Big Al thinkking of selling Volvo

[Critic]

Volvo just appears to be getting stodgy again. Their designs are becoming dated and they are really no longer bringing anything to the table. No increased sales. No major technology innovations that Ford couldn't now handle on its own. No reputation for anything but safety.

Start targeting Women for Volvo's.

[mackinaw]

Could it outpace Mercury's growth in the US? Sure it could. Could it outpace Lincoln's growth worldwide (think Buick) if Ford had the money it currently spends on Volvo to sink into a global Lincoln instead? I doubt it.

 

If you travel overseas much, you quickly see that Lincoln has absolutely no worldwide presence. Right now, it's largely restricted (maybe entirely) to North American. Volvo has a worldwide presence and the name recognition to go with it. I just don't see why should Ford spend billions of dollars cultivating a worldwide Lincoln when they already have Volvo.

[suv_guy_19]

If you travel overseas much, you quickly see that Lincoln has absolutely no worldwide presence. Right now, it's largely restricted (maybe entirely) to North American. Volvo has a worldwide presence and the name recognition to go with it. I just don't see why should Ford spend billions of dollars cultivating a worldwide Lincoln when they already have Volvo.

 

 

Depends where you go in the world. Volvo won't have much a appeal in China and the Middle east.

[Critic]

Start targeting Tree-huggers for Volvo's

[Michael Reynolds]

Wow, for years we had so many brands, now it'll be just Ford and Lincoln...talk about falling from grace... So in other words, Lincoln is pretty much all I can choose from in the Ford brand? From what I'm seeing so far, there might not be hope for me

 

Well, I dunno if GM could do what they've done with Cadillac and still be saddled with a ton of other brands, I can only imagine what Ford would do with Lincoln.

 

Fall from grace? Nah, it's more like functioning smartly.

[FordBuyer]

Mercury is insignificant because Ford hasn't done anything major with them in a long time. They wonder why people are walking away from Mercury? It's because there are no unique products, no more Cougar, and there has been no effort on Ford's part to invest in the brand. A couple unique products and suddenly things would be looking much better.

 

Ford will make a mistake if they walk away from Mercury just like GM did with Oldsmobile; Mercury customers will take their business elsewhere.

 

Mulally may want to end Mercury, but I doubt if William Clay Jr wants to and he will have final say. Something tells me Clay Jr. won't let him. I doubt if Ford though will invest any significant money in Mercury until Ford is consistently profitable. Volvo in long run looks gone though.

[mackinaw]

Depends where you go in the world. Volvo won't have much a appeal in China and the Middle east.

 

I can't speak for the mideast, but China (and Russia) have been major growth markets for Volvo the past few years. Sales went from from zero to 35,000 units according to Automotive News.

[Michael Reynolds]

Mulally may want to end Mercury, but I doubt if William Clay Jr wants to and he will have final say. Something tells me Clay Jr. won't let him. I doubt if Ford though will invest any significant money in Mercury until Ford is consistently profitable. Volvo in long run looks gone though.

 

Makes me wonder if a quick fix from a few FoE products might help? Then again it hasn't for Saturn.....

[NickF1011]

Depends where you go in the world. Volvo won't have much a appeal in China and the Middle east.

 

Exactly. There are some places in the world that are still fascinated with the traditional American brands. Lincoln would probably do very well in Brazil also, based on the success Ford has had there.

[NickF1011]

I can't speak for the mideast, but China (and Russia) have been major growth markets for Volvo the past few years. Sales went from from zero to 35,000 units according to Automotive News.

 

The Ford brand has seen equally impressive gains in Russia and China recently with little-to-no prior presence. No reason to think Lincoln would be any different. Pretty much ALL brands are having success in emerging markets now -- at least those brands that are willing to chase after them.

[BORG]

Volvo for sale and Mercury axed? I think I made those predictions in a single posting last week

 

I will not be sad to see Volvo go. Mercury was always my standby Lincoln replacement if I ever decided to cut my car budget but wanted to stay clear of that ghastly blue oval

[Mark B. Morrow]

Start targeting Women for Volvo's.

 

 

That's targeting women? I could swear that top photo is targeting me.

[battyr]

Selling Volvo?

 

Volvo has the potential to make good large profits. It could be as successful as Audi, may be half as successful as BMW.

 

Volvo is now mostly integrated into Ford. All models are based on Ford products. Anyone who buys Volvo will be forced to purchase parts from Ford and spend major R and D redesigning all vehicles to be off their own products. When you consider that auto plants and offices have little value and that Ford will want to keep all intellectual rights, they may get very little cash for it.

 

I agree that Lincoln need to become a world wide brand, but they will have problems selling in Europe. It might be easier to sell Lincolns as re-badged Volvos in Europe.

 

I would think Ford needs to make a major change in the way they are running both Volvo and Lincoln. They need to integrate Volvo into Ford more. If Lincoln is serious about sellinng world wide then they need to share management and design with Volvo. Volvo should become a performance oriented car. Safety alone won't sell cars. It has to perform better than an Audi or at least better than an European Ford. Unless Ford is willing to make big changes with Volvo and get Volvo and Lincoln working together more, then they might as well try to sell them to the highest bidder.

 

Mercury?

 

I believe that Mercury makes good profit as is. The make more money selling Mercurys in Lincoln dealers than they would selling Fords. Don't change Mercury in the short term.

 

Long term Ford has to ask themselves, do they really want to have a division that sell in low volume in the US only? Do they really want to sell Mercury as re-badged Fords? Does it justify spending any money at all developing future Mercurys when the money can be spent improving Fords.

 

Long term, after they fix Lincoln, it might be better to creat a new division. The cars need a unique top hat. They need to sell world wide. They need to sell in Europe. They need to appeal to a completely different market, but at the same time, bring customers into Lincoln dealers. The new division could still be called Mercury, or they could kill off Mercury and reposition Volvo to become Mercury. If you bring Volvo in to replace Mercury then you would have to make major changes to Lincoln to make it upmarket to Volvo. It might work if you make Volvos as expensive small cars and Lincolns as expensive Large cars. It could means the MKZ and MKX with be replaced by Vovos? Future Volvo S80 could be replaced by RWD Lincoln? Volvos would also have to be made in Ford USA plants. Lincoln with have to tell Volvo how to market cars in the US. Volvo will have to tell Lincoln how the sell cars in Europe.

 

In any case, both Mercury and Volvo will not remain without major changes to product and marketing. I don't see both Mercuy and Volvo lasting under Ford. One of them will have to go. It might be 5 years before it happens.

[P71_CrownVic]

Volvo hasn't done much of anything recently except lose money and market share in the US.

 

Why on earth would you ditch Lincoln over Volvo? I think Lincoln would have a much better chance of penetrating emerging markets than the smallish Volvo -- sort of like the Buick expansion model. Let's not even get started on comparing Lincoln's size in North America compared to Volvo.

 

Why??? Because that is where Ford is getting all of their safety systems and "new" platforms. With Volvo's history and engineering capability, and safety record...it makes perfect sense as to keep them instead of Lincoln. What has Lincoln done for Ford in the last...5-10 years...other than give Ford a brand to rebadge their own products and sell them at outrageous prices?

 

Lincoln and Mercury have NOTHING to offer going forward...Volvo does.

[P71_CrownVic]

Volvo for sale and Mercury axed? I think I made those predictions in a single posting last week

 

And didn't you get railed for it?

[calypsocoral]

I guess this is why the big wigs make the big bucks. Decisions like these definitely aren't easy, as they will shape the future of the company forever.

 

 

Wow... somebody FINALLY SAYS IT!!!!!

 

This is what I've been trying to tell my brain-washed, fellow union workers for years now.

 

Yes, I may be in a union, but I can't imagine what it is like to make the decisions that affect thousands of jobs.

[RichardJensen]

Volvo for sale and Mercury axed? I think I made those predictions in a single posting last week

Because those were two =totally original= thoughts, right? Never seen anywhere else before, right?

 

:rolleyes:

 

Getting rid of Mercury, right now, would not be cheap and while Volvo could be sold, the market isn't likely to pay top dollar for it, given the current state of affairs.

 

In the long run Mercury might be gone and Volvo too, but as Keynes said, "in the long run we're all dead."

[TStag]

It's amazing that your all seriously contemplating getting rid of Volvo (which has twice the sales of Lincoln) and some of you want to keep Mercury. It started with Aston, next went JLR, next Volvo? How is it GM and VW can run lots of divisions yet apparantly Ford can not? Bill Ford was apparantly nervous of breaking PAG up and you can see why. All Mullaly is doing is cutting Ford's brands down, at least Ford junior weilded the axe in the right places.

[Joe771476]

It's already been said, but needs repeating: Volvo is now Ford's ONLY worldwide luxury brand! Jag and LR are gone! Lincoln has no worldwide recognition........yet! Volvo offers Ford invaluable safety technology! Volvo is a keeper! And let's get back into worldwide medium and heavy truck manufacturing!

[jobu37]

I think Mercury would be a good assignment for Jim Farley. Existing brand, existing dealer network, blank slate (some people don't even realize Mercury still exists)...I'd love to see what Farley could do with it.

I agree completely. Farley should design a marketing plan that targets Honda and Toyota owners and impress upon them the fact that the Milan and Sable both rank ahead of the Camry and Accord. Assuming they still do in the next JD Power survey. Most import buyers have never even looked at Mercury and an introduction such as this might turn the first accepters into trend setters on their block. All their neighbors would ask them why they bought a Mercury and they could start defending their purchase with an arrogant tone implying that the neighbors are idiots for not buying a Mercury since it is the highest quality non-luxury make on the market. These trendsetters could do for Mercury what they did for Toyota and Honda 10 years ago.

[donzuchowski]

I think Ford needs to sell Mercury to another buyer like form China. Ford should also sell Lincoln as well to China. I think Ford should be just on brand. I also think all car makers should just have one brand, Toyota in japan for a long time had all their cars under the toyota name, even what we called Lexus here. I brand 1 company....

[J-150]

It's amazing that your all seriously contemplating getting rid of Volvo (which has twice the sales of Lincoln) and some of you want to keep Mercury. It started with Aston, next went JLR, next Volvo? How is it GM and VW can run lots of divisions yet apparantly Ford can not? Bill Ford was apparantly nervous of breaking PAG up and you can see why. All Mullaly is doing is cutting Ford's brands down, at least Ford junior weilded the axe in the right places.

 

 

 

GM cannot run lots of divisions. That is essentially their biggest problem right now.

 

 

 

 

An VW has multiple divisons, but some are regional and others are so high end they have a regular client base.

 

Bugatti would be a bankrupt carmaker as an independent. But under VW, I question if they will ever get back the investment they made in the Veryon. Skoda and SEAT are hardly players outside of Eastern European countries where they can't afford mainstream makes like VW, Opel etc.

[NickF1011]

Why??? Because that is where Ford is getting all of their safety systems and "new" platforms. With Volvo's history and engineering capability, and safety record...it makes perfect sense as to keep them instead of Lincoln. What has Lincoln done for Ford in the last...5-10 years...other than give Ford a brand to rebadge their own products and sell them at outrageous prices?

 

Lincoln and Mercury have NOTHING to offer going forward...Volvo does.

 

Umm...the only Volvo platform that Ford is using is D3 -- which by your own estimations is a disgusting failure. EUCD, C1, etc were all fundamentally Ford or Ford/Mazda projects.

 

As for the safety systems -- you might have SOME argument there, but it's not like Ford doesn't have their own R&D doing safety research.

 

And what has Lincoln done for Ford over the past 5-10 years? Well, they've been one of the only brands in the entire portfolio that has increased in sales and, unlike Volvo, they have been consistently profitable.

[92merc]

If I had to pick between Volvo or Mercury going, it would be Volvo. But I don't think that's what will happen. Mostly because Mullaly has been pushing Ford towards a global presence and singular manufacturing. That means Volvo would be more likely to stay.

 

My problem with Volvo is where it fits in Ford corporate vs Lincoln. Volvo is more worldwide and is better known across the world. Lincoln is well known in the US, but not world wide. But to me, both of them share the similar up market luxury area of car sales. I think the better fit would be to merge the two brands. Call them a Lincoln in the US, but leave the Volvo name world wide. I'm sure some well bitch that the Lincoln will be a rebadged Volvo or vice versa. I say get over it. I'm not saying take todays Volvo's or Lincoln's. I'm saying start designing the next gen models of both with that merge in mind. Only differences may be some models in LH and RH drive for global reasons. But that's it. I think then that new Volvo 2.0 could really compete against the BMW, Accura, etc upscale market place.

 

With the above assumption, I think it then makes more sense for Mercury to stay. On some models, do some style differences much like today to make them "The alternative Ford". Give them a few minor differences that don't cost much. Personally, I've always preferred the Mercury styling over Ford in cars. Maybe throw Mercury a FOE or global Ford that won't be in the US market as a Ford. By doing that, it'll cost almost nothing to keep some sales they probably would have lost just because some won't buy a car with the Blue Oval on it. Leave it as a niche US market.

[sonofford]

Volvo sales worldwide increased in 2007 to a record number (458,323). Sales in emerging markets were strong (Russian sales rose 95% and sales rose 73% in China.) Dealerships are being added in China to keep up with the growing demand.

 

Lincoln's US sales, which is the lion's share of its volume, were 131,487 in 2007. Volvo's US sales were about 111,000, or about 85% of Lincoln's in the US. Lincoln's sales are rising while Volvo's are falling, but if international demand for Volvo products continues to grow as expected, overall sales will increase again. US sales make up only about 25% of Volvo's total and that percentage is shrinking.

 

Trying to establish Lincoln as a global luxury brand with that kind of volume would be extremely expensive. The vehicles are not competitive in Europe, and while growing the brand in China may be possible, others have been there longer, so it won't be as easy to break in as it might have been a few years ago. I don't think there is a great argument for selling Volvo right now. Its problems are not nearly as extensive as JLR's were and its potential is much greater.