Lionel Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) In 2013, the Australian V8 Supercars are purportedly holding a round in Texas at Circuit of the Americas, as some may be aware. It should be late in the year, so the participating cars will be the Chevrolet SS, Nissan Altima and Ford Falcon (?). The Cheverolet will be most likely a rebadged,reliveried VF Commodore, and by that time the SS will have developed enough of a following to attract a crowd to this event. The Altima is also on sale in the US, so should generate interest from the public at some level. Which brings me to Fords entry. Its a widely held belief at the moment by the public of Australia that the Falcon is headed for the history books. This perception is fueled by a combination of slightly tabloid-esque media speculation, aswell as seemingly lacklustre marketing by the local division. One Ford seems to be the catalyst for this train of thought, but looking at vehicles like the new Mondeo/Fusion, and the new RWD Transit proves there is hope. The Transit especially has an endearing character, and its clearly being recognised to the point where its finally getting a US Visa. Falcon, to me has a great deal of character and unique attributes and would fit well in Ford's global portfolio. I know Americans think the current model looks bland and not very modern, which is understandable. in the context of this race, FordUS has a chance to leverage off the Altima and SS's marketing and gain insight from a rare exposure to American eyes of this product. If there is enough support, they might consider taking the nameplate global, and pouring global development costs into it. Obviously not the current model, but if Fords serious about maintaining its image of driver appeal, they would be foolish to throw away their most sophisticated RWD platform. And I guess this is academic if the SS flops. It could, however lead to a twist of fate if enough people care, or want it enough. Does anybody think there is a chance of it gaining interest from this exercise? Do you think Ford US will give the public a chance to get up close and personal with display cars and give valuable feedback? Edited September 9, 2012 by Lionel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Does anybody think there is a chance of it gaining interest from this exercise? No, I doubt most people will even know that it happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Ford Performance Racing in OZ has a great picture gallery: http://www.fpr.com.au/category/photo-gallery/ Wow, real opening doors; NASCAR hasn't done this in 50+ years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4d4evr-1 Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Obviously not the current model, but if Fords serious about maintaining its image of driver appeal, they would be foolish to throw away their most sophisticated RWD platform is this statement true? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edstock Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Obviously not the current model, but if Fords serious about maintaining its image of driver appeal, they would be foolish to throw away their most sophisticated RWD platform is this statement true? Obviously, you need glasses. Here's a 2012 Falcon: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) Obviously, you need glasses. Here's a 2012 Falcon: Edited September 9, 2012 by BORG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKII Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Great entertainment IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Still doesn't take away from the fact that the car hasn't had a whole new top hat since...um I don't know when...the Taurus and Fusion both have had one in the past 3-4 years..and the Taurus just got a MCE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Obviously not the current model, but if Fords serious about maintaining its image of driver appeal, they would be foolish to throw away their most sophisticated RWD platform is this statement true? If you're talking about the "most sophisticated RWD platform" comment, it's debatable, but it's not like there's an objective standard for "sophisticated" in this sense. And it's not like there's a lot of competition--Ford currently only has two RWD cars (Falcon and Mustang), and they aren't exactly directly comparable. If you're talking about "foolish to throw away," maybe, maybe not. If it's going to cost more to update the platform than it will return in profits, then it's foolish to keep it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) Squint hard and you can see how the next Falcon update in 2014 wili look like the Fusion... If Falcon does indeed morph into the same look as Fusion-Mondeo that makes it desirable? Edited September 9, 2012 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORG Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Squint hard and you can see how the next Falcon update in 2014 wili look like the Fusion... If Falcon does indeed morph into the same look as Fusion-Mondeo that makes it desirable? Is AWD and MyFord Touch included in that morph? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 (edited) Is AWD and MyFord Touch included in that morph? MFT yes but no to AWD....the design is AWD and LHD preserved, Falcon needs big brother USA to embrace and take to next level with proper funding.. We are hearing that as of 2016, no more being left behind....this could mean either of two things but the fact that FoA continues to progressively evolve Falcon says it is not done yet, the impressions will change with an up to date corporate styled front and rear for 2014. Falcon already uses EUCD/CD4 slim door tech and side frames, is rumored to switch to CD4 styled harness to upgrade to MFT and other leading features.. Would you do that with a dead end product? The supercharged 5.0 is simply awesome bit of gear., low 12 second quarter with factory settings.... Edited September 10, 2012 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark B. Morrow Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Side by side with the Fusion and Taurus, it's amazing just how dated the Falcon looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 Side by side with the Fusion and Taurus, it's amazing just how dated the Falcon looks. Granted but everybody seems to have missed my point. Proportions are better, and its whats underneath thats worth preserving IMO. If you saw them side by side IN PERSON, you'd glean much more about the car visually then from some images on a forum. Ford has an opportunity to display it in person and for all at this event but will they? If you're talking about the "most sophisticated RWD platform" comment, it's debatable, but it's not like there's an objective standard for "sophisticated" in this sense. And it's not like there's a lot of competition--Ford currently only has two RWD cars (Falcon and Mustang), and they aren't exactly directly comparable. If you're talking about "foolish to throw away," maybe, maybe not. If it's going to cost more to update the platform than it will return in profits, then it's foolish to keep it... Mc Pherson Strut vs aluminium Virtual Pivot front, Multi Link rear vs SRA..Hmm pretty straight forward to me. I'm just trying to ascertain if Ford will use this opportunity to do some market research there. GM thinks there a business case for RWD sedan. I would have thought theres enough driving enthusiasts in USA to look past the CURRENT sheetmetal and see whats underneath? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 GM thinks there a business case for RWD sedan. They thought there was a business case for the XLR. They thought there was a business case for the STS. They thought there was a business case for the GTO. They thought there was a business case for the G8. They thought there was a business case for the Solstice. Any more questions? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 (edited) They thought there was a business case for the XLR. They thought there was a business case for the STS. They thought there was a business case for the GTO. They thought there was a business case for the G8. They thought there was a business case for the Solstice. Any more questions? Meanwhile there IS a business case for Chrysler LX platform and Caprice, it seems. Edited September 10, 2012 by Lionel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullynd Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 and Caprice, it seems. Is there? Even if they bring the 90s looking Falcon here, few will notice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 (edited) Is there? Even if they bring the 90s looking Falcon here, few will notice. 90s looking?That is the just recently superseded Ford European Kinetic style. Our Falcon is still in alignment with current Global Mondeo..... Edited September 10, 2012 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 (edited) The point is that Falcon's product cycle is not in alignment with latest US products. Come 2014, that should be remedied... Edited September 10, 2012 by jpd80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 The point is that Falcon's product cycle is not in alignment with latest US products. Come 2014, that should be remedied... But if its just a conservative interpretation of Kinetic 2.0, then it will be in the same boat. FWIW, I think the current model looks great in person. Maybe on styling alone it won't make a huge impression at the event, but seeing the car in its heroic livery might engender some excitement towards it. Anyone who would like a RWD sedan in Fords future product lineup should get behind it. It might make things interesting in Dearborn boardrooms... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Mc Pherson Strut vs aluminium Virtual Pivot front, Multi Link rear vs SRA..Hmm pretty straight forward to me. That's the problem with an amorphous term like "sophisticated." I'd say the Mustang's chassis is quite sophisticated because of what they're doing with those struts and the live axle--the people who gripe about it not having an IRS can't actually point to where the Mustang's handling or ride actually suffer from that absence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 (edited) That's the problem with an amorphous term like "sophisticated." I'd say the Mustang's chassis is quite sophisticated because of what they're doing with those struts and the live axle--the people who gripe about it not having an IRS can't actually point to where the Mustang's handling or ride actually suffer from that absence. Allow me to try. Between 1982-2002 the Falcon had a very well sorted Watts link SRA, that gave our GM-H competitor a run for its money.. The different characteristics of the D/E market in Australia vs US are night and day. Which is illustrated when a US spec Mustang is tested on our dismal roads. I think Wheels magazine summed it up in a comparison between CV8Z Monaro, grey-import Mustang and Challenger when they said to the effect of: " Mustang(2005-) has the turn in of an MX-5, but the rear axle skips over bumps like an EA (1988) Falcon." The current Falcon's suspension setup compares favourably to BMW/Mercedes and has done since BA (2002), for ride/dynamics. . That sums up why I created this thread: I don't want a) Mondeo to be Fords largest car here, b ) our staple sedan to become a blunt Taurus spin-off with lots of distracting SYNC garbage to "compensate". We have a creative division in Ford Australia, that invented the pickup in 1934, among other things. I hope this One Ford business doesn't kill my favourite car... Edited September 10, 2012 by Lionel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Meanwhile there IS a business case for Chrysler LX platform and Caprice, it seems. The point was that you can't trust GM's decision making on these things. The LX platform was basically a leftover E class from parent MB which makes the business case much easier. Also Chrysler was trying to make inroads into a new market segment for them and they had no other existing products to worry about. And the jury is still out on Caprice. Given the success of GTO and G8 I really doubt that Caprice will succeed either. The full sized sedan market is small and shrinking to begin with and the market for high performance sedans is even smaller. It can be done with the right platform (shared across multiple vehicles) and proper planning (shared production facilities) but it's more difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 90s looking? The big issue is the greenhouse: 1990 Falcon: 1995 Falcon 2000 Falcon 2005 Falcon 2012 Falcon The last big change to the green house was nearly 12 years ago...and the update in 2000 wasn't a huge change from what was found on the 1990 Falcon (IMO) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerLS Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Allow me to try. "Sophisticaed" is still a qualitative term; without objective criteria, it's all opinion. We have a creative division in Ford Australia, that invented the pickup in 1934, among other things. That's a neat trick, inventing something nine years after Ford started producing it... I hope this One Ford business doesn't kill my favourite car... I hope so, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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