jasonj80 Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Shopping around for a partner.. cash crunch is coming?http://ca.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idCAKBN0OI0C220150602 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 If all of that is true, it sounds like they're in worse shape than we (or at least I) thought - I mean if they were putting off the redesign of one or two fringe products (say, Challenger for example), or even one or two core products in order for it to result in an overall better product, that'd be one thing. But this sounds like the entire lineup is being pushed back in an attempt to kick the expenditure can down the road until they can (hopefully) merge with someone. And if they're in that bad of shape, I don't see anyone having any desire to merge - buy off a piece such as Jeep? Maybe - but merge? No wonder Marchionne sounds so desperate... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akirby Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 How is that possible given their record sales increases over the last 3 years? (yes, that's a rhetorical question) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 (edited) Look at the original 5 year plan. Every vehicle was delayed on that as well (some never even made it to production). This is nothing new for Chrysler and one of the risks they take with publishing their plans years in advance. For enthusiasts it's great....but for Chrysler, it would probably be best if they didn't...since they have yet to meet the timeline of the plans in a timely manner. Take a look at the Chrysler Brand Plan from 2009 (below): Results of that plan: There still is no small car or compact sedan. The 200 came in 2014, not 2013 (a year late). No midsize crossover and the T&C is still not here 2 years after it was supposed to show up. This is nothing new. Edited June 2, 2015 by Intrepidatious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
630land Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Record sales for Jeep and Ram, but the rental fleet sales are "record" too. Chrysler Sebrings/200's are now popular as 'low credit score' used cars. If they do "merge", I predict the Chrysler and Dodge brands to die off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 That may be true, Intrepidatious, but with the seeming desperation of Marchionne to merge with someone, it seems different this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Record sales for Jeep and Ram, but the rental fleet sales are "record" too. Chrysler Sebrings/200's are now popular as 'low credit score' used cars. If they do "merge", I predict the Chrysler and Dodge brands to die off. What are the rental fleet sales percentages this month per model? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 That may be true, Intrepidatious, but with the seeming desperation of Marchionne to merge with someone, it seems different this time. Oh, I have no doubt that there are issues going on. But, honestly, vehicle delays and cancellations are nothing new for any company. They are just way more public when you have published dates beforehand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardJensen Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 At the same time, FCA is accelerating development of certain vehicles. The Alfa Romeo brand may be getting more models on a faster schedule than originally planned, suppliers told Reuters. O M G (tosses hands in air, wanders off mumbling to himself) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Oh, I have no doubt that there are issues going on. But, honestly, vehicle delays and cancellations are nothing new for any company. They are just way more public when you have published dates beforehand. I suppose that's true - just everything is in the open. But when it's the entire lineup that's getting pushed back... --- And didn't you know Alfa is going to take over the world, Richard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 O M G (tosses hands in air, wanders off mumbling to himself) What's worse, this or Caddilac trying to turn themselves into BMW or MB and alienating everyone in the process? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 The Dodge Dart and Dodge Journey now won't get a complete redesign until 2019? That's not a good move, no matter how it's being spun. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Marchionne says consolidation in the auto industry is inevitable, because automakers are burning capital investing in overlapping engines and vehicles. I may be wrong here but I feel like this is a problem for FCA, created by them and they don't know what to do about it At the same time, FCA is accelerating development of certain vehicles. The Alfa Romeo brand may be getting more models on a faster schedule than originally planned, suppliers told Reuters. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Yet their most profitable models in RAM and Jeep will be left to die on the vine Since Marchionne came out with his plan, at least 12 future vehicle programs have been delayed at Jeep, Ram, Dodge, Chrysler and Maserati, in some cases by a year or more, suppliers said. FCA declined to comment on specific delays. The product plan outlined to investors in 2014 was "a five-year snapshot of our plans," the company said in a statement to Reuters. Holy backpedal batman! The company has postponed a full redesign of the Dart and the Dodge Journey crossover, both of which had been scheduled for mid-2016. Instead, both models will get a mild makeover, but may not be fully overhauled until 2019-2020, suppliers said. Dart, OK fine, not a huge deal, its still in its first generation but Journey getting delayed? OOF. Nearly every outlet I've seen review it has a very hard time finding anything good to say about it to begin with, they might as well kill it now and be done with it. Plans to offer new full-size and mid-size crossover models under the Chrysler brand in 2017 and 2018, respectively, appear to have been postponed or shelved, suppliers said. And this is supposed to be your volume brand? good luck with that one! A major redesign of FCA's full-size Chrysler 300, Dodge Charger and Dodge Challenger, originally slated for mid- to late 2018, could slip to 2019 or later, suppliers said. Rental fleets need large cars too, that's the only way they will be able to sell them by that point with as much as the large sedan market has already shrunk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 The Dodge Dart and Dodge Journey now won't get a complete redesign until 2019? That's not a good move, no matter how it's being spun. like I said in my post, holding off on the Dart redesign probably isn't the end of the world since its still a fairly new model they might as well kill Journey at this point, its already vastly overdue for a redesign and falling farther and farther behind with every new model year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bzcat Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 (edited) You don't put your most profitable programs on hold while perusing a merger. You put the least profitable programs on ice and hope to write it off right after the merger. This whole delaying programs for possible merger is a smokescreen. FCA's cash position must be in really bad shape. Edited June 2, 2015 by bzcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 You don't put your most profitable programs on hold while perusing a merger. You put the least profitable programs on ice. This whole delaying programs for possible merger is a smokescreen. FCA's cash position must be in really bad shape. Exactly. When you're trying to entice another company for a hookup, you want to show them your latest and greatest, only showing the less obvious and back of house stuff. Dumping more cash into Alfa's return while the volume products are delayed... That's not good. "Well, the basement walls are caving in and the toilet leaks, but we'll fix that stuff eventually. Look at this new Tiffany lamp!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blazerdude20 Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Good lord! This is Daimler part 2. Sadly I don't think chryco will make it out alive this time around. I'll bet someone like Toyota or Geely picks up FCA in the next two years. Killing off Chrysler and Dodge so they can have Ram and Jeep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj80 Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 Exactly. When you're trying to entice another company for a hookup, you want to show them your latest and greatest, only showing the less obvious and back of house stuff. Dumping more cash into Alfa's return while the volume products are delayed... That's not good. "Well, the basement walls are caving in and the toilet leaks, but we'll fix that stuff eventually. Look at this new Tiffany lamp!" My theory, he's getting the balance sheet good to break up the company. They dumped the 100K warrantee, potential suitors don't have higher legacy issues. He dumps money into Alfa to make it worth something in the breakup; fresh product line and pull some stuff from the Daimler days play book use Jeep/Ram(dodge) money to redo your product line. Ferrari is already being spun off, Ferrari comes in and picks up Alfa/Maserati you know as a good Italian to save those brands and keep those jobs in Italy and win approval from the Italian Government. You now have Alfa with a full product line financed by Chrysler. You then have your new niche market of Alfa/Maserati/Ferrari. Jeep gets picked up by Ford/GM/VW. Chrysler/Dodge go to the Chinese or die. RAM stays and goes to CHN, though that all might be sold to a VW/MB/Toyota/Hyundai or GM though GM would have to sell Ram Pickups to someone (Nissan/VW/Hyundai/Toyota) but would help GM in the Commercial market where they have no product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I said in a previous post, I'd see Ram going to one of the Japanese or Korean brands that have tried/failed or are wanting to get into the US truck market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Hatter Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I said in a previous post, I'd see Ram going to one of the Japanese or Korean brands that have tried/failed or are wanting to get into the US truck market. I've thought much the same. Establishing the generic "Ram" brand only facilitates a third party purchase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fgts Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I may be wrong here but I feel like this is a problem for FCA, created by them and they don't know what to do about it HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Yet their most profitable models in RAM and Jeep will be left to die on the vine Holy backpedal batman! Dart, OK fine, not a huge deal, its still in its first generation but Journey getting delayed? OOF. Nearly every outlet I've seen review it has a very hard time finding anything good to say about it to begin with, they might as well kill it now and be done with it. And this is supposed to be your volume brand? good luck with that one! Rental fleets need large cars too, that's the only way they will be able to sell them by that point with as much as the large sedan market has already shrunk. Assume that either it's a mixture of shopping for a partner and realigning for the rest of FCA. There's rumors that the Dart and possibly Journey may end up rwd along with the AR Gutlatia ( however it's spelled), it would waste money to refresh the relatively new Dart and strong selling Journey if they're getting replaced. I don't see FCA depriving Jeep and Ram at all. And Kill off the fullsize cars?. Kill off the midsize car market because they don't sell over 400k like they use to... Because a market shrinking don't automatically mean abandonment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I said in a previous post, I'd see Ram going to one of the Japanese or Korean brands that have tried/failed or are wanting to get into the US truck market. So we may see a Honda Ram Ridgeline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grbeck Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Jeep gets picked up by Ford/GM/VW. Ford needs to remember the "Jeep curse" and stay far, far away from that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzymoomoo Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 Assume that either it's a mixture of shopping for a partner and realigning for the rest of FCA. There's rumors that the Dart and possibly Journey may end up rwd along with the AR Gutlatia ( however it's spelled), it would waste money to refresh the relatively new Dart and strong selling Journey if they're getting replaced. I don't see FCA depriving Jeep and Ram at all. And Kill off the fullsize cars?. Kill off the midsize car market because they don't sell over 400k like they use to... Because a market shrinking don't automatically mean abandonment. I didn't say kill the full size cars, I said delaying the redesigns is not going to help them at all. Large cars need all the help they can get to sell right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I'd say in the grand scheme of things....the large cars are not as important as updating others with guaranteed volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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