Bob Rosadini Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Ok...now that is cool.... Very nice-and in the meantime April was best van month since 1987! This Quigley option just opens up another new market segment- wonder what the $$ are?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpd80 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Very nice-and in the meantime April was best van month since 1987! This Quigley option just opens up another new market segment- wonder what the $$ are?? Not sure but the website says they're working on 4x4 versions of all three power trains, very exciting news. the more after market modifiers embrace Transit the bigger the market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Here is a cool clip of "Red", the Quigley Transit 150 4X4 in action... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Meanwhile....back to topic....the 2016 F-650/750 configurator is now on-line....http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/2016/configurator/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fordmantpw Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 This should get NLPRacing's blood flowing! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Meanwhile....back to topic....the 2016 F-650/750 configurator is now on-line.... http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/2016/configurator/ Well one thing it clearly states- The 37,000 lb pkg survived and with it the mandatory 14,000 lb front axle. Talk about confidence! that is a class 8 rating with an engine that was developed for let's face it- class 2-5 as the primary market. The warranty package says a lot for Ford's faith in this motor. Now if any Ford marketing types are listening, nice little "icons". You show icons that are configured as tractors (pulling tandem trailers at that) but when you click on that icon, no tractor info comes up. Why not just have a tractor icon? And next logical question, what about a GCW rating? Don't mean to be negative, but WHY does stuff like this get out? Does anyone give a S--t? Just when I get my hopes up that we are not going to be embarrassed, stuff like this gets out. No flames please. I'm just as loyal as anyone here. I just hate to see half assed effort. And if I'm not using this "configurator" correctly, please help me out- I just can't get anything other than use (icons), cab style, and engine-gas or diesel. Oh yeah- dealer choice comes up. Using my zip code of the five dealers that came up, only one was a Business Preferred ( last time I looked) and none of the others were ever listed as Cummins qualified-translation-"we don't do big trucks". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Well one thing it clearly states- The 37,000 lb pkg survived and with it the mandatory 14,000 lb front axle. Talk about confidence! that is a class 8 rating with an engine that was developed for let's face it- class 2-5 as the primary market. The warranty package says a lot for Ford's faith in this motor. Now if any Ford marketing types are listening, nice little "icons". You show icons that are configured as tractors (pulling tandem trailers at that) but when you click on that icon, no tractor info comes up. Why not just have a tractor icon? And next logical question, what about a GCW rating? Don't mean to be negative, but WHY does stuff like this get out? Does anyone give a S--t? Just when I get my hopes up that we are not going to be embarrassed, stuff like this gets out. No flames please. I'm just as loyal as anyone here. I just hate to see half assed effort. And if I'm not using this "configurator" correctly, please help me out- I just can't get anything other than use (icons), cab style, and engine-gas or diesel. Oh yeah- dealer choice comes up. Using my zip code of the five dealers that came up, only one was a Business Preferred ( last time I looked) and none of the others were ever listed as Cummins qualified-translation-"we don't do big trucks". Well I'll eat crow on the "tractor" bit. After you click on use (I went back and selected "refrig." I then clicked the "truck" box and tractor came up. You then get a picture of a tractor puling a box (didn't notice if it was a "refer") But under rating, NO GCW-just GVW! I then clicked on dealers and 25 car dealers came up! By the way just for yuks I went to Fleet ford site. guess what- No 2016 info- do these guys talk to one another? Also using Fleet Fords dealer selector and my zip-same as in the "configurator" and selecting Business Preffered and Cummins as two qualifiers, 3 dealers came up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pictor Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Did get the Tractors you need to select the right vocation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 No GCW rating? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 No GCW rating? Speaks volumes doesn't it about the people getting my stockholder money to put this stuff together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 This vehicle's not even in production yet. Why don't you call a local Ford dealership and find out if Ford's even certified the GCWR--which I can't imagine will differ appreciably from the previous model, given that the frame is, AFAIK, almost identical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 This vehicle's not even in production yet. Why don't you call a local Ford dealership and find out if Ford's even certified the GCWR--which I can't imagine will differ appreciably from the previous model, given that the frame is, AFAIK, almost identical. Guess what Richard-I have NEVER found a GCW figure published. and I have an F-750 Tractor cut sheet-yes specifically says "tractor" and it does not post a GCW. I'm too lazy to go dig it out but I believe it was a 2012 or 2013 print date. By the way while I was in the Fleet-Ford site I confirmed Job 1 date- still 7/13. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Well, I guess that means you can haul the moon, if you can figure out how to put a gooseneck hitch on it. Have you asked any Ford commercial truck reps for that info? I mean, clearly, there's a max GCWR for warranty purposes if nothing else, and you'd think that the GCWR matrix just got a lot simpler (reduced basically to the type of brakes and the rear axle ratio, I would think). Edited May 6, 2015 by RichardJensen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Guess what Richard-I have NEVER found a GCW figure published. and I have an F-750 Tractor cut sheet-yes specifically says "tractor" and it does not post a GCW. I'm too lazy to go dig it out but I believe it was a 2012 or 2013 print date. By the way while I was in the Fleet-Ford site I confirmed Job 1 date- still 7/13. Bob, there are many variables to GCW that it would seem foolish to post them as "set in stone". GVW, now that is a constant that can be measured and calculated, this is from an insurance industry website that defines GCW for insurance companies, as follows: gross combination weight (GCW) The value specified by the manufacturer as the maximum loaded weight of a truck/tractor plus the trailer or semitrailer designed for use with the truck tractor. In the absence of a value specified by the manufacturer, GCW will be determined by adding the gross vehicle weight (GVW) of the power unit and the total weight of the towed unit and any load thereon. Does that make sense to the "whats the GCW" crowd as to why Ford doesn't publish GCW ratings? Edited May 6, 2015 by twintornados Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Well, I guess that means you can haul the moon, if you can figure out how to put a gooseneck hitch on it. Have you asked any Ford commercial truck reps for that info? I mean, clearly, there's a max GCWR for warranty purposes if nothing else, and you'd think that the GCWR matrix just got a lot simpler (reduced basically to the type of brakes and the rear axle ratio, I would think). Richard- Forget about "gooseneck" applications-that is for the "horsey" crowd with their 350-550's. they have pitched this thing as a "tractor". To me that means typical fifth wheel application for conventional trailers. As to how a GCW is arrived at, I would say you are correct with respect to the brakes, axles of the tractor-to that add engine capability and of course tire size. Ratings are determined byn the weakest link in the chain. for example if you had a rear axle with a 23,000 rating-but for some foolish reason you elected to put tires that had a load rating of say 5000 lbs, your rating becomes 20,000. You effectively derated the axle with a bad tire choice-same applies to spring rating etc. Bob, there are many variables to GCW that it would seem foolish to post them as "set in stone". GVW, now that is a constant that can be measured and calculated, this is from an insurance industry website that defines GCW for insurance companies, as follows: Does that make sense to the "whats the GCW" crowd as to why Ford doesn't publish GCW ratings? TT-in my book it does not. Using that definition, the GCW would be 37,000 lbs if the GVW was 37,000. To put this in perspective, I went to the "archives" and pulled out a 22 page F series (F-700 thru FT-900) with a 2/94 print date. The F-700 could be speced with a GVW of 21,000 to 37,600 lbs. The posted GCW rating for those same trucks was 60,000 lbs. The max engine in the F-700 then was a 236 HP 429 gas engine. With an "FD-1460 Diesel" (Cummins), that same F-700 became an F-800, same GVW ranges but the max GCW went to 65,000 pds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 ...TT-in my book it does not. Using that definition, the GCW would be 37,000 lbs if the GVW was 37,000. To put this in perspective, I went to the "archives" and pulled out a 22 page F series (F-700 thru FT-900) with a 2/94 print date. The F-700 could be speced with a GVW of 21,000 to 37,600 lbs. The posted GCW rating for those same trucks was 60,000 lbs. The max engine in the F-700 then was a 236 HP 429 gas engine. With an "FD-1460 Diesel" (Cummins), that same F-700 became an F-800, same GVW ranges but the max GCW went to 65,000 pds. I understand what you are saying, I was only wondering if that was why Ford no longer publishes GCW ratings.... I am looking forward to seeing these new trucks hard at work on the roads soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I understand what you are saying, I was only wondering if that was why Ford no longer publishes GCW ratings.... I am looking forward to seeing these new trucks hard at work on the roads soon. Believe me-so am I. I think they have to bring back some of their old expertise on a consultancy basis because they sure don't have the in house expertise now. If you guys could see the kind of literature they put out in the old days (such as the 22 page document I referred to), you would understand this old guys sense of frustration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7Mary3 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Ford will have to state a GCW at some point. Now I have a M2 Freightliner with a 325 h.p. 6.7L Cummins and Allison MD3060. It was spec'ed with a non-CDL GVW of 25,999 lbs., and has a GCW of 50,000 lbs. (which does require a CDL if you are going to tow that much). Now that truck is a bit of a sand-bag, it really is a 30,000 lbs. truck with regards to transmission and axles. So, keeping that in mind, when I look at this new F-750, with it's Torq-Shift transmission, I wonder what the GCW will be. Compared to a 3060, the Torq-Shift seems to be about 1/2 the physical size. Sure, that's not a true indication of how strong it might be, but........ Then again, it all goes back to what the new Ford medium duty is really designed for. I have no question the powertrains offered will be more than adequate for a 26,000 lbs. box or flat. And I will bet 90% end up that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Given that you can spec the F450 up to a 40,400 GCWR, I can't imagine that the 650/750 will have a lower GCWR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 And the competition gets tougher-or should I say more confident? F'liner announced they are adding a third shift at their Mt Holly plant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twintornados Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 And the competition gets tougher-or should I say more confident? F'liner announced they are adding a third shift at their Mt Holly plant What is their GCW rating? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Rosadini Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 What is their GCW rating? Well TT-no problem-my first thought is 65,000 at least depending on power, but that is a guess. So I go to F'liner web site. If GCW's are listed anywhere, I can't find them. So I then go to Pete web site for MD. Same thing. So I'm now figuring time is passing this old guy by and there is some legal reason why GCW's are not prominently displayed. Sent a note to a guy whom is well versed on world wide heavy scene and he sent me this: Ford says: "Specific GCWR and Maximum Trailer Weight applicable to a given F-650/F-750 model depend on many variables and customer performance expectations. See your Ford dealership sales consultant for a Commercial Truck Tools (CTT) performance evaluation for a specific vehicle/trailer configuration" At any rate, Ford is still withholding info on the 2016 models. Makes no sense to me, If I'm shopping for a tractor, I know my trailer weight, and I know my cargo weights, check the box-what will your vehicle do?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Well, if Freightliner's not displaying GCWRs either, then Ford's certainly not lagging the competition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevensecondsuv Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 (edited) "...customer performance expectations" Sounds like Ford isn't willing to say it will pull x lbs worth of trailer because you (the customer) may not be satisfied with the acceleration. I grew up at the tail end of the era where hp ratings for a given class of truck really hadn't changed in about 3 decades (60s - late 90s). As such, my expectations about acceleration with a big load are vastly different than some of my slightly younger peers who are used to the extravagant amount of power that has only recently become available in trucks. For instance I still consider the 145 hp 4.9L six in my F250 to be adequate for up to about 8000 lbs trailer weight. Sure it won't go but 45 mph but that's what I expect when I hitch up that much trailer. I don't really do long distance hauling so it's no big deal to me if the trip takes an extra 5-10 minutes due to going slow. Someone who is used to their new 850 ft lb turbo diesel F250 would find my truck woefully underpowered even empty. I suspect that is what Ford is referring to. Edited May 7, 2015 by Sevensecondsuv 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lfeg Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 If you are going to market a tractor, GCWR is a key thing. Buyers are pretty savvy in this market, and both GVWR and GCWR determine if the truck is up to the job. No GCWR in the sales literature for the tractor market is like saying to the market for the Mustang GT that we will not tell you the hp ratings. Things like that are just not acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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