Ford Sales Results and Figures: May 2016

[jpd80]

FCA could be a great company if it would only focus on building more quality in its vehicles,

that one simple sounding thing has held it back for so many years.

[jpd80]

After a bit of research I found the May fleet /retail break downs for GM and Ford

 

GM

Retail....190,613 (79.3%)..

Fleet......49,837 (20.7%)

Total......240,450 (100%).

 

Commercial & Govt......27,170 (11.3%)

Daily Rental ..................22,614 (9.4%) (Down 21,753 from may 2015)

 

Ford

Retail......155,758 (66%)

Fleet......80,239 (34%)

Total.......235,997 (100%)

 

Commercial & Govt......44,840 (19%).......(30,680 (13%) / 14,160 (6%)

Daily Rental ..................35,399 (15%)

Edited June 5, 2016 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

GM is almost six months down the road with Gen 6 Camaro and still sales have not come up that much.

It could still be product mix with a lot of expensive 2SS versions in dealers but I suspect sticker shock is an issue..

 

I forgot that the new gen Camaro had a pretty significant price increase with the new generation. The Mustang went through a rapid price increase from 2005 to the 2009 model year, but it was content added to the car because thats how people where buying them to begin with. Ford just added more content to the car...you can get a decently equipped 2016 Mustang GT starting at 32K which is only 3K more then the sticker price on my 2006 GT (minus leather and upgraded radio on the 2016 GT vs the 2006 I own), but you get IRS and an additional 130HP/100ftlbs of torque out of the engine...and I'm assuming a more more refined driving experience with the 2016 also.

[silvrsvt]

After a bit of research I found the May fleet /retail break downs for GM and Ford

 

GM

Retail....190,613 (79.3%)..

Fleet......49,837 (20.7%)

Total......240,450 (100%).

 

Commercial & Govt......27,170 (11.3%)

Daily Rental ..................22,614 (9.4%) (Down 21,753 from may 2015)

 

Ford

Retail......155,758 (66%)

Fleet......80,239 (34%)

Total.......235,997 (100%)

 

Commercial & Govt......44,840 (19%).......(30,680 (13%) / 14,160 (6%)

Daily Rental ..................35,399 (15%)

 

Interesting to see that GM seems to have to gotten out of the daily rental market, since Pontiac and other brands where infamous for filling rental lots in FL with cars back in the day.

[jpd80]

 

Interesting to see that GM seems to have to gotten out of the daily rental market, since Pontiac and other brands where infamous for filling rental lots in FL with cars back in the day.

I wonder though,

GM is making much ado about going after retail customers but I wonder oif the real story

is that even with limited and calssic fleet special cars, they realized that the effort wasn't worth the returns.

 

Similarly, I suspect that Ford is playing Q3 and Q4 the Mulally way and Q1 and Q2 as a modified Old Detroit way.

Using the naturally occurring fleet sales in Q1 and Q2 to fill orders and keep plants running on three shifts

in the quiet retail months and then hitting retail sales hard in Q3 and Q4 to really boost profits.

 

Both are now on differen courses but interesting to see Q2 financials on about a months time,

I bet Ford's profits are right up there with GM, in spite of having a higher fleet percentage.

Must confound those who think that GM has every good idea first and best....

Edited June 5, 2016 by jpd80

[jpd80]

In the sales call mark LaNeve shared that around a third of all Escapes are Titanuim trim level,
I find that a quite remarkable statistic as it represents around 10,000 vehicles last month alone.

Now, the starting price of a Titanium Escape is $29,100 and loaded with equipment..
So I'm wondering if this vehicle's popularity serves to reduce conversions to MKC
and its higher pricing...

and yes, I'm wondering what effect the highest Ford trim levels have on Lincoln sales,
perhaps having Ford brand bridging quality vehicles and premium vehicles gives Ford
brand license to capture a lot more premium buyers than most expect.....

Edited June 6, 2016 by jpd80

[silvrsvt]

In the sales call mark LaNeve shared that around a third of all Escapes are Titanuim trim level,

I find that a quite remarkable statistic as it represents around 10,000 vehicles last month alone.

 

Now, the starting price of a Titanium Escape is $29,100 and loaded with equipment..

So I'm wondering if this vehicle's popularity serves to reduce conversions to MKC

and its higher pricing...

 

and yes, I'm wondering what effect the highest Ford trim levels have on Lincoln sales,

perhaps having Ford brand bridging quality vehicles and premium vehicles gives Ford

brand license to capture a lot more premium buyers than most expect.....

 

 

I think it boils down to this:

 

The segment buying Small CUV's is older people....55+ retirement set. They don't have to commute to work anymore and want something flexible enough to fit grandkids in and get stuff for around the house without being large like a minivan. They have more disposable income but yet don't need/want the Cache that a luxury brand can offer or feel that spending an extra 10-15K on a loaded MKC vs a Loaded Escape Ti isn't worth the extra $.

 

Personally I think buying a luxury car is paying for the supposed cache the name provides to impress your friends and maybe get a better dealership experience when servicing it. I do most my own servicing myself and I don't need to get a luxury car to impress my friends/co-workers/neighbours, so I had no problem spending $47K (sticker price) on a Ford that is more or less the same thing as a 65k MKS Ecoboost. Its more or less impressing other people or supposedly impressing those people.

[akirby]

Agreed. The only reason we went with the MKX over the Edge was the seats were way more comfortable, the stereo system was way better and it was quieter. And we liked the 360 degree camera. Since we plan to do a lot of traveling over the next few years that was important. I could not care less about brand cachet or impressing others.

[BORG]

I think part of the trouble with MKC is that it's a new segment for Lincoln that doesn't necessarily appeal to its core customer who associate Lincoln with spaciousness and soft car luxury. I say this because that is exactly why I rejected the MKC when it was up for consideration for my last car. Once I drove it, it really is indistinguishable from an Escape Titanium, even with the 2.3L EB. It also feels more claustrophobic than the Escape because of the higher belt-line. It just doesn't drive as expensive as it is and it's cramped, despite all of the respectable chasis tech they've added to it. As much as Lincoln does to it's platforms to make them more premium, they are still VERY close to the Ford experience.

 

Now I'm sure the MKC is competitive and the interior is certainly nicer than just about anything in its class, but it's still not that compelling once you see the MKX which is easily twice the vehicle in every way. I'm thinking of downgrading my next car purchase because I'm overspending on a car i drive so little (down to maybe twice a week), and my first consideration is not MKC but Edge which feels more luxurious to me than MKC.

 

This is why I think Lincoln is going to have a hard time expanding to other segments, their customers just don't want to go there.

Edited June 6, 2016 by BORG

[akirby]

Traditional Lincoln buyers may feel that way but not luxury buyers in general. The shift is towards smaller vehicles both in cars and utilities.

[bzcat]

 

Interesting to see that GM seems to have to gotten out of the daily rental market, since Pontiac and other brands where infamous for filling rental lots in FL with cars back in the day.

 

They are doing less for sure but they are still in it... nearly 10% of GM volume last month was to rental. Just saw my first 2016 Cruze yesterday... had the rental bar code on the windows.

 

 

In the sales call mark LaNeve shared that around a third of all Escapes are Titanuim trim level,

I find that a quite remarkable statistic as it represents around 10,000 vehicles last month alone.

 

Now, the starting price of a Titanium Escape is $29,100 and loaded with equipment..

So I'm wondering if this vehicle's popularity serves to reduce conversions to MKC

and its higher pricing...

 

and yes, I'm wondering what effect the highest Ford trim levels have on Lincoln sales,

perhaps having Ford brand bridging quality vehicles and premium vehicles gives Ford

brand license to capture a lot more premium buyers than most expect.....

 

I don't really think Escape Titanium is doing anything to MKC. The price difference is still significant (MKC is closer to $40k).

 

Also the buyers are probably quite different. I don't know that there is much significant cross shopping going on. My parents looked at Audi Q5 and BMW X3 and ended up in the MKC. They never looked at Escape (despite being previous Escape owner). I bet you 5 or 6 out of 10 Escape Titanium buyers looked at CR-V Touring but I would be shocked if 1 out of 10 even know MKC exists.

Edited June 6, 2016 by bzcat

[BORG]

No I don't think MKC and Titanium customers are the same but you also have to remember that a significant number of Lincoln buyers come from Ford, are Ford Employees, or they are buying their Lincoln at a Ford dealership. So right now the MKC will certainly fall victim to the "Edge or Escape or MKX" dilemma.

[sullynd]

If the Lincoln dealer I used to go to still existed I'd probably have considered the MKC, it's a good size for me, and was similar in price to my edge. Unfortunately when my Lincoln dealer closed they sold to my local Ford dealer. They're so bad I've bought my last two Fords 15 miles away.

[bzcat]

No I don't think MKC and Titanium customers are the same but you also have to remember that a significant number of Lincoln buyers come from Ford, are Ford Employees, or they are buying their Lincoln at a Ford dealership. So right now the MKC will certainly fall victim to the "Edge or Escape or MKX" dilemma.

 

A-plan buyers are A-plan buyers... they gonna buy a Ford regardless.

 

This discussion is about normal retail buyers and I really don't see any evidence that Escape Titanium is impacting MKC sales or vice versa. A good portion of Lincoln owners are previous Ford owners... but that's the whole point - keeping them in the family. Otherwise, they would be going elsewhere - Lexus, BMW, Audi etc.

 

The perspective MKC buyer would have left Ford completely if Ford didn't offer them a luxury alternative to Escape e.g. like my parents who already had an Escape. They were not interested in a larger SUV like Edge either.

[akirby]

We probably would have bought a MKC 2 years ago if my wife had liked the styling. Instead she got a Titanium Escape. Edge wasn't considered because we were downsizing on purpose. We've since reconsidered and went back to a MKX but initially it was limited to MKC/Escape Titanium.

 

You're in the minority if you think a luxury vehicle needs to be CD sized or larger.

[630land]

Well, the success of Titanium trims shows again that Mercury was not needed. All those "Mercury customers" actually had somewhere to go after all.

[silvrsvt]

You're in the minority if you think a luxury vehicle needs to be CD sized or larger.

 

It depends...

 

I live in a fairly affluent area in Jersey (very affluent vs where I was at in Maryland for 4 years) and IMO people who are buying smaller "luxury" cars are buying them because of the supposed Brand Name Cache that they give and with them being "cheaper" it gives younger buyers an opportunity to buy them who want to impress their friends.

 

I think the vast majority of the German Luxury makes wouldn't offer anything smaller then a C Class, 3 Series or Audi A4 if they didn't have CAFE issues to worry about in the US. They are moving "downmarket" because of that.

 

Personally I don't see the point in spending $40K on a car the size of the Focus, unless its offering supercar-like performance ala the RS. But hey that just me. Then again 50K or so for a MKZ (the way I want it optioned out) is on the high side too.

[akirby]

I didn't say why they were buying them, but they are. Some prefer smaller vehicles for parking, fuel economy, etc. but still want all the bells and whistles.

 

Not everyone equates luxury to size.

[bzcat]

 

I think the vast majority of the German Luxury makes wouldn't offer anything smaller then a C Class, 3 Series or Audi A4 if they didn't have CAFE issues to worry about in the US. They are moving "downmarket" because of that.

 

 

 

That's clearly not true.

 

Look at all the smaller cars Audi, BMW, and Mercedes don't sell in the US but do elsewhere: Audi A1, Q2, BMW 1 series, 2AT, 2GT, Mercedes A-class, B-class

 

Additionally, Audi A3 and Q3, and BMW X1 were all originally conceived without US market participation but brought to the US because of demand. And Mercedes GLA and CLA are responses to the success of A3 and X1 in the US market. So the move downmarket has nothing to do with the CAFE. They are going there because that's where the growth is in terms of volume. But of course doing so has some nice CAFE bonus but it's not a primary motivation.

Edited June 8, 2016 by bzcat

[630land]

"vast majority of German Lux makes wouldn't offer... [anything small]"

 

Some 'car experts' need to learn about what cars are actually built and sold in Europe. Over there, a Benz/Beemer is as common as a Chevy and small isn't a 'dirty word'.

[fuzzymoomoo]

"vast majority of German Lux makes wouldn't offer... [anything small]"

 

Some 'car experts' need to learn about what cars are actually built and sold in Europe. Over there, a Benz/Beemer is as common as a Chevy and small isn't a 'dirty word'.

Europeans also have more cramped cities that aren't very well suited to our gigantic land yachts we have here in 'Murica.

 

My wife has English relatives and every time they come over here they're always astounded by how big our cars are here.

[akirby]

Europeans also have more cramped cities that aren't very well suited to our gigantic land yachts we have here in 'Murica.

 

Yet another reason why people do want and buy smaller luxury vehicles.

[Stephen White]

 

Yet another reason why people do want and buy smaller luxury vehicles.

That's changing. I go to Europe on vacation 2-3 times a year. Plenty of rich Europeans in big Mercedes, BMWs and Audis. And Americans are buying plenty of Smarts, Minicoopers and Fiats where I live.

[silvrsvt]

"vast majority of German Lux makes wouldn't offer... [anything small]"

 

Some 'car experts' need to learn about what cars are actually built and sold in Europe. Over there, a Benz/Beemer is as common as a Chevy and small isn't a 'dirty word'.

I spent 27 months in Europe...so I'm aware of the what the offer over there.

 

I'm looking at it in a purely North American/United States view point...

[aneekr]

 

They are doing less for sure but they are still in it... nearly 10% of GM volume last month was to rental.

 

Correct. While Ford now has the lead in sales of passenger cars and light trucks to rental fleets, GM is still in the top three among all OEMs.

 

To GM's credit, they are now emphasizing mid and highline trim vehicles to customers in the daily rental fleet segment, following the lead that Ford set several years ago to ensure this business is consistently profitable.