2012 Escape teaser ad

[akirby]

The funny thing is people like you who love the new one would never be caught dead in a compact SUV anyhow so I don't see how those opinions count.

 

Please point out where I've ever said I love the new one? I don't. I like the current one and considered buying one for my daughter but it was too expensive and too fuel thirsty compared to the Focus hatchback.

 

But I think this is the right move for Ford to combine 2 separate vehicles and platforms into one global vehicle and I think this new version will be a business success and I think the old styling was getting stale and would have started to hurt sales within a few years.

[sullynd]

But I think this is the right move for Ford to combine 2 separate vehicles and platforms into one global vehicle and I think this new version will be a business success and I think the old styling was getting stale and would have started to hurt sales within a few years.

 

I don't see anyone suggesting the CD2 Escape continue on unchanged. There is no reason Ford couldn't have achieved the benefits you list while keeping some level of familiarity with the current styling.

[akirby]

I don't see anyone suggesting the CD2 Escape continue on unchanged. There is no reason Ford couldn't have achieved the benefits you list while keeping some level of familiarity with the current styling.

 

This is a global vehicle. Would the current styling sell in Europe? It's not just U.S. sales - it's global sales that Ford is after.

 

How would the current styling work in 3-4 years down the road? This new styling should fare better down the road and globally. And if it doesn't you can come back and say "told you so".

[sullynd]

This is a global vehicle. Would the current styling sell in Europe? It's not just U.S. sales - it's global sales that Ford is after.

 

Global sales of Kuga vs. Domestic sales of the Escape, which is a higher number?

 

For September Ford sold 24,699 Escapes world-wide. They sold 6,436 Kuga. Yes, clearly it makes sense to ignore the domestic market and focus on the ROW for this product type.

Edited November 13, 2011 by sullynd

[2005Explorer]

Dude get over yourself....its pretty oblivious that you feel like your sexuality is threatened because of the way your car looks you have some serious issues. Do keep in mind that nearly 66% of Escape sales are to women!

 

Well would you drive a pink VW Beetle convertible around? I know a lot of guys who wouldn't. So are you going to say the same thing to them? Now the new Kuga isn't that bad, but yes it's 100% European urban street styling without a hint of backcountry adventure.

 

I just can't get over how much you really hate the styling of the new Escape. I'm not sure if it's intentional or not, but you're making it sound like any guy driving (or even considering) the new Escape/Kuga (or any swoopy CUV) isn't a "real man"? slvrsvt put it dead on:

 

See the difference is I am actually one person that will probably end up with one of these someday. Have I bought things that I didn't like the looks of before? Yes. Do I expect friends to call my vehicle ugly if I bought one? Yes. I have been leasing my vehicles and my current lease is up in January 2014 and at that point I either a) buy the vehicle I am driving b ) turn it in and go to Jeep or Chevy or c) turn it in and get a little pinched off narrow windowed bubble. I can't afford nor do I need a larger SUV so that sort of takes the Explorer out of the picture. I'm guessing by then the Edge will either be history or just a larger version of the Kuga with the same styling so what is the point? If I want to stay with Ford and I decide to go with a new vehicle when my lease is up this is probably what I will end up with. For my needs and wants Ford doesn't really offer anything else. This is it.

 

I know some will reply get lost and go to another brand. That seems to be what most people say here if you criticize Ford or any of their new products. But I like Ford too much to do that... I'd probably hate driving another brand more then I would hate driving this new Kuga, but for the record it is an ugly copy of everything else on the market. Did AMC sell Pacers to people who thought they were ugly because they were AMC people? You bet they did. DId GM sell Aztecs to people that thought they were ugly because they liked GM and the vehicle fit their need? Sure they did. I know of a person who owned an Aztec and laughed about how ugly it was, but it fit their needs and he was a GM person.

 

The good thing is that vehicles go through design cycles and so will this. Although it may take 10 years before we ever see a completely new one again I actually see the next one getting larger windows and a straighter roofline. I guess that depends on what the competition does. Ford is copying a look that is already several years old, so I assume in the next 3-4 years we will start to see a new direction in small CUVs and whatever it is Ford will eventually get around to copying.

Edited November 13, 2011 by 2005Explorer

[silvrsvt]

Global sales of Kuga vs. Domestic sales of the Escape, which is a higher number?

 

For September Ford sold 24,699 Escapes world-wide. They sold 6,436 Kuga. Yes, clearly it makes sense to ignore the domestic market and focus on the ROW for this product type.

 

So Ford sells huge numbers of F-150s in the USA vs Rangers (that are sold around the world)...

 

Not to mention that the CR-V, RAV-4, etc etc all are the same around the world....and sell in numbers like the Escape does in the USA.

 

I don't think the new Escape styling direction is going to kill sales one bit...its just a huge change to what people are used too.

 

 

 

 

[silvrsvt]

The good thing is that vehicles go through design cycles and so will this. Although it may take 10 years before we ever see a completely new one again I actually see the next one getting larger windows and a straighter roofline. I guess that depends on what the competition does. Ford is copying a look that is already several years old, so I assume in the next 3-4 years we will start to see a new direction in small CUVs and whatever it is Ford will eventually get around to copying.

 

The Kuga has been on the market since 2008 and the new Kuga/Escape is update update of that car....this isn't Ford copying etc...its about bringing its styling direction in line around the world.

 

 

 

 

[silvrsvt]

The good thing is that vehicles go through design cycles and so will this. Although it may take 10 years before we ever see a completely new one again I actually see the next one getting larger windows and a straighter roofline. I guess that depends on what the competition does. Ford is copying a look that is already several years old, so I assume in the next 3-4 years we will start to see a new direction in small CUVs and whatever it is Ford will eventually get around to copying.

 

The Kuga has been on the market since 2008 and the new Kuga/Escape is update update of that car....this isn't Ford copying etc...its about bringing its styling direction in line around the world.

 

 

 

 

[sullynd]

Not to mention that the CR-V, RAV-4, etc etc all are the same around the world....and sell in numbers like the Escape does in the USA.

 

There are different versions of the RAV4 around the world.

 

http://www.toyota.co.uk/cgi-bin/toyota/bv/frame_start.jsp?id=CC2-RAV4-landing

Edited November 13, 2011 by sullynd

[BrewfanGRB]

Exactly. the title is WRONG. Spring of 2012 does not mean it's a 2012 model.

 

How many threads on this board have it correctly listed as a 2013?

 

Don't have a cow Brewfan, I was just pointing out how the mistake could be made.

 

I'm not having a cow. First of all, I know perfectly well that "Spring of 2012" doesn't mean a 2012 model. I know I wondered if I was being stupid in asking, but you're treading perilously close to being an outright asshole. My only question was to confirm if this was a 2013 model, as I had understood it to be that way, but was now seeing conflicting information. Why is it so hard to understand the reason I asked a question? I couldn't care less HOW the mistake is made--that's the OP problem. I was only trying to figure out if it WAS a mistake. JFC.

Edited November 13, 2011 by BrewfanGRB

[2005Explorer]

The Kuga has been on the market since 2008 and the new Kuga/Escape is update update of that car....this isn't Ford copying etc...its about bringing its styling direction in line around the world.

 

I can understand why Ford of Europe was tasked with being the designer of the Fiesta and Focus because their biggest small car market is Europe. That makes sense to me. With small SUVs their biggest market is North America so it is interesting that they left it up to Europeans to design a model for us here in North America. It will be interesting to see how it does compared to more home grown designs.

 

What is Dearborn left designing? I assume just the pickups, full sized cars, full sized SUV/CUVs. Everything else is coming straight from Ford of Europe and I guess with the small cars that is fine, but one has to assume we as Americans have the same tastes as Europeans. It will be interesting to see. So far it has worked fine with the smaller Fiesta and Focus, but as we start to move into the bigger vehicles it will be interesting to see what we get when Ford of Europe does all the designs for us.

 

Global sales of Kuga vs. Domestic sales of the Escape, which is a higher number?

 

For September Ford sold 24,699 Escapes world-wide. They sold 6,436 Kuga. Yes, clearly it makes sense to ignore the domestic market and focus on the ROW for this product type.

 

Well you would think by those numbers in the compact SUV category North America is by far their most important market in this segment, but I guess we are wrong. Europe must be more important in the compact SUV category since they are designing the new one for us. It just seems funny to me.

Edited November 13, 2011 by 2005Explorer

[BrewfanGRB]

One of the best vehicles I have ever owned and I like the style. I'm not a prissy little metrosexual urban boy that wears Birkenstocks while I sip on my latte carrying my man purse over my shoulder. Sorry. That's not me.

 

It's still a small, relatively low-powered SUV. You seem to be trying awfully hard to convince us of your masculinity, for some reason. If you're so convinced that what you drive positively correlates to how much of a man you are, why aren't you driving an F350? Sorry, when I see the Escape (even though I like it and if it had a few more advanced features, I'd drive it), I don't think "Now, that's a vehicle for a MAN!" Jeesh. :shades:

Edited November 13, 2011 by BrewfanGRB

[stpatrick90]

There are different versions of the RAV4 around the world.

 

http://www.toyota.co...C2-RAV4-landing

 

There are two versions of the RAV4 worldwide a LWB and SWB version (with less than 4 inches of difference). The SWB version is only available in Japan and Europe. The LWB is available in North America, South America, Australia, and also available in Japan as the Vanguard. The two versions share the same mechanical bits and even a lot of sheet metal (for example they share the same doors).

Also the CR-V is the same all around the world. Additionally the coming CX-5 will be the same around the world.

Edited November 13, 2011 by stpatrick90

[akirby]

I can understand why Ford of Europe was tasked with being the designer of the Fiesta and Focus because their biggest small car market is Europe. That makes sense to me. With small SUVs their biggest market is North America so it is interesting that they left it up to Europeans to design a model for us here in North America. It will be interesting to see how it does compared to more home grown designs.

 

What is Dearborn left designing? I assume just the pickups, full sized cars, full sized SUV/CUVs. Everything else is coming straight from Ford of Europe and I guess with the small cars that is fine, but one has to assume we as Americans have the same tastes as Europeans. It will be interesting to see. So far it has worked fine with the smaller Fiesta and Focus, but as we start to move into the bigger vehicles it will be interesting to see what we get when Ford of Europe does all the designs for us.

 

 

 

Well you would think by those numbers in the compact SUV category North America is by far their most important market in this segment, but I guess we are wrong. Europe must be more important in the compact SUV category since they are designing the new one for us. It just seems funny to me.

 

They're designing the new one because it's on the C platform like the Focus and C-Max and shares a lot with those vehicles.

 

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it wrong.

 

BTW - the Fusion is being designed in Detroit not Europe.

[2005Explorer]

They're designing the new one because it's on the C platform like the Focus and C-Max and shares a lot with those vehicles.

 

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it wrong.

 

BTW - the Fusion is being designed in Detroit not Europe.

 

Isn't the Fusion actually going to be a re-badged Mondeo? I don't think Detroit is going to have that much to do with it. Maybe the Lincoln version.

 

It's still a small, relatively low-powered SUV. You seem to be trying awfully hard to convince us of your masculinity, for some reason. If you're so convinced that what you drive positively correlates to how much of a man you are, why aren't you driving an F350? Sorry, when I see the Escape (even though I like it and if it had a few more advanced features, I'd drive it), I don't think "Now, that's a vehicle for a MAN!" Jeesh. :shades:

 

It's nothing to do with masculinity it's about the outdoors and where you live. I don't live in metro like you might. I took this picture off my back deck a few minutes ago. Now do some people like to drive a vehicle that fits in where they live? Yes. Metro people have gotten their vehicles and we all agree how important it is to keep them happy because they are fussy about styling. All I am saying is there are people who live in other places in this world and not just the concrete jungle. Do I think the more formal SUV styling looks more at home up in the mountains? Yes. Disagree and say it doesn't matter, but then why is it so important to cater to urban people, but not anyone else?

 

I know my Escape isn't an F-350 and I can't afford an F-350 if I wanted one... If I was going to buy a pickup it would be an F-150, but even those use more fuel and are too big. I just like the fact that the current Escape is a cute little truck and looks like a baby brother of the big Ford trucks. You might hate that fact and hate the Ford truck styling, but since Ford does sell a few F-Series in North America someone must like it.

Edited November 13, 2011 by 2005Explorer

[ANTAUS]

I totally understand where 2005Explorer is coming from...I have a friend who was in the market for a 4x4 small ute and I mentioned the new Escape and when he saw it was being watered down into what he called "Another city car", then it turned him off from it. He wanted to do a Cherokee because he said it was "capable" and I'm essentially describing Unibody/BOF, Old Explorer, new one, etc. And they were just no convincing. He ended up with a Wrangler, and to think he hates Chrysler. He just said not many people made "capable" vehicles that would work up in area.

 

I mean you will have people that no matter how good the 4x4 system might be, if it's wrapped around in minivan skin, there's no way your going to convince them.

 

Now the opposite extent of the argument is, we've seen other Automakers have 2 distinct vehicles to cater to this market. Nissan has the Xterra (dying from slow sales), and Pathfinder (once a beloved choice in the early 90s), and its just not working much for them. they've taken the Pathfinder from Unibody to BOF and Nope that wasn't it either. Sometimes the products lose themselves in transitions and automakers risk the chance of alientating current customers, or attracting new ones. I personally believe in covering your basis provided you are making a profit.

[stpatrick90]

Isn't the Fusion actually going to be a re-badged Mondeo? I don't think Detroit is going to have that much to do with it. Maybe the Lincoln version.

 

 

 

It's nothing to do with masculinity it's about the outdoors and where you live. I don't live in metro like you might. I took this picture off my back deck a few minutes ago. Now do some people like to drive a vehicle that fits in where they live? Yes. Metro people have gotten their vehicles and we all agree how important it is to keep them happy because they are fussy about styling. All I am saying is there are people who live in other places in this world and not just the concrete jungle. Do I think the more formal SUV styling looks more at home up in the mountains? Yes. Disagree and say it doesn't matter, but then why is it so important to cater to urban people, but not anyone else?

 

I know my Escape isn't an F-350 and I can't afford an F-350 if I wanted one... If I was going to buy a pickup it would be an F-150, but even those use more fuel and are too big. I just like the fact that the current Escape is a cute little truck and looks like a baby brother of the big Ford trucks. You might hate that fact and hate the Ford truck styling, but since Ford does sell a few F-Series in North America someone must like it.

 

They're fussy, what does that make you?

 

Also I live in the country (my nearest "neighbor" lives about 2 miles away) and I have owned many vehicles you would call metro including the new Explorer and I have to say that never once has it crossed my mind that they look out of place.

Edited November 13, 2011 by stpatrick90

[akirby]

Isn't the Fusion actually going to be a re-badged Mondeo? I don't think Detroit is going to have that much to do with it.

 

You think wrong. Again.

[BrewfanGRB]

Isn't the Fusion actually going to be a re-badged Mondeo? I don't think Detroit is going to have that much to do with it. Maybe the Lincoln version.

 

 

 

It's nothing to do with masculinity it's about the outdoors and where you live. I don't live in metro like you might. I took this picture off my back deck a few minutes ago. Now do some people like to drive a vehicle that fits in where they live? Yes. Metro people have gotten their vehicles and we all agree how important it is to keep them happy because they are fussy about styling. All I am saying is there are people who live in other places in this world and not just the concrete jungle. Do I think the more formal SUV styling looks more at home up in the mountains? Yes. Disagree and say it doesn't matter, but then why is it so important to cater to urban people, but not anyone else?

 

I know my Escape isn't an F-350 and I can't afford an F-350 if I wanted one... If I was going to buy a pickup it would be an F-150, but even those use more fuel and are too big. I just like the fact that the current Escape is a cute little truck and looks like a baby brother of the big Ford trucks. You might hate that fact and hate the Ford truck styling, but since Ford does sell a few F-Series in North America someone must like it.

 

First, I live in "rural small town" of 5000. Typical small town Wisconsin. I grew up in the country. Know all about driving across fields, down trails to get to cabins. As far as "catering to urban people", that's where the people live. Again, what we've repeatedly tried to point out: You have all the right in the world to not like the new Escape. But you're taking it personally---"Ford is a terrible company because it's not selling a vehicle *I* like". Nonsense. It needs to sell vehicles the most people will buy. Either you're being intransigent on this to be difficult or you simply don't get it. As for masculinity, of course that's what it's about--YOU brought it up: "I'm not a prissy little metrosexual urban boy that wears Birkenstocks while I sip on my latte carrying my man purse over my shoulder." which very clearly says any one who buys a new Escape is a "prissy little metrosexual". Yeah, you're a real tough guy...because you drive a little, girly SUV and cover it up because it "looks like a truck". Nice try.

 

Second, where did I EVER (EVER?!) say "hate the Ford truck styling?" I LOVE the F-series. I have no real issue with the Escape...but the point is, it needs to evolve and people that know more than you or I will ever know are the ones that have studied what the market wants/likes. It might hurt your feelings, but you're not the market. Your INDIVIDUAL desires aren't a deciding factor. Just because the Escape sells what it does now doesn't mean it won't sell more after the re-design or create a greater profit even if sales are lower.

 

**I'm saying this in almost every thread: The only thing that matters is PROFIT. It's the only reason for Ford to exist. They are not the Salvation Army vehicle manufacturer.

Edited November 13, 2011 by BrewfanGRB

[jpd80]

What is Dearborn left designing? I assume just the pickups, full sized cars, full sized SUV/CUVs. Everything else is coming straight from Ford of Europe and I guess with the small cars that is fine, but one has to assume we as Americans have the same tastes as Europeans. It will be interesting to see. So far it has worked fine with the smaller Fiesta and Focus, but as we start to move into the bigger vehicles it will be interesting to see what we get when Ford of Europe does all the designs for us.

What, you think FoE just develops smaller vehicles in isolation and than just throws them at the US market?

 

Noooo, that didn't work in the past and is the reason why Ford now insists that all stakeholders

be in at the start of the project to capture the right products under a suitable envelope.

 

As said by others above, Fusion and MKZ are both being developed by FNA, not FoE

but my major concern is FoE developing the next Edge, that is a crucial product but

I understand why it needs to be global as it will fill a lot of international markets with

a good mid sized crossover...

Edited November 13, 2011 by jpd80

[2005Explorer]

You think wrong. Again.

 

So they are going to be shipping an American car to Europe to be the Mondeo replacement? That will be interesting.

 

What, you think FoE just develops smaller vehicles in isolation and than just throws them at the US market?

 

The Escape replacement is a face lifted and mid cycle enhanced Kuga. Right? Other then making a few safety changes and possibly different power train options that is what it is. right? Or is it something different then what they are getting on the other side of the ocean? You all give me a hard time for pretending that the current Escape is something it isn't, well let's not pretend the Escape replacement is some American designed CUV. It's not. I can only hope they get rid of some of the quirky controls, etc. that have shown up on other European designed Ford products, however I bet part for part it is almost the same as the next Kuga.

 

I wouldn't really have any issue with the Escape replacement if it had a little flatter roofline, better visibility and didn't have the nose right off of a Focus. Yes I know it is basically a Focus wagon, but still they could have done a little something different to it. Oh well there is always facelift time to fix it up a bit and give it some personal identity.

 

but my major concern is FoE developing the next Edge, that is a crucial product but

I understand why it needs to be global as it will fill a lot of international markets with

a good mid sized crossover...

 

If your not concerned about the Escape replacement then you should not be concerned about the Edge replacement coming from FoE.

 

First, I live in "rural small town" of 5000. Typical small town Wisconsin. I grew up in the country. Know all about driving across fields, down trails to get to cabins. As far as "catering to urban people", that's where the people live. Again, what we've repeatedly tried to point out: You have all the right in the world to not like the new Escape. But you're taking it personally---"Ford is a terrible company because it's not selling a vehicle *I* like". Nonsense. It needs to sell vehicles the most people will buy.

 

Are you buying one?

Edited November 13, 2011 by 2005Explorer

[akirby]

So they are going to be shipping an American car to Europe to be the Mondeo replacement? That will be interesting.

 

No. Detroit has the design lead for the CD4 vehicles (Fusion, Mondeo and MKZ). The Fusion and MKZ will be made in North America and the Mondeo will be made and sold in Europe.

 

You said it was designed by Europe because it was just a rebadged Mondeo and you're totally wrong.

 

You just don't understand how this Global Ford concept really works, do you?

[PREMiERdrum]

Note to self: Avoid BON the day the new Escape is unveiled, as the bitching and moaning around here will reach epic proportions.

 

Seriously, though, I'll opine that, as a current-gen Escape owner, the new one is looking good to me. If it's as aggressive as the Vertek concept it certainly should look plenty masculine without the dated, late-90's boxy look it has now. Count me down as one who owns one and will absolutely consider the new one when the time comes.

[BrewfanGRB]

Are you buying one?

 

I might. By the time I am ready for my next vehicle, the re-designed Escape AND Fusion will be available. The Escape, Fusion and a used MKZ (since I can't really afford a new MKZ) will be the top 3 vehicles I consider. Maybe I'll be unhappy about the interior controls or their ergonomics, or the exterior might be too CR-V-y for me, but unlike you, I won't make that decision until the actual vehicle is shown and available for review and purchase. That's been my point all along. I really do want something with increased ride height, with AWD and utility for light towing/cargo. But I can't make those judgments today based on a camo'd picture. :shrug:

Edited November 14, 2011 by BrewfanGRB

[2005Explorer]

Note to self: Avoid BON the day the new Escape is unveiled, as the bitching and moaning around here will reach epic proportions.

 

Seriously, though, I'll opine that, as a current-gen Escape owner, the new one is looking good to me. If it's as aggressive as the Vertek concept it certainly should look plenty masculine without the dated, late-90's boxy look it has now. Count me down as one who owns one and will absolutely consider the new one when the time comes.

 

I will consider the new one when the time comes, but I will never think it is a handsome, good looking vehicle. I don't think it looks nearly aggressive as the Vertek, however I have never seen a production vehicle that wasn't watered down from it's concept.

 

The boxy look isn't from the 90's. It's from the 60's. LOL Pretty much every two box SUV design traces it's roots back to the '63 Wagoneer. I don't see the boxy SUV look as dated and can promise it will come around again. I mean the Flex is boxy... but is it dated? The current Escape is dated because it has only been updated once in 10 years, but I would argue the classic SUV look is not dated.

 

Radical designs don't always age well. The 1996 Taurus design hasn't aged well and it was considered very radical at the time. Now compare for example a mint condition 1996 Taurus Wagon compared to a 1996 Jeep Cherokee. If both were still in mint condition which one is still attractive today? I doubt many would say the Taurus.

 

I don't doubt it will be a nice vehicle and will probably have some nice cool features. I just think it is funny that the people who love the new design won't admit how similar it is to everything else on the market. It is funny that copying in the small SUV category is the right thing to do, but imagine if Ford built the Mustang into a copy of the Camaro? If anyone has read what I said earlier I have never said I wouldn't consider it as a replacement when my lease is up if I decide to turn-in my current Escape. All I have said is I think the styling stinks with a side profile right off the Asian CUVs and a front end right off the Focus.

 

Anyhow I'm done talking about the crappy styling. Let's see how great the specs are on release day. I'm still interested as heck to see if it is going to have the PowerShift from the Focus or not. Here is hoping for a conventional automatic. Also one other thing Ford could do to make me a little more interested in it is have the Terrain Management System from the Explorer in it. Hopefully if and when I ever buy one MFT will also have moved out of it's beta status and truly be the world class infotainment system that it could be.