Michael Reynolds Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 The AWD in Ford/Volvo cars and CUVs uses the Haldex center differential. Ford SUV/Trucks AWD/4x4 may use different central differential designs. No, Ford developed an in house AWD system similar to Haldex's (sending most of the power to the front drivers until slippage is discovered) . All CD3 based vehicles (including CUVs) use the new system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANTAUS Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I believe it's called i-AWD for intelligent AWD. They just didn't brag about it as much because it's not really a known name, as Haldex is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Actually this a new big part of The Way Forward Interiors, sheet metal, chassis and powertrains will be introduced independent of each other. You could see a new powertrain on a 2-3 year old vehicle (like the 4.4L diesel in 2011MY on the 2009MY F150) It better not take Ford until 2011 to put the 4.4 in the F-150 or else once again they'll be the First-to-announce/Last-to-deliver.....again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 It better not take Ford until 2011 to put the 4.4 in the F-150 or else once again they'll be the First-to-announce/Last-to-deliver.....again. the Diesel will be in F150 in 2010 MY and Ford has YET to announce the Diesel - unlike Chrysler and GM .. so your analogy is only half true .. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 the Diesel will be in F150 in 2010 MY and Ford has YET to announce the Diesel - unlike Chrysler and GM .. so your analogy is only half true .. Igor So they'll just be Last-to-deliver? That makes it SO much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 So they'll just be Last-to-deliver? That makes it SO much better. And what difference does it make? Only thing your doing is bitching and whining.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) So they'll just be Last-to-deliver? That makes it SO much better. If all goes according to plan , Ford will actually be FIRST to deliver - GM will be there in WINTER 2009 / SPRING 2010 (6 months after Ford) and DCX will be 12 months after Ford. That is the indication - but I will not bet anything at that becoming reality :D Igor Edited August 21, 2007 by igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 And what difference does it make? Only thing your doing is bitching and whining.. Good attitude. Who cares if all of Ford's competitors beat them with everything? Yeah, you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Good attitude. Who cares if all of Ford's competitors beat them with everything? Yeah, you're right. In the grand scheme of things ranting on a message board isn't going to change anything.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 In the grand scheme of things ranting on a message board isn't going to change anything.... Neither will praising everything Ford does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Neither will praising everything Ford does. Who said that I praised everything they did? The certainly have room for improvement...lots of it, but that doesn't mean they need to be jumped on at every opportunity either... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Who said that I praised everything they did? The certainly have room for improvement...lots of it, but that doesn't mean they need to be jumped on at every opportunity either... They do for things that are blatently obvious and keep me from buying their product. That next gen Mazda6 has it all over the Fusion so far. Looks like I may have to buy a 2nd one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 So they'll just be Last-to-deliver? That makes it SO much better. my take...rather be a little late for the party and problem free with no production issues.....if in fact Ford is last...ALL the competion can mouth off all they like...its all heresay until the product IS released... WILL chevy or dodge be first???????...announcing something at a certain date is sometimes jumping the gun...one little hiccup...BIG delays! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 my take...rather be a little late for the party and problem free with no production issues.....if in fact Ford is last...ALL the competion can mouth off all they like...its all heresay until the product IS released... WILL chevy or dodge be first???????...announcing something at a certain date is sometimes jumping the gun...one little hiccup...BIG delays! I'd rather Ford actually be first to the party AND be problem free. Is that really so much to ask? At least it looks like Ford will be getting the jump with Synch. That really is a first in a LONG time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) I'd rather Ford actually be first to the party AND be problem free. Is that really so much to ask? At least it looks like Ford will be getting the jump with Synch. That really is a first in a LONG time. no it's not too much to ask - it is exactly what shouls be asked of them. But it might simply not happen very often in the coming couple of years - especially in power trains - Ford is broke and it seems they are happier to invest in other things than motors - they are happy to be mid pack in engines (HP at least) as long as the rest of the car is spot on .. It is not a good situation, but it seems Ford is not in a position to change it for about 3 maybe 5 years ... I could go on and justify how masking say 30hp might be not an issue if it is hyped up by things like dual clutch transmission, fuel economy etc .. but all of it would be talking about PROMISE and POTENTIAL .. and I will not stick my head out there that Ford will deliver - they are on a good track, but they are not in a situation yet,where their delivery can be expected as "excellent" - "good" maybe, but definitely not "excellent" - Ford has ways to go .. However - MKS will NOT lack in HP - not on this side of CTS-V STS-V, M5, and E class AMG - the DI TIVCT 3.7l V6 and the Twin Force 3.5l V6 will make it perfectly competitive with anything else out there, and the final specs might even have a surprise or 2 .. the reason why YOU are upset Nick is the lack of D35 in Fusion - and that is completely different thread ... this one is on MKS. Igor Edited August 21, 2007 by igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 no it's not too much to ask - it is exactly what shouls be asked of them. But it might simply not happen very often in the coming couple of years - especially in power trains - Ford is broke and it seems they are happier to invest in other things than motors - they are happy to be mid pack in engines (HP at least) as long as the rest of the car is spot on .. It is not a good situation, but it seems Ford is not in a position to change it for about 3 maybe 5 years ... I could go on and justify how masking say 30hp might be not an issue if it is hyped up by things like dual clutch transmission, fuel economy etc .. but all of it would be talking about PROMISE and POTENTIAL .. and I will not stick my head out there that Ford will deliver - they are on a good track, but they are not in a situation yet,where their delivery can be expected as "excellent" - "good" maybe, but definitely not "excellent" - Ford has ways to go .. Igor Midpack is one thing. Market loser is another. 221 HP in the Fusion was a class-trailer from the get-go. 300 HP in the F-150 is lacking severely also. I won't even get started on the Five Hundred's engine when it debuted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I'd rather Ford actually be first to the party AND be problem free. Is that really so much to ask? At least it looks like Ford will be getting the jump with Synch. That really is a first in a LONG time. Granted that would be nice...however i am sure they DO NOT want to have another 6.0 fiasco on their hands...and YES Synch is a GROUNDBREAKER...it will even hav ramifications to the used car business.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igor Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share Posted August 21, 2007 Midpack is one thing. Market loser is another. 221 HP in the Fusion was a class-trailer from the get-go. 300 HP in the F-150 is lacking severely also. I won't even get started on the Five Hundred's engine when it debuted. 1) I edited the post while you were posting 2) The only car with more than 221 hp when Fusion debuted was the special edition Altima - all others were and many STILL ARE at 3.0l and 3.3l 200-240hp V6 ... the move to 270hp happened AFTER Fusion debuted - Yes, Ford should have predicted it, but the 221hp was NOT a loser HP at launch. 3) the F150 example is not a good one - the Hi-Po option in work trucks is nonexistent - and it is obviously not hurting sales -the place you SHOULD point to is the Navigator - the sad part is that Navi USED TO have a better engine - the 4V DOHC 5.4l - but it does not anymore - and the 300hp in THAT class is unacceptable. However - I stand by my point - the engines are MIDPACK where it counts, and Ford IS addressing it - but they are not playing for victory and game changes in the engine department - just keeping up .. the Twin Force family MIGHT (re-read that - MIGHT) change that as it matures, but as above - it is song of the future .. not a reality yet. Igor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deanh Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Midpack is one thing. Market loser is another. 221 HP in the Fusion was a class-trailer from the get-go. 300 HP in the F-150 is lacking severely also. I won't even get started on the Five Hundred's engine when it debuted. you working for a car magazine now Nick.......0-60 & G numbers do NOT the car make unless one is wrapped up in bragging rights...the F-150 may not boast the best #'s anymore ...but IMO it is still at or near the top...and driving the Fusion when I get the chance the car seems well sorted, completely capable and definitely liveable on a day to day basis.....and the Edge...contrary to some of the rags "looking down the nose to ths domestics" comments, drives superbly just as it sits. How many Horsepower do we need to have until someone steps up and goes...HEY...thats enough for me.....it is all starting to sound like egotistical claptrap..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Greene Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I would consider it's main competition to be the Cadillac STS with 302 HP direct injected 3.6 V6. Stephen Cole Smith, a noted Tribune reporter, Car and Driver contributor, etc, with extensive performance car back ground says this V 6 package is a terrific all around car for it's purpose. I would think the Lincoln, with 3.7 would be very competitive in this class. That's about all I expect. If you wish a performance car, this won't be it. But it looks mighty good to me. I sold my 570 RWHP 98 Cobra and also my 2003 Mach 1, but if I feel the need for tire burning performance, I would not look to a sedan for that anyway. I don't understand the fuss and complaint about economical V 6 power (0-60 in the 7's) in a people mover. Shucks...I even think the 3.0 on my wife's Montego (0-60 in the 8's) more than adequate for car's purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wescoent Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 I would consider it's main competition to be the Cadillac STS with 302 HP direct injected 3.6 V6. Stephen Cole Smith, a noted Tribune reporter, Car and Driver contributor, etc, with extensive performance car back ground says this V 6 package is a terrific all around car for it's purpose. I would think the Lincoln, with 3.7 would be very competitive in this class. That's about all I expect. If you wish a performance car, this won't be it. But it looks mighty good to me. I sold my 570 RWHP 98 Cobra and also my 2003 Mach 1, but if I feel the need for tire burning performance, I would not look to a sedan for that anyway. I don't understand the fuss and complaint about economical V 6 power (0-60 in the 7's) in a people mover. Shucks...I even think the 3.0 on my wife's Montego (0-60 in the 8's) more than adequate for car's purpose. At this point, the only obvious advantage the STS has is RWD for those who really want it. Otherwise, the MKS is going to destroy the STS on price (topping out where the STS begins), and probably offer a much better package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 you working for a car magazine now Nick.......0-60 & G numbers do NOT the car make unless one is wrapped up in bragging rights...the F-150 may not boast the best #'s anymore ...but IMO it is still at or near the top...and driving the Fusion when I get the chance the car seems well sorted, completely capable and definitely liveable on a day to day basis.....and the Edge...contrary to some of the rags "looking down the nose to ths domestics" comments, drives superbly just as it sits. How many Horsepower do we need to have until someone steps up and goes...HEY...thats enough for me.....it is all starting to sound like egotistical claptrap..... It's not so much the fact that Ford only gave the Fusion 221 HP alone. It's the fact that Ford gave the Fusion 221 HP when they have a 265 HP engine readily available to go right into the thing whenever they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 It's not so much the fact that Ford only gave the Fusion 221 HP alone. It's the fact that Ford gave the Fusion 221 HP when they have a 265 HP engine readily available to go right into the thing whenever they want. 1) There are a lot more products that need the 3.5 ahead of the Fusion. It's not like *snap* and all of the sudden Ford's 3.0 capacity is 3.5 capacity. 2) There are other things that can be improved on the Fusion ahead of top-end power. I mean you don't start building with the top of the pyramid. Ford needs to pay attention to the bulk of its Fusion customers, and that means the 4-cylinder people, not the V6. It's not like, if Ford drops the 3.5 into the Fusion suddenly the 2.3L will become a better car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickF1011 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 1) There are a lot more products that need the 3.5 ahead of the Fusion. It's not like *snap* and all of the sudden Ford's 3.0 capacity is 3.5 capacity. 2) There are other things that can be improved on the Fusion ahead of top-end power. I mean you don't start building with the top of the pyramid. Ford needs to pay attention to the bulk of its Fusion customers, and that means the 4-cylinder people, not the V6. It's not like, if Ford drops the 3.5 into the Fusion suddenly the 2.3L will become a better car. You anti-3.5 people seem to think it will take 2 years and 20 billion dollars to get another 3.5 line up and running. It's really not that complex. They could ramp up production on 3.0's for 2-3 months (heaven knows they have the extra capacity) and stockpile enough of them to get through 3-4 months of production. That would be more than enough time to convert the 3.0 lines to produce the 3.5. Bam. Problem solved. It's not like Ford and every other automaker haven't done this a thousand times before already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 enough of them to get through 3-4 months of production. That would be more than enough time to convert the 3.0 lines to produce the 3.5 Ford spent $355M at Lima tooling it up for 3.5L production (and generally upgrading the line). The Duratec30 is being built at CEP2, which has not received an investment in new tooling to bring it on par with the rest of Ford's engine plants. So you're looking at $350+ M and a lot of new equipment (and employee training, etc.) It would not be simple to just 'start' building 3.5s at CEP2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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