Transit Connect

[silvrsvt]

Ford has to be doing this for a reason, to reach an unserviced customer. I am absolutely convinced that the Transit Connect Wagon won't find the customer they think they are going to fetch and they are going to waste money trying to communicate to that customer. It's such a hideously marginal (lets toss that in) attempt at a cheap people hauler. It's sloppy decision making

 

Wasn't this the same excuse used for not bringing over the TC to start with? Whats the big deal? The TC is already sold as a wagon in the states with no advertising (at least that I've seen) and it been doing well since its introduction with its yearly sales increasing 15-20% every year. This doesn't cost Ford much money at all to do, so why not do it?

[rkisler]

That's all fine and good but you forgot the reason why Ford sells the wagon version in the US in the first place... they are all imported like this to avoid chicken tax!

 

So this is the make lemonade with lemon solution - it has really very little to do with the mainsteam minivan market. If Ford can increase the retail sale of Transit Connect (I'm using a short hand here... retail sale = wagon, fleet sale = van), it increases the profit margin of the program overall because they all arrive at port as wagons.

 

If you look at this vehicle in a vaccum, it makes less sense. But if you consider the fact that every Transit Connect arrives with seats and windows and Ford has to hire someone to toss out the seats knock out the glass, then it doesn't take long to figure out that the more wagon they sell, the better the financial statements look.

 

Now I'm assuming that Ford has looked at its sales data (they have 3 years worth of Transit Connect wagon sales data) and determined that they can increase the retail vs. fleet mix with minimal investment. The 1.6 turbo and more upscale interior will also likely to attract more retail sales.

 

Thanks, bzcat. I didn't forget. I am aware of program profitability and incremental profits from derivative products, and I'm also aware of chicken tax issues.

 

But I am also aware that just throwing a product into a marketplace doesn't mean it will be successful. For a mass market product to have any sort of critical mass, you need at least 30k upa which the TC is now achieving. At that point, the product can have some sort of minimal advertising support and dealers will be more wiling to stock it. But even then, the product won't find itself on the crowded showroom floor which limits customer attention and also limits salesperson concentration. TC cargo is a bit different as it is a very unique commercial product, so I see nothing but upside. The passenger version of the TC is going to have to be sold pretty much like today's passenger TC -- as a version of the overall product. Which means it will make the brochure, but not much else. But...it's more complex with upscale options like the BAMR which means ordering, scheduling, and stocking will be more complex and difficult. Please see Deanh's comments in #62 to get a sense of how tough ordering & scheduling is with an imported product including long lead times. So, given long lead times which means you won't be building to customer order, what passenger versions will the dealers order, if anything, for their inventory recognizing that those units will end up on "the back 40" in their lot? (Deanh, please feel free to correct me if my impressions are wrong.)

 

I think there is a potential small market for this product. Maybe Ford's internal data sees a larger market or believes the "white space" opportunity is too good to pass up. Or maybe Ford figures "why not?" and is willing to test the waters because the TC is already certified for sale in the U.S. and, as you mention, they are coming in as wagons anyway. Dunno. My opinion doesn't matter, because Ford is going to give it a go and I hope I'll be pleasantly surprised.

[akirby]

You just accused me of not having the facts and then made up your own about the wagon/hatchback.

Right now, HMO is running at full bore just to satisfy demand for sedans. It's a safe bet hatches and wagons can't be accommodated.

 

With Flat Rock online? Maybe. Now? No.

 

What Richard said. It's a fact that HMO is at full capacity with just the sedans until Flat Rock is online.

[mettech]

Im surprized only due to the rumours I heard it was going to be produced here, ANYTHING is better than the system instilled right now, I can literally have a vin number and run a trace, I CANNOT find out a Transit Connects status until it LITERALLY lands on the lot....hopefully Spain will be better....but I would like to know Fords reasoning behind it not being manugfactured here, or is this just a ramification of the "One Ford " strategy,...manufacture them closer to where the biggest market for said vehicle is?....

 

Ford Motor Co.'s new Transit Connect Wagon is headed to showrooms in the United States late next year, but the family vehicle won't be manufactured here in North America.

Instead, the automaker will make its Valencia, Spain assembly plant a hub for Transit Connect Wagons. That will help to solve two of the company's biggest conundrums: a lack of manufacturing capacity in North America and excess capacity in struggling Europe.

"There's minimal room here even though they could squeeze it in if they needed to," said Joe Langley, an automotive forecaster at Troy-based LMC Automotive. "The volume doesn't warrant retooling here, too, especially with the capacity constraints."

Here in North America, Ford is operating at 114 percent capacity, vice president of North American manufacturing Jim Tetreault told reporters last week. But in Europe, capacity is at just about 50 percent of maximum output, according to analysts. Ford has desperately tried to match European production to meet demand, much like it did in its North America restructuring following the recent auto crisis.

 

 

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121114/AUTO0102/211140320#ixzz2CCrjoUXC

[mackinaw]

....but I would like to know Fords reasoning behind it not being manugfactured here, or is this just a ramification of the "One Ford " strategy,...manufacture them closer to where the biggest market for said vehicle is?....

 

From the Detroit News:

 

 

"Ford Motor Co.'s new Transit Connect Wagon is headed to showrooms in the United States late next year, but the family vehicle won't be manufactured here in North America.

 

Instead, the automaker will make its Valencia, Spain assembly plant a hub for Transit Connect Wagons. That will help to solve two of the company's biggest conundrums: a lack of manufacturing capacity in North America and excess capacity in struggling Europe.

 

"There's minimal room here even though they could squeeze it in if they needed to," said Joe Langley, an

automotive forecaster at Troy-based LMC Automotive. "The volume doesn't warrant retooling here, too, especially with the capacity constraints."

 

Valencia's capacity hovered just north of 50 percent last year, according to Ward's Automotive and Sterne Agee. Five years ago, the plant, which has a capacity of about 400,000 units, ran at more than 100 percent."

 

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitne...0#ixzz2CCtl9xXf

Edited November 14, 2012 by mackinaw

[Bob Rosadini]

wow-didn't take long for this to go to four pages. Without thought to any of the points raised here, I can say my wife's reaction was .."I want one-its cute snd it looks like I can see out the back",

 

She is due of a replacement for her 2004 Explorer and she does not like the driving position of the new Explorer as she claims she "can't see what is in back of her in traffic". I say- that is what side mirrors are for but that gets me no where. Her choice? A Honda Pilot!

 

Needless to say, that would be very tough for this old boy to do.

[akirby]

So is this the new Aerostar?

[BORG]

What Richard said. It's a fact that HMO is at full capacity with just the sedans until Flat Rock is online.

 

And then we'll get the hatchback and wagon, I'll wait for that because I'm sure that will happen.

[akirby]

And then we'll get the hatchback and wagon, I'll wait for that because I'm sure that will happen.

 

I didn't say we would or would not. I said it was a moot point to discuss it until Ford had the capacity to actually build them here. We should know whether that's planned for 2014 within the next 6 months or so - that's the first reasonable opportunity to do it.

[Deanh]

You can add sales by doing lots of things, it doesn't mean it's worth doing. Hey, why not a Fusion wagon and hatchback? Lets throw that it in while we're at it, it has to add more sales right? Ford has to be doing this for a reason, to reach an unserviced customer. I am absolutely convinced that the Transit Connect Wagon won't find the customer they think they are going to fetch and they are going to waste money trying to communicate to that customer. It's such a hideously marginal (lets toss that in) attempt at a cheap people hauler. It's sloppy decision making and I have the same sort of befuddlement with this vehicle that I had with the Freestyle and Flex, a vehicle that makes sense to management but not consumers. I had similar hatred for the Grand C-Max which made NO sense for the US market, and it's clear Ford doesn't know what to do right here and they keep grasping at what they have available. This is not good enough and I don't want to see this cruft piling up at Ford. Do it right or stay out of it.

 

And yes, I know there isn't much at stake here, but I'm annoyed by the attempt.

with that thinking we would still only be able to buy Trucks with vynyl interior and XL trim, after all the F-series started as purely commercial as well right?

[Deanh]

So is this the new Aerostar?

my thoughts exactly....

[Deanh]

Throwing out some more facts here...the old TC sold nearly 32K units last year, an increase of 16% over the prior year. Right now as of October, its increased sales by another 13% over 2011...so the market for the TC is growning and the improved model with a better interior and better powertrains should keep the year to year growth rate up on this product.

and right now there is a severe shortage....I have seen BOATLOADS arriving for Enterprize leasing, they may have sucked up a large %

[SoonerLS]

with that thinking we would still only be able to buy Trucks with vynyl interior and XL trim, after all the F-series started as purely commercial as well right?

I'm pretty sure the F-Series was never "purely commercial," even if you consider agriculture to be commercial. If you want to limit that to Super Duties or F-350s and up, then maybe...

Edited November 14, 2012 by SoonerLS

[Deanh]

I'm pretty sure the F-Series was never "purely commercial," even if you consider agriculture to be commercial. If you want to limit that to Super Duties or F-350s and up, then maybe...

go back 20 years, sure as hell wasnt any King ranch editions.....lol

[SoonerLS]

go back 20 years, sure as hell wasnt any King ranch editions.....lol

Nope, there weren't, but the F-Series still wasn't entirely (or even primarily) commercial. People in my family have been driving them for well over 60 years; in fact, I still have my grandfather's '51 F1...

[akirby]

Nope, there weren't, but the F-Series still wasn't entirely (or even primarily) commercial. People in my family have been driving them for well over 60 years; in fact, I still have my grandfather's '51 F1...

 

I grew up in a rural farming area and pickups were the default vehicle for at least half the people in the community, if not more. And it didn't matter whether they needed them or not. And that was before supercabs and crewcabs became widespread - these were mostly regular cab half ton and quarter ton trucks. And I don't think that's changed much.

 

Even back in the 70s they had F100 Rangers and Lariats with nice interiors and features.

[Deanh]

Nope, there weren't, but the F-Series still wasn't entirely (or even primarily) commercial. People in my family have been driving them for well over 60 years; in fact, I still have my grandfather's '51 F1...

I think my angle has been missed, dare I say back in 1948 trucks were used more for their utility than for their luxury accruements, now compare the 1948 with todays, supercabs, crewcabs, leather sunroofs, mega stereo systems etc etc, and it all stemmed from a pretty basic beginning...segue to the new Transit connect.....oh, and give me your 51.... Edited November 14, 2012 by Deanh

[BORG]

go back 20 years, sure as hell wasnt any King ranch editions.....lol

 

They called it Eddie Bauer back then.

[Deanh]

They called it Eddie Bauer back then.

heh heh, and look what happened to him.....all im saying Borg is the line is blossoming to embrace a broader audience, and it wont hurt a bit....( although that said Im not fancying the Emperors new clothes, but will wait to see it in the flesh, one of the TCs strengths was its simplicity of design, someone had one too many expresso shots here....)

[Deanh]

They called it Eddie Bauer back then.

HATED those two tone bling mobiles....do remember the manual trans with the straight 6 though....

[timmm55]

wow-didn't take long for this to go to four pages. Without thought to any of the points raised here, I can say my wife's reaction was .."I want one-its cute snd it looks like I can see out the back",

 

She is due of a replacement for her 2004 Explorer and she does not like the driving position of the new Explorer as she claims she "can't see what is in back of her in traffic". I say- that is what side mirrors are for but that gets me no where. Her choice? A Honda Pilot!

 

Needless to say, that would be very tough for this old boy to do.

 

Back up camera??? Do they work as a rear view camera also? I know they work well when backing up.

Edited November 14, 2012 by timmm55

[akirby]

Back up camera??? Do they work as a rear view camera also? I know they work well when backing up.

 

Only when you're in reverse.

[timmm55]

I grew up in a rural farming area and pickups were the default vehicle for at least half the people in the community, if not more. And it didn't matter whether they needed them or not. And that was before supercabs and crewcabs became widespread - these were mostly regular cab half ton and quarter ton trucks. And I don't think that's changed much.

 

Even back in the 70s they had F100 Rangers and Lariats with nice interiors and features.

 

I did too, rural southern Minnesota. Everyone in the country had a truck in the 50s, 60s and 70s. But they also had a car or two. We had a very basic faded red 1959 F series, 6/manual trans. and 63 Galaxie 500. We sold the farm and moved by the lake. Then we had a 68 LTD, later a 74 Gran Torino Elite and always an old used F series "work/fish truck".

 

I saw the birth of the new truck era! Our next door neighbor, a dean at the local college, had a classic Cris Craft wood boat. They got the oddest thing........a new 73 F Series XLT Crew Cab 4 door, two tone green, 390/auto., A/C and cloth upholstery, wood trim, etc. It was loaded....from my perspective it was more car than truck. He was just a decade or two ahead of his time!

[timmm55]

Only when you're in reverse.

 

With limited visibility a rear camera would be a great aide even when moving forward. lane changing, etc.

[Deanh]

I did too, rural southern Minnesota. Everyone in the country had a truck in the 50s, 60s and 70s. But they also had a car or two. We had a very basic faded red 1959 F series, 6/manual trans. and 63 Galaxie 500. We sold the farm and moved by the lake. Then we had a 68 LTD, later a 74 Gran Torino Elite and always an old used F series "work/fish truck".

 

I saw the birth of the new truck era! Our next door neighbor, a dean at the local college, had a classic Cris Craft wood boat. They got the oddest thing........a new 73 F Series XLT Crew Cab 4 door, two tone green, 390/auto., A/C and cloth upholstery, wood trim, etc. It was loaded....from my perspective it was more car than truck. He was just a decade or two ahead of his time!

better watchout Timmm, theres Deans everywhere......