Just picked up the Mrs. new 2008 Cadillac CTS

[DoubleD]

lease or purchase?

 

Lease. The Mrs likes to change her vehicles every few years, easier on the wallet this way. My F250, OTOH, will be driven till the wheels fall off, and then I'll probably bolt new ones on it.

[LincolnFan]

i have been in MKZ, CTS and a a fews older LS... CTS and MKZ are totally different CTS seems "Richer" too the feel compared to MKZ.. also way different driving dynamics RWD to FWD.. i will tell ya this, they both suck compared to the LS V8 i drove, that includes my Badge Engineered 06 Fusion lol... explain to me why ford killed the LS again?

 

Ford didn't kill it, Faguar did.

[Mark B. Morrow]

Yeah. Because we all know a different engine and front clip makes a totally different car. Just ask GM with it's 5 new CUV's. :rolleyes:

 

 

Do they even have different engines?

[rmc523]

Do they even have different engines?

 

Which, the GM CUVs? I dont think so.

[Mark B. Morrow]

I drove the original CTS-V with the manual and it was a blast. Small niche market no doubt, but a fun car.

 

I wish Lincoln has continued to improve the LS to the point where it would have been a worthy competitor. I really liked out 2000 LS.

 

I have a friend who just bought a new CTS. I found the back seat to be very cramped although the interior was nicely appointed. The LS was more comfortable. Haven't driven the MKZ yet. I will have to try it out.

 

Best wishes on the new car.

[Michael Reynolds]

Which, the GM CUVs? I dont think so.

 

The GM CUVs all use the same 3.6 V-6 engine. A V-8 is allegedly coming online sometime soon....

[Watchdevil]

Congrats on your new car.

 

I like how Caddy can get away with the 3 character crap while Lincoln gets flammed for whenever possible.

 

I'll flame both Lincoln and Caddy for the alphabet soup... No one that I personally know can keep up with what letters go with which model... And I am having a hard time myself keeping them straight. The only thing that helps me keep Cadillacs straight is the first letter which represents the model name they replaced... With Lincoln the only one that conforms that way is MKZ (Z for Zephyr). I guess I am going to have to make up names to keep the other new Lincolns straight... MKS (Salivator), MKX (X-rator)...

 

I did find Ford originally trademarked the name Aviator MKA. The Aviator was of course hastily changed to MKX... What I don't understand is why they held onto the Navigator name if they think regular names don't work or they are "so afraid" no one will recognized the brand make. They are such hypocrites...

[Deanh]

Lease. The Mrs likes to change her vehicles every few years, easier on the wallet this way. My F250, OTOH, will be driven till the wheels fall off, and then I'll probably bolt new ones on it.

I have seen some smoking lease adds....for whatever the reason the Caddy dealer down the road isn't moving much inventory, subveened leases help slow movers immensly, some people are still payment rather than product buyers, just like people buy the 0 percent NOT the product,I do like the caddy, but you shouldn't compare it w the MkZ......upcoming MkS is a more viable comparison...

Edited September 20, 2007 by Deanh

[Watchdevil]

Which brings us back to the original argument. A greenhouse and interchangeable doors does not make for a badge engineered vehicle.

 

And BTW, I'm giving you a hard time. I appreciate a debate sans bitching and name calling.

 

An alteration to rear quarter panel stampings to yield a different taillamp opening and stamping out different hood and fenders that attach to the same basic body does not make for a unique exclusive vehicle... Certainly some "upgrades" in content and materials make the MKZ more differentiated and improved over the Fusion, but not visualy that much different. We could all say they Lincoln Versailles was exclusive as it has some engineering features the Granada/Monarch did not have.

 

However Cadillac did a wonderful job back in the day masking the fact that the Seville was based on a Nova platform... Who woulda known?

 

I guess before the Crown Vic and GRANDMAquis were merged to the GRANDMArquis body shell with the thick C-pllars with no 6th window and notchback rear wndow, they were not badge engineered either...

 

There are indeed graduations of shared platform engineering...

 

The basic level is slapping a different badge on without making any other distinctions... (Dodge/Plymouth Neons)

The next level is different badges with different grilles, trim and lamps which can extends all the way to different front and rear fascias)... (Fusion/Milan, F-150/Mark LT, Edge/MKX)

The 3rd level is a basically a shared body shell with any combination of altered and shared or interchangable body parts to make them look somewhat different. (Fusion/MKZ, Crown Vic/Granny M)

The 4th level is completely different exterior designs on a shared plaform. (Taurus/MKS, Fusion/Mazda6)

 

There can be varying degrees even in between those levels...

 

I would say that the MKZ is the 3rd one....

Edited September 20, 2007 by Watchdevil

[CarShark]

There is a known NVH problem with the direct injected 3.6. Apparently it's such a fundamental design flaw GM doesn't know how to fix it.

What kind of sound is it supposed to be? Is it like a soft hissing because of the fuel spray?

[DSenstad]

I have driven all three and each step was noticable.

 

I really would have prefered to not be able to notice any difference between any of the vehicles but I did... everytime I went and drove them.

[bbf2530]

What kind of sound is it supposed to be? Is it like a soft hissing because of the fuel spray?

 

Hi CarShark. :D No, it is actually a loud tapping/ticking/rattling (pick one or more)) sound from the high pressure fuel injectors. It is considered a problematic NVH (noise, vibration, harshness) issue. GM"s engine designers are in the midst of losing a lot of sleep, as they have discovered, too late, that it is an inherent design defect. In other words, it is not an easily rectifiable defect that can be addressed with a quick fix. It seems at this point it will take a major redesign of the engine's Direct Injection system. So they must now redesign a brand new design...an expensive proposition.

 

By the way, this is widely reported information, not just my personal speculation or a biased opinion. We can only watch and wait.

Edited September 20, 2007 by bbf2530

[Michael Reynolds]

An alteration to rear quarter panel stampings to yield a different taillamp opening and stamping out different hood and fenders that attach to the same basic body does not make for a unique exclusive vehicle... Certainly some "upgrades" in content and materials make the MKZ more differentiated and improved over the Fusion, but not visualy that much different. We could all say they Lincoln Versailles was exclusive as it has some engineering features the Granada/Monarch did not have.

 

Good points. I'm not arguing that the MKZ received radical changes, but it ins't just a Fusion with a Lincoln badge on it either. I won't sit here and rehash the differences, because they are rather obvious. Having said that, am I kicking around the notion that Ford couldn't have done more? Defintely not!!! I do feel that the changes were substancial enough that everytime you walk out to jump into your MKZ you don't look at it and think god, this is nothing more than a Fusion with some wood trim inside.

 

Looking back at first gen ES' and CTS', the MKZ appears to be a solid effort........I just hope Ford builds on it.

 

And BTW is your signature long enough these days?

[Watchdevil]

And BTW is your signature long enough these days?

 

It's just slighly larger right now to annoy someone who complained about it being the size of the Ponderosa... I figured I would show something the Ponderosa looks like.

[twintornados]

And BTW is your signature long enough these days?

 

I noticed the same thing....how about some pics from your high school years too??

 

But I have to wonder why an AWD MKZ couldn't beat a RWD CTS......or should I just go back to school and try to add more letters to the alphabet

Edited September 20, 2007 by twintornados

[retro-man]

Congrats on your new car.

 

I like how Caddy can get away with the 3 character crap while Lincoln gets flammed for whenever possible.

Cadillac I understand:

- CTS = Catera Touring Sedan

- DTS = Deville Touring Sedan

- STS = Seville Touring Sedan

- ETC = Eldorado Touring Coupe

etc. etc.

 

Lincoln, the only one I can remember is the MKZ - because the Z stands for Zephyr. The upcoming one, the trucks, the ...... what else do they have? ...... oh yeah, nothing , I can't keep straight for the life of me, and I've been a Ford guy all my life.

 

Oh, and the MKZ is as different from the Fusion as the Versailles was from the Granada. No more, no less.

[rmc523]

Cadillac I understand:

- CTS = Catera Touring Sedan

- DTS = Deville Touring Sedan

- STS = Seville Touring Sedan

- ETC = Eldorado Touring Coupe

etc. etc.

 

Lincoln, the only one I can remember is the MKZ - because the Z stands for Zephyr. The upcoming one, the trucks, the ...... what else do they have? ...... oh yeah, nothing , I can't keep straight for the life of me, and I've been a Ford guy all my life.

 

Oh, and the MKZ is as different from the Fusion as the Versailles was from the Granada. No more, no less.

 

Lincoln:

MKZ - Mark Zephyr

MKS - Mark Sedan?

MKX - Mark X-over

Mark LT - Mark Luxury Truck?

then Navigator and Town Car

 

Those are my educated guesses.

[zoomerjrt]

And for the record, badge engineering is rebadging the same or modestly revised vehicle. An MKZ is far from a badge engineered Fusion, there are quite a few things different inside and out.

 

I like how this is turning into a pissing match. Humorous from both angles.

 

dont forget that great tin-foiled wrapped flat dashboard of the MKZ YUK YUK

[Michael Reynolds]

dont forget that great tin-foiled wrapped flat dashboard of the MKZ YUK YUK

 

I believe you pointed that out in another topic. Didn't agree with you then, and I'm not agreeing with you now. Thanks for playing but you LOSE!

 

If you are going to ramble on and on about it then, call out evey other manuf. that uses paint to simulate metal.

[zoomerjrt]

I believe you pointed that out in another topic. Didn't agree with you then, and I'm not agreeing with you now. Thanks for playing but you LOSE!

 

If you are going to ramble on and on about it then, call out evey other manuf. that uses paint to simulate metal.

I would call it out if there as damn ugly as the MKZ dash was.

[Michael Reynolds]

I would call it out if there as damn ugly as the MKZ dash was.

 

Ummm, and that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Still doesn't make it fact

[FordPaul]

Lincoln:

MKZ - Mark Zephyr

MKS - Mark Sedan?

MKX - Mark X-over

Mark LT - Mark Luxury Truck?

then Navigator and Town Car

 

Those are my educated guesses.

 

You are correct sir.

[Watchdevil]

Lincoln:

MKZ - Mark Zephyr

MKS - Mark Sedan?

MKX - Mark X-over

Mark LT - Mark Luxury Truck?

then Navigator and Town Car

 

Those are my educated guesses.

 

Lincoln MKY - Mark Youth... Mark Yuk?

[FordBuyer]

Ummm, and that's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Still doesn't make it fact

 

 

I think the original poster was basically on here to gloat about the new CTS and trash Lincoln. He certainly had agenda. The new CTS looks promising and I hope it does well.

[TomServo92]

I think the original poster was basically on here to gloat about the new CTS and trash Lincoln. He certainly had agenda. The new CTS looks promising and I hope it does well.

 

I've never understood that attitude. It isn't a zero-sum game. It's possible to like Lincoln and Cadillac (and any other make for that matter) at the same time. I like both the new CTS and the MKZ and look forward to seeing the MKS.