rmc523 Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 On 12/15/2024 at 7:24 AM, twintornados said: Or, they need to stop ignoring other platforms in the house....CD6 would be much better if only they expanded it's use. Make a SWB Explorer and call it Edge. Build a sedan top hat and call it Crown Victoria for Ford and Continental for Lincoln. They were working on that, but apparently it looked terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 57 minutes ago, rmc523 said: They were working on that, but apparently it looked terrible. Should've been an easy fix... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 2 hours ago, rmc523 said: They were working on that, but apparently it looked terrible. It looked average according to what most people have said, neither good nor bad looking, just kinda generic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 19 hours ago, akirby said: How you treat workers and business partners and how you treat customers are 2 different things. Workers and business partners are long term significant relationships. The CEO at my old company is an asshole and just forced workers back to the office 5 days a week - for absolutely no good reason. We proved during the pandemic that working from home was just as - if not more - productive. 2-3 days was a good compromise. I think he wants more people to quit so he doesn’t have to lay them off and pay severance. On the customer side it’s a very limited engagement and the only obligation is to deliver a vehicle that operates as advertised and to honor the factory warranty. Pricing is a free market decision. Nobody forces a customer to buy a product. If the price is too high they walk away. IMO customers have to be treated much better than that if company expects a greater percentage of them to remain long-term loyal and repeat buyers. Speaking from personal experience, “relationship” with customers is as important as it gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 49 minutes ago, Rick73 said: IMO customers have to be treated much better than that if company expects a greater percentage of them to remain long-term loyal and repeat buyers. Speaking from personal experience, “relationship” with customers is as important as it gets. If you buy a vehicle and it performs as expected and the warranty is honored when you have a problem, you’re a happy customer. You have to go out of your way to piss off customers (which Ford has done in some cases, repeatedly). And it only happens every 3-5 years whereas interaction with employees and partners happens every single day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick73 Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 27 minutes ago, akirby said: You have to go out of your way to piss off customers (which Ford has done in some cases, repeatedly). Which led to first of three Hondas. Denying a valid warranty claim of truly insignificant value was bad enough based on the principle of it all, but how they went about it ended a long and previously loyal relationship. At least for a very long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 1 hour ago, DeluxeStang said: It looked average according to what most people have said, neither good nor bad looking, just kinda generic. Eh, I remember people that say it saying proportions were off. Generic could be fixed - proportions are more difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 (edited) 4 hours ago, twintornados said: Should've been an easy fix... It was that bad that Ford cancelled it late in development, a couple of camoed mules were spotted then nothing… Edited December 16, 2024 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted December 16, 2024 Share Posted December 16, 2024 2 hours ago, jpd80 said: It was that bad that Ford cancelled it late in development, a couple of camoed mules were spotted then nothing… Like what was so bad about it? How did it compared to the Chinese edge we have now for example? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 (edited) 8 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Like what was so bad about it? How did it compared to the Chinese edge we have now for example? Who knows. The people who have seen it fully uncovered reckoned the proportions were wrong /stumpy not unlike what Toyota did with its Landcruiser 300/ 250 Prado but interestingly…. It was also cancelled right about the time the three row BEV was reassigned to OAC and when we learned that there was no replacement for CD4 Edge/Nautilus. What a coincidence…. In another universe, CD6 Explorer and Edge vehicles would have been developed together as better proportioned LWB & SWB versions Truth be told, the Chinese Edge is probably a more space and fuel efficient vehicle Edited December 17, 2024 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 6 hours ago, jpd80 said: Who knows. The people who have seen it fully uncovered reckoned the proportions were wrong /stumpy not unlike what Toyota did with its Landcruiser 300/ 250 Prado but interestingly…. It was also cancelled right about the time the three row BEV was reassigned to OAC and when we learned that there was no replacement for CD4 Edge/Nautilus. What a coincidence…. In another universe, CD6 Explorer and Edge vehicles would have been developed together as better proportioned LWB & SWB versions Truth be told, the Chinese Edge is probably a more space and fuel efficient vehicle Only reason to make Edge RWD is to support a high performance version with 400-500 hp. But if you’re going to do that then it should be a Mustang model. FWD/AWD hybrid is a much better option. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 1 hour ago, akirby said: Only reason to make Edge RWD is to support a high performance version with 400-500 hp. But if you’re going to do that then it should be a Mustang model. FWD/AWD hybrid is a much better option. I think Edge's client base was happy with the FWD/AWD layout - additional power for an ST model previously supplied by the 2.7 could've been replaced with a hybrid powertrain. I think Nautilus' recent success has shown that it's a perfectly acceptable layout for the segment, especially if you give it a great design. I think Ford anticipated Edge to be offset by a more direct BEV replacement (don't tell me Mach E is the replacement - it isn't), so they threw the plans out the window and then changed plans as Ford does without lining a replacement back up. I don't think the Chinese Edge would be successful here - unlike Nautilus, its a different form factor/shape than the one everyone is used to, and IMO steps on Explorer's toes too much. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted December 17, 2024 Author Share Posted December 17, 2024 1 hour ago, rmc523 said: I think Ford anticipated Edge to be offset by a more direct BEV replacement (don't tell me Mach E is the replacement - it isn't) It is in price, but like the Maverick its not a direct segment replacement. 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 5 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said: It is in price, but like the Maverick its not a direct segment replacement. 😛 Speaking of direct replacements.....I'll have to get used to the updated username lol 2 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted December 17, 2024 Author Share Posted December 17, 2024 1 minute ago, rmc523 said: Speaking of direct replacements.....I'll have to get used to the updated username lol yeah figured using a 20 year old username from a crappy car I owned needed to to be changed Though I can't remember what my original username was when this was before BON was BON Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 8 hours ago, akirby said: Only reason to make Edge RWD is to support a high performance version with 400-500 hp. But if you’re going to do that then it should be a Mustang model. FWD/AWD hybrid is a much better option. Absolutely, I’m intrigued by 2.0 EB hybrid idea… Word is that CD6 development was pushed by Fields and after he left, everything was scaled back. The pursuit of RWD based SUV/ Utility was basically covered by Explorer. Had Fields not developed CD6 Edge, that time could have been spent switching CD4 products to C2 as a better global product the Nautilus too which is what we got from China. Thinking far less disruptive for OAC to have just picked C2 evolution years ago…… 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted December 17, 2024 Share Posted December 17, 2024 1 hour ago, jpd80 said: Absolutely, I’m intrigued by 2.0 EB hybrid idea… Word is that CD6 development was pushed by Fields and after he left, everything was scaled back. The pursuit of RWD based SUV/ Utility was basically covered by Explorer. Had Fields not developed CD6 Edge, that time could have been spent switching CD4 products to C2 as a better global product the Nautilus too which is what we got from China. Thinking far less disruptive for OAC to have just picked C2 evolution years ago…… I’ve said repeatedly that cd4 was a mistake and not giving edge and nautilus a hybrid was a huge mistake. Typical Ford poor product planning. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted December 18, 2024 Share Posted December 18, 2024 15 hours ago, akirby said: Only reason to make Edge RWD is to support a high performance version with 400-500 hp. But if you’re going to do that then it should be a Mustang model. FWD/AWD hybrid is a much better option. As excited as I am about the prospect of expanding the mustang brand, offering multiple mustang SUVs would be a bridge too far imo. A sedan, maybe some sort of small electric hatchback inspired by the foxbody, and a mid-engine variant would be good choices to flush the brand out further. But anything beyond that would be kinda ridiculous imo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted December 18, 2024 Author Share Posted December 18, 2024 8 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: As excited as I am about the prospect of expanding the mustang brand, offering multiple mustang SUVs would be a bridge too far imo. A sedan, maybe some sort of small electric hatchback inspired by the foxbody, and a mid-engine variant would be good choices to flush the brand out further. But anything beyond that would be kinda ridiculous imo. Doing a smaller Mustang outside of an EV would be a complete nonstarter with CAFE and I really don't think anyone is looking for a 2 door hatchback that is the size of the Focus that would cost $40-50K if we are lucky. The vast majority of car buyers want a "flexible" vehicle because of the costs involved. The Mustang coupe gets a pass because its normally a secondary or third car. I don't think a retro EV Foxbody Mustang would be really a hit with car buyers, even though it would be a prime thing for people of my generation. I can see this in the future: 2 door Mustang 4 door Mustang Maybe an off road capable Mustang sedan that is like the Dakar Porsche 911. Mustang crossover-this is covered by the Mach E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 18, 2024 Share Posted December 18, 2024 14 hours ago, akirby said: I’ve said repeatedly that cd4 was a mistake and not giving edge and nautilus a hybrid was a huge mistake. Typical Ford poor product planning. I remember when the CD4 Edge/MKX came out, that we were all wondering when they'd add the Fusion/MKZ's hybrid to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted December 18, 2024 Share Posted December 18, 2024 2 hours ago, Sherminator98 said: Doing a smaller Mustang outside of an EV would be a complete nonstarter with CAFE and I really don't think anyone is looking for a 2 door hatchback that is the size of the Focus that would cost $40-50K if we are lucky. The vast majority of car buyers want a "flexible" vehicle because of the costs involved. The Mustang coupe gets a pass because its normally a secondary or third car. I don't think a retro EV Foxbody Mustang would be really a hit with car buyers, even though it would be a prime thing for people of my generation. I can see this in the future: 2 door Mustang 4 door Mustang Maybe an off road capable Mustang sedan that is like the Dakar Porsche 911. Mustang crossover-this is covered by the Mach E. Agreed, but what about a smaller mustang 4 door hatchback EV based on CE1 that took styling from the foxbody. The foxbody already has that upright hatchback shape to begin with. That way you're appealing to the hatchback crowd, the foxbody crowd, the EV crowd, and the people who want to see a smaller, cheaper mustang, all at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted December 18, 2024 Author Share Posted December 18, 2024 23 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said: Agreed, but what about a smaller mustang 4 door hatchback EV based on CE1 that took styling from the foxbody. The foxbody already has that upright hatchback shape to begin with. That way you're appealing to the hatchback crowd, the foxbody crowd, the EV crowd, and the people who want to see a smaller, cheaper mustang, all at the same time. Not sure how much smaller it would actually be? The CE1, if positioned as a truck, would be over 200 inches long. The current Mustang Coupe is roughly 190 inches long The old Fox body was 179 inches, or roughly the size of the Focus Sedan. I don't think a Fox body sedan would look great proportionally in smaller form factor with todays safety standards affecting it. Plus given how angular they where, I think they'd give Hyundai a run for their money in doing an ugly 8 bit/80s styling modernized with it That is coming from someone who like that too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeluxeStang Posted December 18, 2024 Share Posted December 18, 2024 21 minutes ago, Sherminator98 said: Not sure how much smaller it would actually be? The CE1, if positioned as a truck, would be over 200 inches long. The current Mustang Coupe is roughly 190 inches long The old Fox body was 179 inches, or roughly the size of the Focus Sedan. I don't think a Fox body sedan would look great proportionally in smaller form factor with todays safety standards affecting it. Plus given how angular they where, I think they'd give Hyundai a run for their money in doing an ugly 8 bit/80s styling modernized with it That is coming from someone who like that too. Depends on how it's designed. I like this foxbody proposal they did while working on the s650. Make the greenhouse a bit longer, and taller, and it wouldn't look half bad imo. It kinda sounds like CE1 is a does everything can be basically anything kinda platform. So I don't see it's size being restricted by this upcoming truck. IDK, something like this called the mustang stallion or mustang fox would be interesting imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherminator98 Posted December 18, 2024 Author Share Posted December 18, 2024 9 minutes ago, DeluxeStang said: Depends on how it's designed. I like this foxbody proposal they did while working on the s650. Make the greenhouse a bit longer, and taller, and it wouldn't look half bad imo. It kinda sounds like CE1 is a does everything can be basically anything kinda platform. So I don't see it's size being restricted by this upcoming truck. IDK, something like this called the mustang stallion or mustang fox would be interesting imo. You think that looks like a fox body? I think we might have our wires crossed...I'm thinking the 80s, not the SN95 Mustang from 1994. When you say Fox Mustang Sedan, this is what I'm thinking styling wise : 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 18, 2024 Share Posted December 18, 2024 3 hours ago, DeluxeStang said: Agreed, but what about a smaller mustang 4 door hatchback EV based on CE1 that took styling from the foxbody. The foxbody already has that upright hatchback shape to begin with. That way you're appealing to the hatchback crowd, the foxbody crowd, the EV crowd, and the people who want to see a smaller, cheaper mustang, all at the same time. Not everything has to be called Mustang, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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