ford FOCUS? more like ford FUCK the US

[MKII]

But why would Ford NA abandon any resemblance to the curent Focus with the MY2008 reskin?

 

Or is this an indication that Ford NA is going in a totally different design direction for the C2/MKIII Focus compared with what the rest of world will see.

 

If this is the case, why call it a Focus any longer. I find it difficult to look at the pictures of the 2008 and call it a Focus, there is just no connection at all.

 

Another Ford decision that makes me wonder what is happening at Ford NA.

[pcsario]

Bill Ford was in charge, that's what happened.

 

Ford was desperate to make it look different on the cheap.

 

One of the worst reskins in US automotive history I'm sure.

[Watchdevil]

That interior is preferable to the one that is currently in the Focus.

 

 

That interior is freaking nice. It looks to be as good as the new GTI. This has been what I have been getting at all along is that Ford needs to get a GTI competitor, along with something as nice as a Jetta and Eos. I rolled through the VW lot this evening and seen the Eos with the retractable hardtop in place with a nice ice blue exterior finish and my mind went immediately to the Focus Cabrio that is in EU. I though why is Ford missing the opportunity to offer that.

 

I examined a Fusion SEL V6 today, charcoal metallic with black leather interior w/white stitching. That freaking car is nice. And I love the interior quality. I sat in it and it felt very good in all aspects. I took particular notice of the design detail of the headlamps, the fenders, the hood, grille and bumper exceution and it was very interesting and attractive to me. I just don't understand why Ford could not evoke that same kind of interesting design with the Five Hundred and Focus restyle.

 

I looked at a used white 06 Mustang Convertible with black leather interior (its saving grace). It was $20,000. I was close to going home in that car. I felt it was perhaps the right car for me, but maybe not the right timing. But something about it seemed right and good. So, lets see what happens.

Edited January 16, 2007 by Watchdevil

[Loyalbutconcerned]

One of my co-workers who like myself is warm on the new Focus even though we don't think it's ugly, said he showed the photos to one of his female cousin and she loved it even more thanb the current Focus she drives. Well, I thought I would try the same with my wife who is known to be picky about car styles, and to my surprise, she loved it and would like to get one. Strange as this may seem there may be an audience for this car. We will have to wait and see. We just have to see how it performs in the market place I guess.

[Roadrunner]

Well yes the redesigned Focus can foster an audience, I'm certain of it.

 

The redesigned Focus looks awesome; I would drive it. I suppose part of it is because it doesn't say "economy car" like the current aged Focus does. (The Cobalt, Mitsubishi and Kia's offerings are the worst offenders in that category.)

 

The original Focus looked smart, but they dumbed it down with the redesign. This new Focus brings back the "unique"

Edited January 16, 2007 by Roadrunner

[FLLMTR]

When I broke out my calculator, I discovered that the Focus starts at nearly $20,000 USD in Europe and nearly $25,000 USD in Mexico. Is anyone here willing to spend over $30K USD for the performance version of a Focus? :reading:

[pcsario]

When I broke out my calculator, I discovered that the Focus starts at nearly $20,000 USD in Europe and nearly $25,000 USD in Mexico. Is anyone here willing to spend over $30K USD for the performance version of a Focus? :reading:

Prices are region driven. The Mazda3 and the Mazda6 also cost a lot more in Europe.

 

In Mexico, by law, every automaker has to include every single tax in the advertised price.

 

None of that extra crap goes to Ford's pockets.

 

In this instance, Ford's prices for the C1 sedan range are 13-16k + government taxes.

 

Ditto with the ST and the GTI.

 

Check it out by yourself with the VW, the real price goes down to roughly the same price in the US, after all the government taxes are taken out.

 

The "base" C1 Focus is actually pretty decently equipped for 13k. (headlight washers, MP3/6 CD changer with iPod connector, automatic A/C, etc.)

Edited January 16, 2007 by pcsario

[LincolnFan]

The "base" C1 Focus is actually pretty decently equipped for 13k. (headlight washers, MP3/6 CD changer with iPod connector, automatic A/C, etc.)

 

What are you talking about? I am going to buy a C1 Focus as soon as the 07 model arrives, it doesn't come with any of that stuff except the AC, and it's a manual one. Oh yea WITH HUBCAPS.

 

The price is about 12.5K USD for auto. Did I mention that the front windows are going to be electric while the back ones are manual?

[silvrsvt]

Bill Ford was in charge, that's what happened.

 

Ford was desperate to make it look different on the cheap.

 

One of the worst reskins in US automotive history I'm sure.

 

 

If Ford was going to be so cheap about it, why would they change nearly every piece of sheetmetal on the car (only thing carry over is the Glass in the doors and windshield)?

 

I also doubt that its worst reskin in history also..I think that goes to the 96 Taraus

[silvrsvt]

But why would Ford NA abandon any resemblance to the curent Focus with the MY2008 reskin?

 

Or is this an indication that Ford NA is going in a totally different design direction for the C2/MKIII Focus compared with what the rest of world will see.

 

If this is the case, why call it a Focus any longer. I find it difficult to look at the pictures of the 2008 and call it a Focus, there is just no connection at all.

 

Another Ford decision that makes me wonder what is happening at Ford NA.

 

Why not? the 2005 was a totally halfassed design that tried to soften up the 00-04 MY styling and was really cheap looking...why continue with a crappy design lineage?

 

As for what the C2 will look like in relation to the RoW, no body can answer that right now.

 

As for the name, people bash the Big 3 for changing names all the time...does the 2006 Camary look like a 96 or even a 86 one? While the Focus might have a bad name from its launch days, hopefully the new redesign and reliability will help correct the problems it had and establish it as a "good" name, like the accord,civic, etc...You can't live in the past when it comes to styling...to me the C2 doesnt look that much like the C170 Focus...

[Michael Reynolds]

What are you talking about? I am going to buy a C1 Focus as soon as the 07 model arrives, it doesn't come with any of that stuff except the AC, and it's a manual one. Oh yea WITH HUBCAPS.

 

The price is about 12.5K USD for auto. Did I mention that the front windows are going to be electric while the back ones are manual?

 

Thanks for clarifying, some reality is needed around here.

[LincolnFan]

Thanks for clarifying, some reality is needed around here.

 

No problem.

 

You people have no idea about the C1 Focus, to get a fully loaded one with the lame 2.0 HE you'd have to fork atleast 20K.

 

Sure, it's luxurious and really nice, I didn't pick biased on the badge or the exterior looks, it is the best value out there.

 

and in the end, I have a European car! :shades:

[pcsario]

Thanks for clarifying, some reality is needed around here.

LOL... sorry Michael, reality is just one click away at ford/vw.com.mx. This is an apple-apple comparison, Mexico and the US have roughly the same prices.

I know you like to damage control anything-Ford because you bought a Fusion, but c'mon... LF's example only helps our case. According to some people here you couldn't have a C1 Focus for less than 17k because it was too expensive to produce. ALWAYS ignoring the fact prices are region driven. As usual, those people were proven wrong yet again. His C1 Focus must start at like 11k. And of course we know it's too late to change things, I don't think that was the point of this thread. We all know that when it comes to Bill Ford and its fans, it was always too late for common sense.

 

Total vindication for biker16 and everyone else who was against the Ford Fuck Us.

 

Anyway, all C1 Focus sedans sold in Mexico come well equipped and with the 2.0 engine.

 

Headlight washers in all versions, standard automatic A/C, 6CD/MP3/iPod, standard ABS, ESP, EBA, etc.

 

 

What are you talking about? I am going to buy a C1 Focus as soon as the 07 model arrives, it doesn't come with any of that stuff except the AC, and it's a manual one. Oh yea WITH HUBCAPS.

 

The price is about 12.5K USD for auto. Did I mention that the front windows are going to be electric while the back ones are manual?

 

Obviously the "prices are region driven" bit explains your situation, if the base model is even cheaper with an auto, the 2.0 isn't standard, and so on.

 

The version for this continent comes with the 2.0 as the std. engine and comes with more equipment, which would explain the 2k difference in price.

 

 

I can't recall a single car that doesn't come with hubcabs in its base version (Mazda3, Civic, etc.), however in this case the next trim in the sedan range only adds cosmetic changes and other enhancements like allow wheels, rain sensing wipers, foglights, moonroof, etc. The sedan range tops out at about 15k.

Edited January 17, 2007 by pcsario

[pcsario]

If Ford was going to be so cheap about it, why would they change nearly every piece of sheetmetal on the car (only thing carry over is the Glass in the doors and windshield)?

 

I also doubt that its worst reskin in history also..I think that goes to the 96 Taraus

For all the shit you people give Toyota, they do a better job of recycling cars.

 

 

By 2012 (the original plan) this would've looked like a joke in business practices. Then again it already does.

 

I wouldn't consider the '96 Taurus as a reskin.

Edited January 16, 2007 by pcsario

[Michael Reynolds]

I think the exercise here is to sell a vehicle that will net a profit at the end of the day vs. one that has to be subsidized to notch into a market that it was/was not intended for.

 

My parents live in the UK and in their garage is a Mondeo ST220. I was thrilled as all hell when they bought it, that was the car that I wished Ford would have sold in the states. In retrospect, the Mondeo like the C1 Focus are dull to look at. The long hood (thank you NCAP) and Mondeo styling that was introduced more than a few years ago would do little to bolster sales of that nameplate here in the states.

 

Take the Mazda 3 for example. Great car, but to tack on all those options that everyone here is so hell bent on rambling on and on and on over slips you into a $25k car. Which is why:

 

A. You don't see any of those on the road ever

B. Dealers never stock them

 

How come?

-Because this isn't Europe where smaller cars are favoured

-Accords, Fusions, Camrys, and Auras occupy that price point and offer superior room and probably a more comfortable driving experience

-Its an entry level car

 

What Ford should've done is found a way to add Advance Trac, the PZEV that was discontinued, and the 5 spd auto. Things that can be done with this platform, a platform that is perfectly fine.

[pcsario]

Sorry Michael, that excuse has been used before.

 

No, Ford isn't selling the C1 Focus at a loss. It's making a nice profit even at 11k, be it in Australia, Saudi Arabia, Mexico, etc.

 

That's like saying "Hey, Mazda must be subsidizing their cars because they cost less in NA than they cost in Europe, good for us they decided to sell it to a market it wasn't intended to!"

 

It's called a global car with a good, profitable & flexible business plan. Better get used to the concept 'cuz the next Focus and Fusion will be the same story. It's one of the reasons why Ford NA is losing billions left and right, while other divisions are profitable. No Bill Ford running (ruining?) things..

 

This is what happens when you take out all the expensive stuff that drives up the cost. (Xenons, Bluetooth, etc), and leave everything else intact:

A C1 Focus that's damn good (R&H, NVH, interior, etc.), desirable in the segment, with high perceived levels of quality, and decently equipped for 13k.

Keep in mind that --as LF proved-- it could be priced even lower if it didn't come with all the standard equipment it has in Mexico.

 

It's not rocket science or a charity sale. No automaker sells anything at a loss.

Edited January 17, 2007 by pcsario

[BlackHorse]

I'm afraid I have to jump on the "disagree" bandwagon as well Mister Reynolds. The Mazda 3 is Mazda's best selling car. There may not be a lot of them in your area, I see quite a few of them around here. Additionally, to get a Mazda 3 to 25 thousand you have to buy the Speed 3 version. I looked at the Mazda 3's on a Mazda lot just last week while I was test driving a Mazda 6. They had plenty of them and I noticed that a fully loaded Mazda 3 with leather and sunroof, Bose system and remote start was listing at 23 thousand. The well appointed ones were priced at 19 to 20 thousand. I haven't as yet driven one but I've read some reviews and apparently they are fun to drive, handle well and get good mileage. The ones I looked at were equipped with the 2.3 engine and the EPA numbers were 25 and 35 I believe, could be wrong but I think that's what it was.

[one2gamble]

1. I see Mazda 3's all over the place

2. Ford sells C1 foci around the world for what our current Foci sell for here

[ebritt]

 

This kicks butt! Why can't we have that here???

[Michael Reynolds]

WOW! If you wanted me to clarify sure ask, but I never once mentioned that the 3 was a poor seller. What I did say is that you very seldomly see LOADED Mazda 3s floating around on lots. Trust me I've looked

 

I also hate to break it to you but a Grand Touring Mazda 3 Auto loaded tops out at around $25K. If you don't believe me I strongly suggest you try and re-build one on Mazda's US website.

 

Also notice I wasn't referencing the Middle East, Europe, or Mexico my comments were directed at the US market. I have no doubt Ford is making a profit elsewhere, I never contested any of that.

 

Global Platforms? What are those? :huh: You speak as if this is something hard for me to get used to or something that I've never heard of. Obviously Ford uses it to an extent with the CD3 and D3 vehicles, why would I get upset about something that saves the company millions and cuts out alot of the fat and product lean time? Developing a global car is fine, but there has to be pricing and product surrounding it on both the top and bottom end to assist in its success.

 

Even if we did get the C1 Focus here, do you really think all that content would have made it over, including cabin materials?

Edited January 17, 2007 by Michael Reynolds

[BlackHorse]

The word "LOADED" having never appeared one time in your intial post about the Mazda 3. It's easy to see how people came to the conclusion that you were making reference to "all" Mazda 3 cars given what you wrote. But I'm glad we got that straightened out. By the way, I have looked, 25 grand is a Mazda Speed 3 here. Maybe they just tack on a premium in your market or something.

[pcsario]

Also notice I wasn't referencing the Middle East, Europe, or Mexico my comments were directed at the US market. I have no doubt Ford is making a profit elsewhere, I never contested any of that.

 

Even if we did get the C1 Focus here, do you really think all that content would have made it over, including cabin materials?

Content is irrelevant. Fact of the matter is that's what a C1 Focus would've costed here. Mexico and the US are grouped in the same region and have the same pricing standards/content/lineup/powerplant mix. Nothing closer to an apples-apples situation.

 

Hell you hint at it yourself. The price would've been even lower because it wouldn't have all those features. That's a stark contrast to the previous BS about the C1 Focus costing as much as the Fusion to manufacture, and that it was impossible to sell one for 11k profitably. Also, I'm willing to bet the Fuck Us won't retail for 11k, not with Ford's recent attitude on fleet sales and incentives for new products, so those comments were irrelevant in the first place.

 

The interior is 90% solid, high quality plastics like those found in the VW Jetta/Rabbit and the F150/New Expy Quite affordable from a production budget standpoint, which is why they went with that. Only part of the dash is "soft" (but not really). The cabin doesn't look or feel cheap at all in person, and the whole thing just works like a charm.

Edited January 17, 2007 by pcsario

[silvrsvt]

Content is irrelevant. Fact of the matter is that's what a C1 Focus would've costed here. Mexico and the US are grouped in the same region and have the same pricing standards/content/lineup/powerplant mix. Nothing closer to an apples-apples situation.

 

 

What about emission and crash standards?

 

They also have 4 different products under the Focus that they sell in Mexico also.

 

Its far easier for Ford to take the C1 Focus out EU and drop it without any changes into Mexico, then to take the C1 and change its bumpers (for Canadian regs), get it emissions/crash tested in the US, which would add even more to the costs of the car.

 

Plus how many Foci do they sell in Mexico? I'd assume its a "premium" car which sales are lucky to hit 50K a year.

 

If there wasn't any changes needed to the C1, why was the C170 butchered so much from the European version when it came here? Theres more to this then what some self proclaimed internet experts can assume/infer from reading articles.

[Michael Reynolds]

Content is irrelevant. Fact of the matter is that's what a C1 Focus would've costed here. Mexico and the US are grouped in the same region and have the same pricing standards/content/lineup/powerplant mix. Nothing closer to an apples-apples situation.

 

Hell you hint at it yourself. The price would've been even lower because it wouldn't have all those features. That's a stark contrast to the previous BS about the C1 Focus costing as much as the Fusion to manufacture, and that it was impossible to sell one for 11k profitably. Also, I'm willing to bet the Fuck Us won't retail for 11k, not with Ford's recent attitude on fleet sales and incentives for new products, so those comments were irrelevant in the first place.

 

The interior is 90% solid, high quality plastics like those found in the VW Jetta/Rabbit and the F150/New Expy Quite affordable from a production budget standpoint, which is why they went with that. Only part of the dash is "soft" (but not really). The cabin doesn't look or feel cheap at all in person, and the whole thing just works like a charm.

 

What does a region have to do with anything? It's all about a market, hence the reason why Mercury doesn't exsist in Canada and Ford continues to sell the previous gen F-150s in Mexico. A region doesn't mean crap when you have two entirely different economic conditions.

 

I still want to know how so many of you around here know without a doubt how the C1 Focus would have been priced here. Where are these manufacturing estimates coming from? All of this is amusing because no one knows, and I'm sorry but 'willing to bet' doesn't quite cut it either. I msyelf should not have muddied the waters with pricing, because quite frankly I don't know.

 

So it's OK for the Euro Focus to use high quality solid plastics, but god forbid anything else in Ford's lineup use it??

Edited January 17, 2007 by Michael Reynolds

[WC-MAN]

Ford should have brought the last Focus over when Europe got it. That sai, they didn't and get used to it. If the new car is due next year, who the hell gets their panties in a bunch NOW?!?! If I remeber correctly, the last European upgrade was pre $2 gas when small cars sales where meager. I also seem to remember reading that money was funneled into the Escape program at the time, when small SUV's were doing very well. Yes. it was short sighted, but its a little to late to fuss about it now.

 

The "hot hatch" market is a lot smaller than many people think. Many "tuners" buy used cars, so they don't help new car sales all that much. Notice that Mitsubishi, Dodge, and Subaru didn't even bother with a two-door bodystyle for the EVO, SRT, and WRX. It wasn't worth the cost just for a small market.

 

The new Focus gets an OK from me. Its too Hondaesque on the outside, and the interior is the typical study-hall design that everyone seems to feel will attract young people to a car, yet it never does.

 

Your right, the vast majority of compact buyers are looking for a dependible car that is inexpensive to own and operate, not a hotrod.