide strike in 35 years when its UAW employees went from a razor-thin 53% voting against the proposed contract this week — to 62% in favor by yesterday at 8:30 p.m., EST. But we're told by one highly-placed union source that the closeness of the vote was likely nothing more than UAW posturing. We're told that the UAW may have stacked the deck in initial locals voting on the contract in order to scare Ford and the other two U.S. automakers into being more generous in five years when they again hit the negotiating tables. Did it work? Guess we'll find out in five years. http://jalopnik.com/the-morning-shift/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) That makes sense, sorta. maybe it was to lead with the plants that gain the least in negotiations, to motivate the workers other plants getting new work would be more motivated to vote yes. either way none of this really matters in the grand scheme of things. Edited October 17, 2011 by Biker16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) When a certain radical UAW leader stopped talking, the rank and file made their own decisions and the true vote came through, Imagine if Ford decided to scare the UAW by making the $6 billion on US plants was conditional on a yes vote Fortunately for the UAW, Ford doesn't do business that way.... Edited October 17, 2011 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 When a certain radical UAW leader stopped talking, the rank and file made their own decisions and the true vote came through, Imagine if Ford decided to scare the UAW by making the $6 billion on US plants was conditional on a yes vote Fortunately for the UAW, Ford doesn't do business that way.... do you really think it was that simple? the plants with nothing to lose (MAP and CAP) voted no, the plants that had everything to gain in the new contract voted yes. the simple math is that more plants gained in this contract than lost. this is political and all politics is local. I am disappointed in alot people here, who trully believed that this is Armageddon, and not something that happens every 4 years. how many here that seem to think that these workers are stupid, and their leaders are even dumber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 and not something that happens every 4 years The thing I find most ridiculous is that this happens every 4 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The thing I find most ridiculous is that this happens every 4 years. The last outsourcing contract (U.S. not overseas) I worked on was a 10 yr deal with a 7 yr out. And this agreement is really not that different - it sets forth work to be done and compensation for that work. There is no reason to do this every 4 years except it gives both sides another chance to try and get something back from the other side and to keep the negotiators employed on both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) how many here that seem to think that these workers are easily influenced due to trust, and their leaders are clever at manipulating a situation That is what i believe, using a position of trust to further a cause of recovering lost conditions and instilling the idea in rank and file that a "NO" vote and strike action is the only way to do it...... Compare what happened over at GM, their contract was much less than Ford's yet not a peep from UAW officials... Edited October 17, 2011 by jpd80 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 That is what i believe, using a position of trust to further a cause of recovering lost conditions and instilling the idea in rank and file that a "NO" vote and strike action is the only way to do it...... I know when my old man was working for Ford he used to tell me that the UAW used to tell them how "great" the contract was and only show the positives and you didn't know what you lost till you saw the "fine" print which was printed 6 months to Two years later!!!!!!!! I don't think the employees as are stupid as people make them out to be nor is the UAW management that smart either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordBuyer Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The disgruntled veterans who are close to or already have 30 years in at Ford need to retire by 2015 and get the hell out and do something else. Anything...hobby, volunteering, whatever. Time to hang it up when you no longer get satisfaction out of job and worry more about what other people make in company. Every organization needs new blood anyway to survive. Hopefully the new blood will really start fitlering in over next few years and disgruntled, veteran numbers sink to insignificance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weiweishen Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The thing I find most ridiculous is that this happens every 4 years. Exactly. Every four years, there will be several sleepless nights for some people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DearbornDerek Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 But as we have seen, market conditions change much quicker then 10 years....I don't think Ford wants a long contract anymore then the UAW does. The last contract was opened up by the company two years later. Almost every contract is rehash with minor differences anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biker16 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 That is what i believe, using a position of trust to further a cause of recovering lost conditions and instilling the idea in rank and file that a "NO" vote and strike action is the only way to do it...... Compare what happened over at GM, their contract was much less than Ford's yet not a peep from UAW officials... GM workers had no leverage, ford workers had leverage,becuase they could strike. Every 4 years, is because neither party wants to be trapped in a contract longer than that. elections are every 4 year for president for the same reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 GM workers had no leverage, ford workers had leverage,becuase they could strike. Every 4 years, is because neither party wants to be trapped in a contract longer than that. elections are every 4 year for president for the same reason. I wouldn't be entirely against longer presidential terms either. :shrug: Seems they spend half their terms campaigning for the next one already as it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 But as we have seen, market conditions change much quicker then 10 years....I don't think Ford wants a long contract anymore then the UAW does. The last contract was opened up by the company two years later. Almost every contract is rehash with minor differences anyway. If written properly a good contract would take future business changes into account. But I doubt the UAW would allow that because it means you essentially could not promise new or existing jobs for the life of the contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrewfanGRB Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 how many here that seem to think that these workers are stupid, and their leaders are even dumber. Uhh, do you really want this answered? This might be news to you...but stupid people are EVERYWHERE. It only comes down to hoping there aren't too many all in one place at one time or in positions of power/decision-making. Fortunately, it would appear stupid didn't win in this case. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maislebandit Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 The disgruntled veterans who are close to or already have 30 years in at Ford need to retire by 2015 and get the hell out and do something else. Anything...hobby, volunteering, whatever. Time to hang it up when you no longer get satisfaction out of job and worry more about what other people make in company. Every organization needs new blood anyway to survive. Hopefully the new blood will really start fitlering in over next few years and disgruntled, veteran numbers sink to insignificance. Why only the disgruntled ones? What difference does it make if they get satisfaction out of their job or not? Or if they worry about other people make? The only thing that should matter is if they are doing their job. Period. I don't know if you have noticed or not but, there has been very little replacement for attrition for the last decade or so. Ford's workforce is a mere shell of what it used to be. Whenever they do have grand scale hiring, there are going to be training issues to address. Quality will become a concern also. Believe it or not, experience counts in this business. I agree with you that we need new blood, but your suggestion that a certain segment of the workforce should fall on the proverbial sword is ridiculous. Everyone has different situations and things don't always go as planned in life. They'll leave when they are ready. BTW, I am thrilled with the fact that I can walk out after giving 30 years. I hope I am able to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snooter Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 fear mongering, sword rattling,,meh who cares..you need to look no farther then the uaw buffons on this board to get an insight into the pathetic nature of the uaw mindset..just go to the speshul restricted employee forum..yes they cried and were given speshul protective treatment here because as all good socialists they throw out all opposing view points..its really no biggie...if the contract had gone down replacement worker line would have been 3 miles long..that in essence is what undercut any power the uaw had in the negotiations..strike and get replaced 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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