Deanh Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 ok, its always a hot topic, but its gotten me curious, and I may perhaps be opening a can of worms, but in actuality I am curious. How do you think customers shoould be sold cars...open discussion....should cars just be sold at MSRP? Be sensible here, but there may be some valid suggestions, after all, you guys are the consumers. My point of veiw may differ, but I will refrain from becoming too passionate, probably require sutures for my tongue...in actuality though, I bet theres some ideas that could possibly be utilized at a dealership level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmm55 Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 In the last new car (05 Mustang GT) there were added dealer mark ups for several months. I paid sticker and was OK with that. One new car was a Saturday Ad special.....nice discount! Usually do a little dealing to find a good deal. I figure after 60 months a few bucks isn't a big deal for a few pennies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiicarguy Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 In my humble view, the process takes too long. I feel that the majority of the time spent with the salesperson, should be demo'ing the car, and after the paperwork is signed going over the features of the car. I know there are a ton of short cuts regarding financing, and trade in etc...however, this process should be the shortest. Have standard numbers up front. If you buy the car with our financing, here is the rate and payment, if you buy it with extras here is the new rate and financing. There should be no surprises in the finance room. Maybe if the customer wants to haggle you have a 5 percent off plan, a 15 and a 25 percent off plan for your best customers. That way the manager can say ok, here is the discount and this is where you are. I think some of the articles on the internet that try and get you to play some game with the salesman is a true waste of time. The sales people know what you are doing, and the customer knows the salesperson is aware. It breeds mistrust. These are just opinions. But I love to test drive the cars, and go over the features. It is just that the financing and haggling over the trade and price....are just draining. Like most of you I am sure, we all have jobs to do, so chopping off a couple of hours in a dealership, would work out great. And no I do not have bad credit, so it is not like the loan has to be shopped around. But even if the customer has bad credit, have a plan for that too. Most reasonable people will love it if you keep it short and sweet and if you cannot do the deal, that is ok, be up front. If they start yelling, you probably do not want them as a customer anyway, you will never make them happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettech Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Remove the middle man... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 18, 2012 Author Share Posted July 18, 2012 (edited) In my humble view, the process takes too long. I feel that the majority of the time spent with the salesperson, should be demo'ing the car, and after the paperwork is signed going over the features of the car. I know there are a ton of short cuts regarding financing, and trade in etc...however, this process should be the shortest. Have standard numbers up front. If you buy the car with our financing, here is the rate and payment, if you buy it with extras here is the new rate and financing. There should be no surprises in the finance room. Maybe if the customer wants to haggle you have a 5 percent off plan, a 15 and a 25 percent off plan for your best customers. That way the manager can say ok, here is the discount and this is where you are. I think some of the articles on the internet that try and get you to play some game with the salesman is a true waste of time. The sales people know what you are doing, and the customer knows the salesperson is aware. It breeds mistrust. These are just opinions. But I love to test drive the cars, and go over the features. It is just that the financing and haggling over the trade and price....are just draining. Like most of you I am sure, we all have jobs to do, so chopping off a couple of hours in a dealership, would work out great. And no I do not have bad credit, so it is not like the loan has to be shopped around. But even if the customer has bad credit, have a plan for that too. Most reasonable people will love it if you keep it short and sweet and if you cannot do the deal, that is ok, be up front. If they start yelling, you probably do not want them as a customer anyway, you will never make them happy. trade ins are always an issue, you can have two identical cars as far as color mileage and features, yet ones a little rough, dont think theres any way around that, kelly Blue gives an idea, but the number is but a guide and not set in stone. As for timeframes, understand completely....and i feel the same way about delivering a car...it can take FOREVER.... Edited July 18, 2012 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 18, 2012 Author Share Posted July 18, 2012 (edited) Remove the middle man... who are you pertaining too exactly Mettech? And for what reasons? Edited July 18, 2012 by Deanh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiicarguy Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 As far as the trade goes, I am sure you are using the "Black Book" etc...but maybe if you see that it is rough you have a standard chart that shows what amount of money you deduct for certain issues. In fact show it to the customer. If the car smells like an animal died inside, and it costs say 400 bucks to clean it up to recondition it, lob that off the price. If they do not like it, ask them to to get it cleaned on their dime and bring it back and you will offer more. I will bet that most people will choose the convenience of having you do it. As far as the middle man I believe Mettech is saying franchised dealers....more direct from the factory selling. I am not sure about the advantage or disadvantage....as both sides have a lot to say about that. I am just for a standardized more up front approach. It is the surprises from the buyer and the seller, that are a pain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 As far as the trade goes, I am sure you are using the "Black Book" etc...but maybe if you see that it is rough you have a standard chart that shows what amount of money you deduct for certain issues. In fact show it to the customer. If the car smells like an animal died inside, and it costs say 400 bucks to clean it up to recondition it, lob that off the price. If they do not like it, ask them to to get it cleaned on their dime and bring it back and you will offer more. I will bet that most people will choose the convenience of having you do it. As far as the middle man I believe Mettech is saying franchised dealers....more direct from the factory selling. I am not sure about the advantage or disadvantage....as both sides have a lot to say about that. I am just for a standardized more up front approach. It is the surprises from the buyer and the seller, that are a pain. well, thats pretty much how we deal with trades now, and funnily enough it seems cars are fetching closer to wholesale book than ever before, i have been quite surprized actually. As for removing Franchaised dealers, i know where hes coming from and it is perhaps the most flagrantly flawed idea Ive heard. You cannot have order direct from the factory, who would show/demo the cars and their features, who gets you approved, who structures the deal, who types the paperwork, who does the service work, where would you buy parts from?...and what if you ordered a car then backed out?....Dealers are a necessary "evil" but if you think they are the issue, see what would happen if you took them away....sometimes I think their "convenience" has become a complete afterthought. To have seperate departments for each would cost the manufacturer BILLIONS in un-necessary overheads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiicarguy Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I think the issue is that there a good amount of honest dealers, and a good amount of dishonest ones. I think the dealer body needs to do a better job of policing itself. Yes that gets done by a consumer who walks away and says never again, but they usually say never again to the manufacturer. I do not believe dealerships are evil. However the deeds of the few bad ones can be casting a shadow on the whole. Factory owned stores can be a pain too. I do not purchase Apple products because of my local Apple store. They are powerless to do anything to help when something goes wrong. My local Ford dealer where I live now, even when something is beyond their control, tries anything to fix it, if they cannot make a deadline, they call me, tell me why, and give me a new time. However, in places where I used to live the Ford Dealers were to put it mildly doing everyone a disservice. The bottom line is that transparency is key, the games need to end, customers and sellers should not be at war with one another. We do not have to be friends either, just be honest. Know what you are talking about when dealing with a customer, if you do not know the answer, say Hang on a second. And then go get the right answer! The customer should not be a scum bag either. Do not roll in with the collection agents at your heals and ask for 1.9 APR on the Ford Raptor sitting in the showroom. It does cut both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 well, thats pretty much how we deal with trades now, and funnily enough it seems cars are fetching closer to wholesale book than ever before, i have been quite surprized actually. As for removing Franchaised dealers, i know where hes coming from and it is perhaps the most flagrantly flawed idea Ive heard. You cannot have order direct from the factory, who would show/demo the cars and their features, who gets you approved, who structures the deal, who types the paperwork, who does the service work, where would you buy parts from?...and what if you ordered a car then backed out?....Dealers are a necessary "evil" but if you think they are the issue, see what would happen if you took them away....sometimes I think their "convenience" has become a complete afterthought. To have seperate departments for each would cost the manufacturer BILLIONS in un-necessary overheads. I'm gonna disagree here. A company can set up stores with inventory. Hire people on salary/per hour to sell the products. Think of it as going to Target or Best Buy. It CAN be done and succesfully... BUT it is not worth the time or money it would cost to buy out franchises and make them corporate. Honestly at the end of the day its plausible but really doesn't benefit the customer much, if at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Factory owned stores can be a pain too. I do not purchase Apple products because of my local Apple store. They are powerless to do anything to help when something goes wrong. Huh? they don't have a Genius Bar to fix whats wrong with your apple product? I had a video card go back in my Macbook Pro and they had it back to me in week or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Honestly at the end of the day its plausible but really doesn't benefit the customer much, if at all. Can't be done. It's totally illegal in most (if not all) states. Manufacturers are not allowed to sell vehicles to the public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 I'm gonna disagree here. A company can set up stores with inventory. Hire people on salary/per hour to sell the products. Think of it as going to Target or Best Buy. It CAN be done and succesfully... BUT it is not worth the time or money it would cost to buy out franchises and make them corporate. Honestly at the end of the day its plausible but really doesn't benefit the customer much, if at all. and thats been done before and failed miserably......lets mention Saturn in the car business, and circuit city in electronics....and heres a question, what about trade ins.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 I'm gonna disagree here. A company can set up stores with inventory. Hire people on salary/per hour to sell the products. Think of it as going to Target or Best Buy. It CAN be done and succesfully... BUT it is not worth the time or money it would cost to buy out franchises and make them corporate. Honestly at the end of the day its plausible but really doesn't benefit the customer much, if at all. oh and best buy is closing a large amount of stores as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aneekr Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Deanh, I recall from an old Blue Oval Forums thread that you have done courtesy deliveries at your dealership for fleet customers.What is your opinion of this system, specifically the overall coordination of activities among Ford Motor Co., the fleet management company (Wheels Inc., Donlen, ARI, GE, PHH Arval, etc.), the customer, and your dealership? Do you think that good practices from fleet can be replicated in an automotive retail sales environment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 oh and best buy is closing a large amount of stores as well... Not exactly the same thing, they are competing with online stores like Amazon, NewEgg.com etc etc. As for Saturn, well didn't help they had crappy products also... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Deanh, I recall from an old Blue Oval Forums thread that you have done courtesy deliveries at your dealership for fleet customers.What is your opinion of this system, specifically the overall coordination of activities among Ford Motor Co., the fleet management company (Wheels Inc., Donlen, ARI, GE, PHH Arval, etc.), the customer, and your dealership? Do you think that good practices from fleet can be replicated in an automotive retail sales environment? the system is seriously flawed in one major respect. Cars are bought back East because of basically how cheap they are sold. The Fleet companies dont care about the individuals driving the cars, they ahve already made their commision, HOWEVER the drivers of the ordered vehicles will take it upon themselves to visit dealerstake test drives, go through features, colors an interiors and basiclly have sales personnel treading water for .....? nothing. All we do for CDs is the DMV paperwork, and i BREIFLY go over sync and hook their phones up...but theres no 3 hour deliveries for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Not exactly the same thing, they are competing with online stores like Amazon, NewEgg.com etc etc. As for Saturn, well didn't help they had crappy products also... actually Saturns death knoll was fixed pricing along with their lineup. So, should cars be bought online?....thats also been tried...CarsDirect.com.....and they WERE middlemen.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Can't be done. It's totally illegal in most (if not all) states. Manufacturers are not allowed to sell vehicles to the public. Laws can't be changed? Like i said it can be done, its just not a big enough issue to warrant the investment or headaches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 and heres a question, what about trade ins.... Same deal as it is now really, the dealer sales manager can give prices for trade ins... This is exactly my point. IT IS possible BUT the typical buyer experience wouldn't change much so where is the advantage for the corportions or the consumer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 Same deal as it is now really, the dealer sales manager can give prices for trade ins... This is exactly my point. IT IS possible BUT the typical buyer experience wouldn't change much so where is the advantage for the corportions or the consumer? so get rid of dealerships, buy cars on line but keep dealerships open for trade in appraisals? Whats funny, is everyone wants their cake and eat it to...fact is dealerships are NOT going away... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 so get rid of dealerships, buy cars on line but keep dealerships open for trade in appraisals? Whats funny, is everyone wants their cake and eat it to...fact is dealerships are NOT going away... I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or getting hostile? I'm agreeing with you. say what you will but there just isn't a better distribution system available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiicarguy Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Huh? they don't have a Genius Bar to fix whats wrong with your apple product? I had a video card go back in my Macbook Pro and they had it back to me in week or so. Uhh yeah, but how mad would you be if you had to send your Focus back to the assembly plant for a part that would need to be replaced. The dealer even if they did not have the part, might have the option of removing it from a new car on site. As for your Macbook Pro.....why could they not replace the video card on site? I think it would be better to have on site technicians, that is what franchised dealers offer. I am not saying Apple stuff is crap, it is quite good, I am just not in love with the service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or getting hostile? I'm agreeing with you. say what you will but there just isn't a better distribution system available. nah, not hostile at all, i just dont see a way around the current modus operandi, and in all sincerity, if one can NEGOTIATE a selling price it will probably never change, but then again fixed pricing comes with its own dilemmas. You would be dealt with by a clerk on an hourly wage with a dont give a rats attitude and would get the same paycheck irrespective of how he treated you. Autonation tried this in So Cal....ANOTHER miserable failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unreal Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 (edited) I don't think dealers are going to ever go away, but I do see some changes in the future. I believe eventually the laws will be changed to allow more direct manufacturer sales, and this will allow dealerships to operate with little to no inventory, but otherwise operate pretty much like they do now. This could actually help many dealerships if they don't have to deal with inventory and its associated costs. It may also lessen the haggle hassle over price. You could order online, but would take delivery at a dealership, and the dealership, not a salesperson, would get a commission on each sale (mainly to cover the cost of the "demo" staff). Edited July 19, 2012 by Unreal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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