The 25 Bestselling Cars, Trucks, and SUVs of 2023 (So Far)

[zipnzap]

Only two Fords.

 

Shocked at Tesla's placing...

 

25. Chevy Malibu (111,449 units sold)
24. Chrysler Pacifica (112,198 units sold)
23. Subaru Crosstrek (114,632 units sold)
22. Mazda CX-5 (115,855 units sold)
21. Subaru Outback (122,881 units sold)
20. Jeep Wrangler (126,551 units sold)
19. Ford Explorer (138,132 units sold)
18. Toyota Highlander (138,178 units sold)
17. Honda Civic (146,881 units sold)
16. Honda Accord (152,202 units sold)
15. Hyundai Tucson (153,180 units sold)
14. Chevy Equinox (154,142 units sold)
13. Toyota Corolla (165,693 units sold)
12. Tesla Model 3 (173,500 units sold, estimated)
11. Toyota Tacoma (179,681 units sold)
10. Jeep Grand Cherokee (182,871 units sold)
9. Nissan Rogue (211,091 units sold)
8. GMC Sierra (216,227 units sold)
7. Toyota Camry (217,975 units sold)
6. Honda CR-V (262,351 units sold)
5. Tesla Model Y (284,500 units sold, estimated)
4. Toyota RAV4 (302,831 units sold)
3. Ram Pickup (332,440 units sold)
2. Chevy Silverado (403,403 units sold)
1. Ford F-Series (573,370 units sold)

 

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g43553191/bestselling-cars-2023/

[Andrew L]

I thought Escape was up there but must have fallen off too.  Granted I haven't kept a very close watch on the sales numbers recently so I am out of it. 

[akirby]

6 minutes ago, Andrew L said:

I thought Escape was up there but must have fallen off too.  Granted I haven't kept a very close watch on the sales numbers recently so I am out of it. 

Escape had launch issues back in the spring plus continued shortage of hybrids.  Extrapolating 3q sales to 3 qtrs would have put it in 22nd place.  

[tzach]

So many bad decisions,  I remember when Ford would have 5 of the top 10 best sellers.  Now only two of the top 25.  Highlander and Grand Cherokee both outselling Explorer!  RAV4/Camry 4/7,  CRV/Accord 6/16 and Escape not in the top 25 while Fusion is no more.  Corolla 13 , Civic 17 and Focus also no more.  No Edge, Ranger, Bronco or Bronco Sport on the list.  I have been a Ford guy since the mid eighties and this is the darkest time by far, so sad.  Hopefully the near future will bring some brighter days.   To top it off I am also a NY Giant fan and that has been prety bad for the last decade as well.

[Deanh]

1 hour ago, zipnzap said:

Only two Fords.

 

Shocked at Tesla's placing...

 

25. Chevy Malibu (111,449 units sold)
24. Chrysler Pacifica (112,198 units sold)
23. Subaru Crosstrek (114,632 units sold)
22. Mazda CX-5 (115,855 units sold)
21. Subaru Outback (122,881 units sold)
20. Jeep Wrangler (126,551 units sold)
19. Ford Explorer (138,132 units sold)
18. Toyota Highlander (138,178 units sold)
17. Honda Civic (146,881 units sold)
16. Honda Accord (152,202 units sold)
15. Hyundai Tucson (153,180 units sold)
14. Chevy Equinox (154,142 units sold)
13. Toyota Corolla (165,693 units sold)
12. Tesla Model 3 (173,500 units sold, estimated)
11. Toyota Tacoma (179,681 units sold)
10. Jeep Grand Cherokee (182,871 units sold)
9. Nissan Rogue (211,091 units sold)
8. GMC Sierra (216,227 units sold)
7. Toyota Camry (217,975 units sold)
6. Honda CR-V (262,351 units sold)
5. Tesla Model Y (284,500 units sold, estimated)
4. Toyota RAV4 (302,831 units sold)
3. Ram Pickup (332,440 units sold)
2. Chevy Silverado (403,403 units sold)
1. Ford F-Series (573,370 units sold)

 

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g43553191/bestselling-cars-2023/

all about production numbers, or more correctly lack of.....

[akirby]

1 hour ago, tzach said:

So many bad decisions,  I remember when Ford would have 5 of the top 10 best sellers.  Now only two of the top 25.  Highlander and Grand Cherokee both outselling Explorer!  RAV4/Camry 4/7,  CRV/Accord 6/16 and Escape not in the top 25 while Fusion is no more.  Corolla 13 , Civic 17 and Focus also no more.  No Edge, Ranger, Bronco or Bronco Sport on the list.  I have been a Ford guy since the mid eighties and this is the darkest time by far, so sad.  Hopefully the near future will bring some brighter days.   To top it off I am also a NY Giant fan and that has been prety bad for the last decade as well.

Why are people obsessed with sales numbers?  Here are the top selling vehicles of 1992 and Ford’s market share that year.  
 

That year Ford lost $7.4B.  And 14 years later was on the brink of bankruptcy.  Yeah those were the days.

 

Note the absence of any significant import market share outside Toyota, Honda and Nissan.  The Koreans were just getting started.

 

[akirby]

This is the 2022 view of sales and market share by mfr.   Ford made $9.2B in the US with margins of over 8%.  Sales volume is meaningless.

 

[rperez817]

3 hours ago, zipnzap said:

Only two Fords.

 

Shocked at Tesla's placing...

 

Thanks for sharing zipnzap. It's not surprising that only 2 Fords are on the list, nor is it surprising that Tesla is the only premium/luxury brand represented among the top 25. The ongoing revolution in the automotive industry combined with residual impacts of supply chain issues is causing a shakeup. 

[twintornados]

11 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

... nor is it surprising that Tesla is the only premium/luxury brand represented among the top 25. ....

 

It may be priced at a premium, but it is not considered a "luxury" vehicle.

[rperez817]

19 minutes ago, twintornados said:

It may be priced at a premium, but it is not considered a "luxury" vehicle.

 

In terms of positioning in the "luxury" aspect of premium automotive brands, Tesla is below Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Audi but above Acura, Infiniti, and Lincoln.

Edited October 6, 2023 by rperez817

[twintornados]

15 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

In terms of positioning in the "luxury" aspect of premium automotive brands, Tesla is below Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Audi but above Acura, Infiniti, and Lincoln.

 

Just because it costs more than an Acura, Infiniti or Lincoln does not make it a luxury vehicle.

[Captainp4]

5 hours ago, twintornados said:

 

Just because it costs more than an Acura, Infiniti or Lincoln does not make it a luxury vehicle.

You might not consider it one, but most people/publications do. It just depends if you consider tech features luxury or premium materials luxury. If it's the tech, it's a no brainer that it is luxury. If it's premium materials then it can be argued that it isn't. It's probably on par with a Lincoln for material/nvh/traditional luxury metrics though. Obviously far ahead of everyone else on the tech end.

[Gurgeh]

7 hours ago, Captainp4 said:

You might not consider it one, but most people/publications do. It just depends if you consider tech features luxury or premium materials luxury. If it's the tech, it's a no brainer that it is luxury. If it's premium materials then it can be argued that it isn't. It's probably on par with a Lincoln for material/nvh/traditional luxury metrics though. Obviously far ahead of everyone else on the tech end.

It is the emblem that makes people think luxury, not the actual vehicle. Tesla has done a great job of branding so when people see a car ahead of them with that logo attached they think luxury, whether that particular vehicle really qualifies or not. Granted, the top line Teslas are legitimate luxury vehicles. But Model 3 and Y? Not really. Their interiors contain few luxury materials and are austere and cold, unlike Lincoln which in recent years (despite its other problems) has arguably been designing some of the most luxurious interiors on the market. And to me the 3/Y exteriors are boring and frankly kind of ugly (though exterior style is of course personal and subjective). You do make a good point about technology, but that is mainly due to Tesla being an EV and that much of its EV technology remains ahead of other automakers who have more recently entered the market.

[jpd80]

14 hours ago, twintornados said:

 

Just because it costs more than an Acura, Infiniti or Lincoln does not make it a luxury vehicle.

Although there might be a case for saying it does when Tesla chops into those brands sales,

a lot of Tesla’s new customers are coming from those brands….

[rperez817]

59 minutes ago, jpd80 said:

a lot of Tesla’s new customers are coming from those brands….

 

That's correct. A lot of Tesla's conquest customers also come from the Tier 1 luxury brands of Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Audi too. And once those customers buy a Tesla, they are loyal to Tesla. The company has both the highest owner loyalty and the highest conquest rate in the industry.

 

[jpd80]

22 minutes ago, rperez817 said:

 

That's correct. A lot of Tesla's conquest customers also come from the Tier 1 luxury brands of Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Audi too. And once those customers buy a Tesla, they are loyal to Tesla. The company has both the highest owner loyalty and the highest conquest rate in the industry.

Yeah, I noticed a year or so back that Audi, BMW an MB seem to be losing a lot of their return customers,

maybe the same things is happening in China and Europe too where that trend would be more apparent?

Edited October 8, 2023 by jpd80

[Rick73]

11 hours ago, rperez817 said:

 

That's correct. A lot of Tesla's conquest customers also come from the Tier 1 luxury brands of Mercedes-Benz, BMW, and Audi too. And once those customers buy a Tesla, they are loyal to Tesla. The company has both the highest owner loyalty and the highest conquest rate in the industry.

 

I don’t follow the magnitude or significance of conclusion.  When there’s a new manufacturer, whether Tesla, Rivian, Lucid, Fisker, etc., are not all sales initially conquest by definition?

 

The “one and done” rating of 40% makes Tesla look great relative to others, but is it all that different than Ford or Toyota at ~50%?  Sure, it’s better, but is it a game changer?
 

Tesla is also different in that they are presently the dominant EV manufacturer, so if a Tesla owner wanted to trade, but was loyal to “electric” more so than Tesla, he would likely end up with Tesla anyway, even if not all that satisfied with his vehicle.  I think I understand data, but seems buyers who switch to electric (i.e. — Tesla) may repeat electric (implying for now still Tesla for lack of viable competition).  I agree Tesla is doing great, but don’t read much from data beyond they are uniquely different by virtue of being electric.  Your view on this is appreciated.

[twintornados]

20 hours ago, jpd80 said:

Although there might be a case for saying it does when Tesla chops into those brands sales,

a lot of Tesla’s new customers are coming from those brands….

 

I went from a Lincoln Corsair to a Ford Bronco (because I wanted one)...does that make my Bronco Black Diamond a luxury vehicle?

[rperez817]

7 hours ago, Rick73 said:

I agree Tesla is doing great, but don’t read much from data beyond they are uniquely different by virtue of being electric.  Your view on this is appreciated.

 

You are correct Rick73 that Tesla is doing well in terms of the holy grail in automotive marketing, high loyalty + high conquest rate. Perhaps more interesting is that loyalty of BEV owners to electric propulsion increased significantly since 2015, even with Tesla taken out. Here is the data for 2015-2020. 

 

 

Another interesting piece of data is that Tesla's loyalty in the U.S. is driven by customers from racial and ethnic minority groups. This is unusual for a U.S. domestic automaker.

 

 

 

[jpd80]

7 hours ago, twintornados said:

 

I went from a Lincoln Corsair to a Ford Bronco (because I wanted one)...does that make my Bronco Black Diamond a luxury vehicle?

No that’s just a an internal conquest to Ford.

 

What I was talking about is the effect Tesla was having on BMW, MB an Audi return buyers,

the fact that significant numbers of them are buying Teslas says that something is up

with those premium buyers new preferences . Does that make Tesla a premium brand?

probably not but it makes me question the future of those German marques.

Edited October 9, 2023 by jpd80

[twintornados]

5 hours ago, jpd80 said:

No that’s just a an internal conquest to Ford.

 

What I was talking about is the effect Tesla was having on BMW, MB an Audi return buyers,

the fact that significant numbers of them are buying Teslas says that something is up

with those premium buyers new preferences . Does that make Tesla a premium brand?

probably not but it makes me question the future of those German marques.

 

People that can buy a BMW, MB or Audi have much more "disposable" income to throw around and buy unique vehicles like a Tesla....does not make it a luxury vehicle. Teslas ARE nice, but lets face it. Even Elon fancies himself more of a "Henry Ford" type exec than a "Henry Leland", in his work to bring electric cars to the masses.

Edited October 9, 2023 by twintornados

[Gurgeh]

5 hours ago, jpd80 said:

No that’s just a an internal conquest to Ford.

 

What I was talking about is the effect Tesla was having on BMW, MB an Audi return buyers,

the fact that significant numbers of them are buying Teslas says that something is up

with those premium buyers new preferences . Does that make Tesla a premium brand?

probably not but it makes me question the future of those German marques.

I think with those brands many are buying the status as much as the vehicles themselves. Status buyers are, I think, particularly vulnerable to the allure of the logo that Tesla offers.

[akirby]

45 minutes ago, Gurgeh said:

I think with those brands many are buying the status as much as the vehicles themselves. Status buyers are, I think, particularly vulnerable to the allure of the logo that Tesla offers.

True.  But with those brands introducing BEVs with FAR more luxury than a Tesla I see it swinging back.

 

Both of these are $100k BEVs.  Which one is the luxury vehicle?

 

 

[Rick73]

I would guess Tesla above may appeal more to younger buyers, while MB to older traditional buyers.  Younger people seem to value or prefer less of some things than previous generations.  For example, not that long ago it was common to wear an expensive gold watch as sign of luxury and wealth, then many preferred an inexpensive sports watch that told time just as accurately, and now many don’t wear a watch at all, relying on phone as needed; though smart watch is changing that trend back for different reason.

 

IMO what is considered luxurious could be shifting from opulence to functionality.  I think that’s where Tesla has an advantage based on reputation for being the best and most advanced electric vehicle, though Mercedes seems to be doing a lot of R&D to change that perception.

 

For my taste, the MB above appears too busy, and Tesla too stripped down.  A vehicle in middle would be my preference, but since I would never buy a $100,000 car, my opinion is irrelevant.

[rperez817]

2 hours ago, akirby said:

Both of these are $100k BEVs.  Which one is the luxury vehicle?

 

 

Both of them.