pcsario Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 PC, your sig rocks!!!!!!!!!1 Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenCaylor Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 smart move...I rode back from Sacremento a while ago...was flying until I hit Magic Mountain....took 3 hours from there to Orange county...CUTTING TRAFFIC! (90 miles ) If you're starting out in Orange County, you might want to check into Metrolink to Union Station. From there you can take the Red line to the Blue line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenCaylor Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 (edited) . Edited November 16, 2007 by StevenCaylor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_the_limey Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 (edited) Was browsing the MKS specs, and discovered that the 3.7 carries a premium fuel recommendation. The 270hp prelim figure is (obviously) based on 87 octane, so I'm wondering what a premium tune will add. I mean it would be totally incredible if this 3.7L engine with only intake VCT makes close to 300hp on premium. I mean if you're with in 10hp-15hp of the DI Caddy & Toyota engines with a regular ol' fuel injected car........... I guess what I'm asking is, if you have 270hp on 87, what can you expect with 91? 290?? Doubt it will be that much of an increase by 91octane alone, maybe 5 bhp at most. It will improve torque where it is knock-limited though but on Ford's that is usually around lower engine speeds (maybe peak torque). To get that kind of power increase they would probably need to up the compression ratio, change cam-timing, and up the peak-power engine speed to 6500rpm (if 11Bar BMEP at peak power). Achieving 265 lbft from a 3.7 (12.1Bar BMEP) on regular is bloody impressive though. It will be interesting to see what they get on the DI version. Edited November 16, 2007 by jon_the_limey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford-150 Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 great looking car just its going to take a while for the back end to grow on me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 Doubt it will be that much of an increase by 91octane alone, maybe 5 bhp at most. OFW has suggested a 10-15hp increase is not out of the question (it's about a 4-5% boost), at least that's what I think he's suggested. I've heard that the 4.6L mod gets about 315hp with a premium tune; which is in part where I get the 5% boost from. Thinking was if Ford sandbags rated hp by say 5, the 3.7 comes to market making 275 hp on regular (itself a pretty nifty achievement), and then -if- you get a 5% boost by adjusting the timing for premium, you're suddenly at about 290hp with no DI and no turbo--and with comparable torque numbers to the DI Cadillac, Lexus, and Infiniti engines. I'm really thinking that we haven't seen the true potential of the Duratec 35 engine family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_the_limey Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 OFW has suggested a 10-15hp increase is not out of the question (it's about a 4-5% boost), at least that's what I think he's suggested. I've heard that the 4.6L mod gets about 315hp with a premium tune; which is in part where I get the 5% boost from. Thinking was if Ford sandbags rated hp by say 5, the 3.7 comes to market making 275 hp on regular (itself a pretty nifty achievement), and then -if- you get a 5% boost by adjusting the timing for premium, you're suddenly at about 290hp with no DI and no turbo--and with comparable torque numbers to the DI Cadillac, Lexus, and Infiniti engines. I'm really thinking that we haven't seen the true potential of the Duratec 35 engine family. It is maybe possible but if a combustion system has been optimised for regular then it will derive less benefit from the ignition timing being advanced from using premium, than a combustion system purposely optimised for premium. If you see what I mean! The D35 is a great engine and as you say it has bags of potential. Although I believe a few might be getting carried away about the "TwinForce" version. No doubt it will make lots of power and torque but the fuel economy maybe less than people hoped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvrsvt Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 The D35 is a great engine and as you say it has bags of potential. Although I believe a few might be getting carried away about the "TwinForce" version. No doubt it will make lots of power and torque but the fuel economy maybe less than people hoped. Well if it gives the current MPG numbers with V8 type Numbers, I'll be satisfied with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_the_limey Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 Well if it gives the current MPG numbers with V8 type Numbers, I'll be satisfied with it. Driven with restraint it might, but when the exhaust temps go up and they start richening the mixture to protect the catalysts it will hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 If you're starting out in Orange County, you might want to check into Metrolink to Union Station. From there you can take the Red line to the Blue line. PITA, not to mention it costs somewhere around 20 bucks a person. I thought about doing it because I am all for public transit, but I have to be back to get the inlaws for John Wayne at a specific time. The better half ensured that we be on time or else....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Reynolds Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 If the D30 is any indication, the retuned version on premimum is somewhere close to the 15 number. Improved breathing might net even more horsepower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemiman Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 If the D30 is any indication, the retuned version on premimum is somewhere close to the 15 number. Improved breathing might net even more horsepower. Probably right. D-30, 2005 Lincoln LS: 232hp Premium D-30, 2006 Ford Fusion: 221hp Regular Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemiman Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 Thanks. She looks like Eva Longoria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papilgee4evaeva Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 A question about the interior, particularly the center stack... Has anyone seen a pic of the interior without the nav system? Is Lincoln gonna do like Nissan and have the same screen there regardless of whether or not there is a nav system, or will there be a smaller display? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnFan Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 A question about the interior, particularly the center stack... Has anyone seen a pic of the interior without the nav system? Is Lincoln gonna do like Nissan and have the same screen there regardless of whether or not there is a nav system, or will there be a smaller display? I think there are some spyshots without the Navi unit, it has a smaller screen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_fairmont_wagon Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 OK, here's what I believe I know about modern production gas engines. On a factory engine with knock sensors and an ECU that can make some adjustments to the timing based on what the knock sensors are telling it, you can expect about a 5% boost in HP and Torque from running premium over regular. On an aftermarket retune of the ECU, targeting a specific octane (say, 93 like we get here on the coast) a good tuner can get 10% out of the vehicle, if not more (depending on how conservative the original tune was). If the factory decided to to instead tune the vehicle for premium from the get-go, then setup the ECU to use the knock sensors to detect poor quality winter fuel or even regular being used and to retard the timing to protect the engine, then, you could see a 10% to even 15% drop in peak HP/TQ when the ECU retards the timing to protect the engine from detonation. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the D37L team focused on tuning for regular unleaded, then setup the ECU to make some minor adjustments to improve things for the case when premium fuel is being used. I have no insider information, but, judging by the numbers that I see on the spec sheet, unless Ford is intentionally sandbagging with them, those aren't the numbers I'd expect from the engine if it was a bored and stroked D35 that was also retuned for premium fuel. For that case, assuming that the D35 they started with is 267 HP and 245 lbs of torque, I'd expect the final power numbers to be 295 HP and 275-280 lbs of torque. So, if that is truly what they did with this engine, their either sandbagging the numbers, only quoting the regular numbers, or deliberately derating it for MPG or transmission protection reasons. Those are my feelings and my opinion on the matter. I could be wrong, but, that's what I've got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 only quoting the regular numbers Per the spec sheet those are 87 numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_the_limey Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Probably right. D-30, 2005 Lincoln LS: 232hp Premium D-30, 2006 Ford Fusion: 221hp Regular Ahh! But the Lincoln LS had the Jaguar redesigned D30 with the narrower valve angle (38 vs 50), direct acting valvetrain and compact combustion chamber with the higher compression ratio. They were in fact very different engines. That was a low tune too, Jaguar I heard were looking at a 270bhp version of this engine in the ill-fated X600 F-type, alas it never saw the light of day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02MustangGT Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 jon the limey, please tell me more about the 270 bhp Jaguar 3.0. I am interested to hear how they were planning to get 270 bhp out of the 3.0. I have an '05 LS 3.0 and have never run anything but premium (91+). I'd say it runs ok, but damn, 270hp would be nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 There's no way you can put down the CTS, it's a modern engineering marvel by Detroit standards and I think it's hands down the best looking car to come out of Detroit this decade. People buying the CTS get quite a bit of bang for their buck but it's still beyond my reach and I'm not sure I would have been any happier in a CTS than an MKX at the same price point (The CTS would have had less features and capabilities but better overall refinement and performance) Whoa...back up the taco cart. I don't know about the CTS being a "modern engineer marvel", but as far as looks go...it's an oddity at best. I will say though in favor of the CTS, at least it does NOT look like a cheap Lexus with a BMW ass like this thing does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 It also doesn't have a 30 year old body-on-frame platform and isn't called Town Car. That makes it an automatic fail in your eyes I would imagine. GAUGES?? Are you REALLY that concerned?? Um....I believe the correct answer is YES. But that's far me personally and I am far from representative of today's average moron...er I mean auto buyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Um....I believe the correct answer is YES. But that's far me personally and I am far from representative of today's average moron...er I mean auto buyer. Don't sell yourself short. You're an exceptional moron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Don't sell yourself short. You're an exceptional moron. Then I, sir, am in good company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomServo92 Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Then I, sir, am in good company. You shouldn't talk about the panther mafia that way.... :shades: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armadamaster Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 You shouldn't talk about the panther mafia that way.... :shades: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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